Allah= Al+ilah ?

Prove Islam is from God, why it is the 'One True Religion'.
yeezevee
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Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by yeezevee »

GrupoCupda says to yeezevee
This rabbis is also Mossad agent :lol: :lol: :lol:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUrGBhbTTpg&NR=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
no..no.. this preacher is NOT Mossad agent., he is right ., whatever is the religion.. Allah is a word of "GOD" so the believers of God could use that word., Please realize Allah, the Arabic word was there before Muhammad was in LIQUID FORM., and his imaginative Allah doll was absent in Pagan community of Arabia. So that rabbi is not wrong what he is saying. I am glad he is not saying that in Malaysia..

because Christians and others can not use the word 'Allah" for God in Indonesia and Malaysia . that is waht MUSLIM BABOONS say there. read the link
http://www.time.com/time/world/article/ ... 97,00.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

with best wishes
yeezevee

GrupoCupda
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Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by GrupoCupda »

yeezevee wrote:GrupoCupda says to yeezevee
This rabbis is also Mossad agent :lol: :lol: :lol:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUrGBhbTTpg&NR=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
no..no.. this preacher is NOT Mossad agent., he is right ., whatever is the religion.. Allah is a word of "GOD" so the believers of God could use that word., Please realize Allah, the Arabic word was there before Muhammad was in LIQUID FORM., and his imaginative Allah doll was absent in Pagan community of Arabia. So that rabbi is not wrong what he is saying. I am glad he is not saying that in Malaysia..

because Christians and others can not use the word 'Allah" for God in Indonesia and Malaysia . that is waht MUSLIM BABOONS say there. read the link
http://www.time.com/time/world/article/ ... 97,00.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

with best wishes
yeezevee
Only Jews , christians Arabs and Muslims call God Allah , so do not give me that stupid explanation . Jews never in their history call God of Abraham and Moses using name of pagan gods whether they lived in Egypt , Babylon , Old Europe so the fact of matter they had no problem to use the word Allah proves that they did not believe he was pagan god

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Marie
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Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by Marie »

GrupoCupda wrote:
yeezevee wrote:GrupoCupda says to yeezevee
This rabbis is also Mossad agent :lol: :lol: :lol:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUrGBhbTTpg&NR=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
no..no.. this preacher is NOT Mossad agent., he is right ., whatever is the religion.. Allah is a word of "GOD" so the believers of God could use that word., Please realize Allah, the Arabic word was there before Muhammad was in LIQUID FORM., and his imaginative Allah doll was absent in Pagan community of Arabia. So that rabbi is not wrong what he is saying. I am glad he is not saying that in Malaysia..

because Christians and others can not use the word 'Allah" for God in Indonesia and Malaysia . that is waht MUSLIM BABOONS say there. read the link
http://www.time.com/time/world/article/ ... 97,00.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

with best wishes
yeezevee
Only Jews , christians Arabs and Muslims call God Allah , so do not give me that stupid explanation . Jews never in their history call God of Abraham and Moses using name of pagan gods whether they lived in Egypt , Babylon , Old Europe so the fact of matter they had no problem to use the word Allah proves that they did not believe he was pagan god
The god of Islam and the God of the Bible are not the same deity. There are numerous theological differences between allah and God.

1. Jews and Christians are allowed to have a personal relationship with God, while allah forbids his followers to have a relationship with him.

2. God reached down to humanity and became human in order to bring reconciliation between humans and him, while allah does nothing to bring reconciliation between him and humans and makes all sorts of demands for people to do in order to reach him.

3.The God of the Bible states rituals will not bring salvation to people, while allah states people must perform a lot of rituals in order to be cleansed.

The Biblical Jews never referred to God as allah, nor is allah included in the list of names Jews gave to God to describe his attributes. Nor did the early Christians use the name allah. In fact many of the early Christians were not Jews and probably had no knowledge of the semitic language except for the early Christians who were from the Middle East.

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manfred
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Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by manfred »

You said:
Jews never in their history call God of Abraham and Moses using name of pagan gods
and you are absolutely right, that is why they did not call God "allah"
Jews never alled God "allah", and a small number of Christian living in Muslimlands only didso because they were forced to.
Old Europe so the fact of matter they had no problem to use the word Allah
Yes, they did. Allah was not used as a name of God outside Muslim lands. However, due to poor understanding of the history of Islam, the deceitful Islamic assertion that "allah" was identical with the God of Abraham was not generally challenged by medieval scholastic theologians using historical arguments, but using philosophical ones: the nature of allah and the nature of God is different. In other words, medieval Christian theologians pointed to allah being different from the biblical God, and showed that these differences were errorsintroduced by Mohammed.
Jesus: "Ask and you will receive." Mohammed: "Take and give me 20%"

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KufirbintKufr
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Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by KufirbintKufr »

yeezevee wrote:Please realize Allah, the Arabic word was there before Muhammad was in LIQUID FORM.,
Do we really know it for sure?
Can you please prove your claim?

And no wikipedia, please...
Galatians 1:7-8
But there are some who trouble (agitate) you, and they would pervert the good news of Christ.
If we or an angel from heaven should preach to you any message other than that which we preached to you, let him be accursed.

yeezevee
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Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by yeezevee »

Do we really know it for sure?
Can you please prove your claim?

And no wikipedia, please...
there are many books & historical refs on that

e.g.
History of religion: a sketch of primitive religious beliefs and practices .. 1900s By Allan Menzies

yeezevee

Q
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Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by Q »

http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/ ... Allah.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

yeezevee
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Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by yeezevee »

This is interesting discussion..

The question essentially is .. If we take out messengers from the religions..

What are the attributes of God in different religions.. Allah is simple Arabic word to God.. the supreme super God that produced/produces everything that controls everything and anything at any time any where in this universe..

Question is

what are Attributes of God in Judaism
what are Attributes of God in Christianity
what are Attributes of God in Islam
.. and same thing goes to other religions such as Buddhism, Hinduism Sikhism, Zoroastrianism ..or for that matter 100s of native religions in different cultures ..
the nature of allah and the nature of God is different. In other words, medieval Christian theologians pointed to allah being different from the biblical God, and showed that these differences were errorsintroduced by Mohammed.
now if we take out Muhammad out of equation., how different is this biblical God with reference to Islamic God??


yeezevee

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The Cat
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Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by The Cat »

How Allah as a proper name, turns Him into an idol!
Muslims are committing shirk when using Allah as a proper name, instead of a generic for 'The God'!

This is at the bottom of the controversy that happened recently in Malaysia, where Christians were prohibited to use this name.
In reality, it comes down to incorporate God as a registered trademark, a product. It becomes like let say Coka Co'Allah Inc. !
It transforms the Eternal Almighty (whatever its name) into an object, no worthier than any other one. An industrial delusion...

Let's check a Malay stating that Allah must be prohibited, since He's a Muslim trademark (like some heavenly Coka Co'Allah).
Kristian Sugiyarto said: Allah is a proper noun (proper name). It is never found to be plural, and no possessive suffix such as, my/your/their/his/… – Allah as to be the case in all proper nouns, istead of “my Ilah” etc. Thus it is never found to be construct form such as Allah of Abraham/Ishak/Yakub, but “Ilah” of Abraham / Ishak / Yacob. If the word “Allah” comes from Al + Ilah, then we should be able to change that word in any sentence; in fact we never can do that. E.g. We can’t change the word (Arabic) “Allahuma” into “Al-Ilahuma”, or “Ya Allah” into “Ya Al-Ilah” but “ayuha Al-Ilah”. Thus the Theory Allah = Al-Ilah is certainly nonsense. Ilah in English is God (for the true one) or god (for the false one).
Specifically the controversy arose because Malays aren't that familiar with Arabic. Here's the refutation...
http://www.krisispraxis.com/archives/20 ... nite-name/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I stand by what I wrote based on my understanding of Arabic grammar. Allah is not a personal name. It is a generic word and therefore follows the grammatical rules of other generic words in Arabic as whenever it becomes connected to some determinator (e.g., personal pronoun, “mudaf ilaihi” ) determinating a second noun like “the father’s house”. Where the second word, house, is determined by the first word it loses its article; you cannot say: “the house the father’s”, or “the father’s the house”. It is bait al-âb and not: “al-bait al-âb”.

Now consider the case of Allah = al-ilah in: “Abraham’s God”, God (“the God”, “Allah = al-ilah” is determined by Abraham and therefore has to lose its article as well. This means Allah is used without the article, that is, ilah: ilah Abraham. As such, “Allah Abraham” is impossible, or grammatically incorrect. You will not find it in any Arabic translation of the Bible or elsewhere. There is a plural form of ilah(god): âliha, “gods” or with the article: al-âliha. (...)

Of course, we cannot change the word Allah in any sentence as we like it. We have to follow the grammatical rules! In the case of Allahumma, there is no personal suffix added, but it is given an emphatic expression, and therefore Allah remains. The same goes with Yah ‘llah! God is called at, but this is not given a different grammatical position. Maybe Mr. Kristianto should read the Arabic Bible. If he thinks that “ilah” in English is “god”, this is only partly correct. It is “a” god, without determining article “the”. If you mean “the” (true”) god and not any god, then in Arabic you must also use the article as determinator, again as long as ilah is not terminated by another word of suffix........

Thus, the problem with Allah as a proper name in Malaysia...
The confusion/problem with the translation of the word Allah and its cognates in the present controversy arises simply because Malay is not Arabic. While for any Arab – and Arabic is their native language, be they Muslim, Christian, Jew or what else – Allah is clearly perceived as a generic word following the grammatical rules. But for non-Arabic speaking people these unfamiliar terms may lose their original meanings and become a kind of enigma. Hence they understand Allah and its cognates as something of a proper name. This is, linguistically speaking, a misunderstanding of the Arabic words.

The understanding of “Allah” as a proper name reminds us of the perception of the Europeans when they first became acquainted with Islam. Because of their inadequate knowledge of Arabic they considered Allah “to be the name of the idol worshiped by the Mohammedans”. Every Muslim would, of course, feel offended by such an expression. Unfortunately, such a misunderstanding persists precisely because some people continue to those hold the view that”Allah” is a proper name.........

Saying “the” God (Allah) makes it clear who is meant. If he would need a proper name to distinguish him from other gods (âliha) then he would not longer be perceived as the only true one. If Allah is considered to be a proper name, this would imply that there are other gods with comparable proper names. Such would be the case among human beings: All are human, but all have their proper names because there are many. If there were only one human, it would suffice to call him just Adam (= human being). This one human then does not need a proper name.

Imposing a linguistic taboo that bans the use of the word Allah by non-Muslims is an act that offends the sensitivity of non-Muslims. The ban is even more unacceptable given the fact that the use of Allah is a long established linguistic phenomenon in the history of these Arabic speaking communities – long before even Muslims appeared on the stage of history.
The simple fact that the Koran talks about the ilah of Ibrahim and NOT his Allah is proof enough that through Allah being rendered
as a proper name, Muslims are committing shirk by transforming 'The God' (al-ilah) merely into a incorporated baloney like for sale!

Comes the Judgment day, Muslims will be astonished how they committed nothing but shirk. They're like collecting them all over...
It's as silly as Christians trying to prohibit the usage of the name 'God' (with a capital) for Muslims. That's how stupid they ever act.
Authority has the same etymological root as authenticity.

Q
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Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by Q »

FYI:
[“
ALLAH

Aqa Mahdi Puya says:
There is no fitting equivalent, in the English or any other language, to convey and express the essential essence of the word ALLAH. In the earlier times the idea of a "supreme being" was conveyed to man by the prophets of Allah, but due to the general low level of knowledge, a single word, containing the all-embracing sense and significance of the supreme, universal and absolute being, was not made known.

"Father" may imply creativeness but, in no way, refers to compassion, beneficence and mercy. The word father implies that the father of the universe had a father and a mother who gave birth to him, because it does not indicate that the father of the heaven and the earth had no father or mother to bring him into being. It also fails to establish his uncreated self-existing eternity, unless explanatory words are added. The word Allah is a compound of the definite article al and the noun ilah, meaning "that God". The literal meaning of ilah is "puzzling" if waliha is the source, and "referred to" if it is derived from aliha; in either sense, it can be used for the supreme being unto whom man must surrender.

Known to every one, there is only one universal ultimate whom all human beings devotedly worship; and upon whom they depend and rely. He is undefinable, beyond the reach of human intelligence, unknowable to knowledge, unimaginable, yet recognised by one and all.

Imam Jafar bin Muhammad al Sadiq pointed to the spirit and vision of the word Allah to an atheist, in the course of a discussion. He said:
"When you are in a ship, sailing in the middle of an ocean, and a wind-storm comes on from every side, and there is no conceivable means of rescue, yet, in this hopeless situation, you make efforts, in hope of deliverance; this ultimate faith is Allah, referred to by Allah in verse 22 of Yunus."



Aqa Mahdi Puya says:
The word Allah points to that which is already in the consciousness, but cannot be arrested by comprehension, or conceived mentally. It is universal, because it is connected with the whole as well as with the part. Whether the word Allah is a proper noun or a common noun, because of the article al, is a solvable controversy. The common noun ilah, appropriating definite sense with the definite article al, referring to that which is universally known and recognised by every conscious being, unconfinable to form or concept, never to be two or more save one, becomes a proper noun.

So it is concised in the word Allah, giving it the unique unity of the sense of a proper noun. It must be noted that as the absolute can never be perceived by consciousness, so it cannot be defined by any name. One can refer to Him by personal pronouns, of which "He" (huwa) is the most suitable. The word Allah stands for the absolute self, the greatest name (ism azam), the one perfect total of all good and excellence with no defect.

In contemporary commentaries it is speculated that the word Allah might have been derived from the Hebrew uluhim. Allahumma is closer to uluhim than Allah, because the infidels, very intimate associates of the Jews, were more familiar with Allahumma than Allah, which was a new development. At any event what has been said earlier is further substantiated by the argument put forward to indicate the etymological development of the word.

In the process of evolution, the intellect of man began to make adjustments in the man-god relationship. He had been bowing in adoration to the powerful, useful, harmful, or unintelligible manifestations of nature which, step by step, developed into worship of imaginary deities. As the pantheon of man-made gods grew, man, in desperation, began to seek a supreme being, over the heads of the mini-gods, serving the chief to administer the destiny of man, in one way or other. So gradually man started to seek a supreme being with all comprehensive authority. The word Allah, more suitable than the other words, became popular among the people.

The two possible words ilah is derived from, are alaha and walah meaning astonishment and wonder. The word Allah is formed by adding the definite article al to alah, which means the one who is beyond the reach of conception, or even imagination, and out of the range of knowledge.
The quest for knowledge about Allah comes to a close when the seeker in astonishment confesses that with all his sincere efforts supported by intellect and insight he cannot know Him.


Imam Muhammad bin Ali al Baqir said:
Observe and examine the creation of Allah, do not pry into the being of Allah because no one knows what He is except He.


Imam Ali ibn abi Talib said:
He! O He whom none knows what He is, nor how He is, nor where He is, nor in what respect He is, but He. (Al Mashlul)


The name Allah stands for the supreme one who encompasses everything in the universe but nothing can encompass Him. He is the ever-living allknowing almighty. He has no equal. There is none comparable to Him. He has no associate or partner. All goodly names and ideal attributes belong to Him. He owns and controls that which is in the heavens and that which is in the earth and that which is in between them, the kingdom of the universe. It is only His will that is done. He is the all-seeing, all-hearing, all-just, all-merciful. He is eternal, infinite and essential. He is the first, the immediate and the ultimate.
The name Allah is called the ismi-dhat, the name of the absolute self, the only essential being owning all the divine attributes. The other names called asma ul husna are appellative and descriptive, relating to various attributes, each separately applicable according to His dealings with His creation.
He is Allah, the creator, the maker, the fashioner. His are the asma ul husna (the excellent names), (HASHR: 24)
The word Allah has been divinely chosen. The religious-minded know fully well what wonderful efficacy the name of Allah has. “””””]

[Pooya/Ali Commentary 1:1]
http://www.al-islam.org/quran/default.a ... ry=checked" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



#############################################################


["Allah" (the divine name) was originally al-Ilah; the "I"; in the middle was omitted because of frequent use. al-Ilah is derived from alaha (he worshipped) or from aliha or waliha (he was bewildered). It is on paradigm of al-fi'al in meaning of al-maf'ul (object-noun). For example, al-Kitab means al-Maktub (the written); likewise al-Ilah means al-Ma'luh that is, the One who is worshipped, or the One about whom minds are bewildered.

Quite clearly, it has become the proper name of God. It was commonly used in this meaning in Arabic long before the Qur'an was revealed. The fact that even pre-Islamic Arabs used this name for God, may be inferred from the following verses: "And if you should ask them who created them, they would certainly say: Allah..." (43:87). "...and they say: This for Allah - so they assert - and this is for our associates" (6:136).

Other divine names may be used as adjectives for this name; for example, "the Beneficent and the Merciful Allah"; also, this name is used as subject of the verbs derived from other divine names; for example, "Allah knew", "Allah had mercy", "Allah gave sustenance" etc. But the word, "Allah", is never used as adjective to any other name, nor is the verb derived from it used to describe other names. It is a clear proof that it is the proper name of God.

The divine existence, in as much as Allah is the God of everything, presupposes that He should have all the attributes of perfection; and, as a result, this name points to all perfect attributes. That is why it is said that the name, "Allah", means "the Person Who is the Essential Being, and Who encompasses all the attributes of perfection." But the fact is that it is the proper name of God and no other meaning (except that related to worship or bewilderment) has been taken into consideration here,,,,,,’]

Tafseer Al-Mizan
Chapter 1 Verse 1
By Allamah Muhammad Hussain Tabatabai

http://www.shiasource.com/al-mizan/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

############################################################################

“”””[Praise is due to Allah whose worth cannot be described by speakers, whose bounties cannot be counted by calculators and whose claim (to obedience) cannot be satisfied by those who attempt to do so, whom the height of intellectual courage cannot appreciate, and the divings of understanding cannot reach; He for whose description no limit has been laid down, no eulogy exists, no time is ordained and no duration is fixed. He brought forth creation through His Omnipotence, dispersed winds through His Compassion, and made firm the shaking earth with rocks.

The foremost in religion is the acknowledgement of Him, the perfection of acknowledging Him is to testify Him, the perfection of testifying Him is to believe in His Oneness, the perfection of believing in His Oneness is to regard Him Pure, and the perfection of His purity is to deny Him attributes, because every attribute is a proof that it is different from that to which it is attributed and everything to which something is attributed is different from the attribute. Thus whoever attaches attributes to Allah recognises His like, and who recognises His like regards Him two; and who regards Him two recognises parts for Him; and who recognises parts for Him mistook Him; and who mistook Him pointed at Him; and who pointed at Him admitted limitations for Him; and who admitted limitations for Him numbered Him.

Whoever said in what is He, held that He is contained; and whoever said on what is He held He is not on something else. He is a Being but not through phenomenon of coming into being. He exists but not from non-existence. He is with everything but not in physical nearness. He is different from everything but not in physical separation. He acts but without connotation of movements and instruments. He sees even when there is none to be looked at from among His creation. He is only One, such that there is none with whom He may keep company or whom He may miss in his absence.”””]


Sermon 1
Nahj al-Balaghah
Imam Ali ibn Abi Talib
http://www.al-islam.org/nahj/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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The Cat
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Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by The Cat »

Q wrote:FYI: ALLAH

Aqa Mahdi Puya says:
There is no fitting equivalent, in the English or any other language, to convey and express the essential essence of the word ALLAH. In the earlier times the idea of a "supreme being" was conveyed to man by the prophets of Allah, but due to the general low level of knowledge, a single word, containing the all-embracing sense and significance of the supreme, universal and absolute being, was not made known.
This is mere arrogance from sheer ignorance: Far older religions than Islam had a concept of an all-embracing divinity, like Hinduism:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brahman" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
In the Hindu religion, Brahman (bráhman, {{lang|sa|} ब्रह्मन्}) is the unchanging, infinite, immanent, and transcendent reality which is the Divine Ground of all matter, energy, time, space, being, and everything beyond in this Universe. The nature of Brahman is described as transpersonal, personal and impersonal by different philosophical schools. (...) Brahman is the Absolute Godhead; Absolute Reality or universal substrate (not to be confused with the Creator god Lord Brahmā) in Hinduism. It is said to be eternal, omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent, and ultimately indescribable in human language.

The sage-seers of the Upanishads had fully realized Brahman as the reality behind their own being and of everything else in this universe. (...) Brahman is regarded as the source and essence of the material universe. The Rig Veda says that by the desire of the Supreme GOD (RV 10.12.94), the initial manifestation of the material universe came into being from Hiranyagarbha (literally "golden womb"), out of which all worlds, organisms and divine beings (devas) arise....
See also, The All: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_All" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Q wrote:Aqa Mahdi Puya says:
The word Allah points to that which is already in the consciousness, but cannot be arrested by comprehension, or conceived mentally. It is universal, because it is connected with the whole as well as with the part. Whether the word Allah is a proper noun or a common noun, because of the article al, is a solvable controversy. The common noun ilah, appropriating definite sense with the definite article al, referring to that which is universally known and recognised by every conscious being, unconfinable to form or concept, never to be two or more save one, becomes a proper noun.

So it is concised in the word Allah, giving it the unique unity of the sense of a proper noun.
Image
A stele is dedicated 'Qaus is Allah' or 'Qos the god', by Qaus-Malaka (reigned around 705BC) is found at Petra. Qos is identifiable with
Kaush the God of the older Edomites. The stele is horned and the seal from Edomite Tawilan near Petra identified with Kaush displays
a star and crescent, both consistent with a moon diety. Kaus was the Edomite national god, to be equated with Nabataean 'Dushares'.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaus" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

So even in ancient times, Allah has been a generic for god. It wasn't a personal name, which in the stele is rather the Edomite Kaus.

Rasullulah (the messenger of ul-Lah)
When we study the appellation of 'Rasul' we find out that it had no religious connotation at first and meant 'envoy' or 'emissary'.
As written 'Rasulullah' means 'Rasul-ul-Lah' (or rasul 'il-Lah') and -NOT- 'Rasul al-Allah'! Thus Muhammad isn't the envoy of Allah!

By giving 'The God' (al-Ilah) a simple proper name, Muslims are reducing Him into a -it-. From being 'The God' Allah is shrinked
into just 'a' god, he's then to be put on par with Zeus, Humbaba or the Flying Spaghetti. A sovereign over some frosted canned
heaven and animistic angels. Well, Congratulations to Muslims! They can't but shirk up to transforming 'The God' into an idol...
Authority has the same etymological root as authenticity.

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KufirbintKufr
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Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by KufirbintKufr »

The Cat wrote:Rasullulah (the messenger of ul-Lah)
When we study the appellation of 'Rasul' we find out that it had no religious connotation at first and meant 'envoy' or 'emissary'.
As written 'Rasulullah' means 'Rasul-ul-Lah' (or rasul 'il-Lah') and -NOT- 'Rasul al-Allah'! Thus Muhammad isn't the envoy of Allah!
So consequently, Abdullah is a slave to ul- Lah not slave to Allah ?
Galatians 1:7-8
But there are some who trouble (agitate) you, and they would pervert the good news of Christ.
If we or an angel from heaven should preach to you any message other than that which we preached to you, let him be accursed.

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manfred
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Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by manfred »

KufirbintKufr wrote:
The Cat wrote:Rasullulah (the messenger of ul-Lah)
When we study the appellation of 'Rasul' we find out that it had no religious connotation at first and meant 'envoy' or 'emissary'.
As written 'Rasulullah' means 'Rasul-ul-Lah' (or rasul 'il-Lah') and -NOT- 'Rasul al-Allah'! Thus Muhammad isn't the envoy of Allah!
So consequently, Abdullah is a slave to ul- Lah not slave to Allah ?
slave of ("the") god... this was, in the case of Mohammed's uncle, a reference to hubal, but Muslims re-interpreted that name as "slave of allah", telling us the very thing they try to hide...
Jesus: "Ask and you will receive." Mohammed: "Take and give me 20%"

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KufirbintKufr
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Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by KufirbintKufr »

manfred wrote:
KufirbintKufr wrote:
The Cat wrote:Rasullulah (the messenger of ul-Lah)
When we study the appellation of 'Rasul' we find out that it had no religious connotation at first and meant 'envoy' or 'emissary'.
As written 'Rasulullah' means 'Rasul-ul-Lah' (or rasul 'il-Lah') and -NOT- 'Rasul al-Allah'! Thus Muhammad isn't the envoy of Allah!
So consequently, Abdullah is a slave to ul- Lah not slave to Allah ?
slave of ("the") god... this was, in the case of Mohammed's uncle, a reference to hubal, but Muslims re-interpreted that name as "slave of allah", telling us the very thing they try to hide...
So Rasulullah also refers to Hubal ?

I thought Abdulah was Mohammed's father...

They really do a great job and get away with a LOT due to our ignorance of Arabic.
Galatians 1:7-8
But there are some who trouble (agitate) you, and they would pervert the good news of Christ.
If we or an angel from heaven should preach to you any message other than that which we preached to you, let him be accursed.

GrupoCupda
Posts: 97
Joined: Sun Feb 07, 2010 10:34 pm

Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by GrupoCupda »

The Cat wrote:Rasullulah (the messenger of ul-Lah)
When we study the appellation of 'Rasul' we find out that it had no religious connotation at first and meant 'envoy' or 'emissary'.
As written 'Rasulullah' means 'Rasul-ul-Lah' (or rasul 'il-Lah') and -NOT- 'Rasul al-Allah'! Thus Muhammad isn't the envoy of Allah!
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: . As I said go first learn Arabic then come here attacking Islam . People who can read Arabic are laughing at you guys :lol: :lol: :lol: .

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Marie
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Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by Marie »

GrupoCupda wrote:
The Cat wrote:Rasullulah (the messenger of ul-Lah)
When we study the appellation of 'Rasul' we find out that it had no religious connotation at first and meant 'envoy' or 'emissary'.
As written 'Rasulullah' means 'Rasul-ul-Lah' (or rasul 'il-Lah') and -NOT- 'Rasul al-Allah'! Thus Muhammad isn't the envoy of Allah!
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: . As I said go first learn Arabic then come here attacking Islam . People who can read Arabic are laughing at you guys :lol: :lol: :lol: .
So GrupoCupda how well is your knowledge of Arabic?

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KufirbintKufr
Posts: 372
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2009 8:37 pm

Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by KufirbintKufr »

GrupoCupda wrote:
The Cat wrote:Rasullulah (the messenger of ul-Lah)
When we study the appellation of 'Rasul' we find out that it had no religious connotation at first and meant 'envoy' or 'emissary'.
As written 'Rasulullah' means 'Rasul-ul-Lah' (or rasul 'il-Lah') and -NOT- 'Rasul al-Allah'! Thus Muhammad isn't the envoy of Allah!
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: . As I said go first learn Arabic then come here attacking Islam . People who can read Arabic are laughing at you guys :lol: :lol: :lol: .
So you can only read Arabic. I know you did not write it explicitly but I would bet on that.

Many muslims from subcontinent preach about Arabic but they do not know it. Nice bluff in other words.

You can learn to read Arabic in a week. Someone even wrote it took him a couple of hours.
Galatians 1:7-8
But there are some who trouble (agitate) you, and they would pervert the good news of Christ.
If we or an angel from heaven should preach to you any message other than that which we preached to you, let him be accursed.

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The Cat
Posts: 2055
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2009 3:23 pm

Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by The Cat »

GrupoCupda wrote:
The Cat wrote:Rasullulah (the messenger of ul-Lah)
When we study the appellation of 'Rasul' we find out that it had no religious connotation at first and meant 'envoy' or 'emissary'.
As written 'Rasulullah' means 'Rasul-ul-Lah' (or rasul 'il-Lah') and -NOT- 'Rasul al-Allah'! Thus Muhammad isn't the envoy of Allah!
As I said go first learn Arabic then come here attacking Islam . People who can read Arabic are laughing at you guys.
Oh, my bad. I should have known that 'Rasulullah' was really a Finnish dialect! :D
Really you make me think of an old forum poster named 'Berber'. Arabic is such
a defunct language that it can hardly cope with modern technologies and terms.
The Koranic 'classical' Arabic is much worse. Few people can translate it properly.
And, then, more translations are being done every year or so. Clarity my foot !

Now, al-Lah has a root that scholars didn't look at: the Egyptian 'Lah', a name for the moon!
http://www.touregypt.net/featurestories/yah.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Little is really know of this god's cult, and there is no references to actual temples or locations where he may have been worshipped. However, among ancient references, we do seem to find in the Papyrus of Ani several references to the god, though here, his name has been translated as Lah: In Chapter 2: "A spell to come forth by day and live after dying. Words spoken by the Osiris Ani: O One, bright as the moon-god Lah; O One, shining as Lah (...) And again, in Chapter 18: ''I am the moon-god Lah among the gods; I do not fail. Indeed, Horus stands; he reckons you among the gods."
Muhammad as the 'seal' of the prophets is debunked by Q.29.25-27:
He said: Ye have chosen only idols instead of Allah (i.e. The God). The love between you is only in the life of the world. Then on the Day of Resurrection ye will deny each other and curse each other, and your abode will be the Fire, and ye will have no helpers. --And Lot believed him, and said: Lo! I am a fugitive unto my Lord. Lo! He, only He, is the Mighty, the Wise.--And We bestowed on him Isaac and Jacob, and We established the prophethood and the Scripture among his seed, and We gave him his reward in the world, and lo! in the Hereafter he verily is among the righteous.
Here we read that the line of prophethood can only be coming from Lot, Isaac and Jacob (Y. Ali adds Abraham, which is not in the text).
It clearly takes away the traditional Muhammad as he is -not- from this seed. The Koran is actually dismissing the Islamic Muhammad!
Authority has the same etymological root as authenticity.

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The Cat
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Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by The Cat »

In the hope of saving lives and troubles in Malaysia or elsewhere, upon a form of idolatry...
Once a formidable Christian theologian, Nicholas of Kues (1401-1464) in his work 'De Docta Ignorancia' (Of Learned Ignorance), came
with the best definition for G-d I have yet encountered. He said that God is ''That in which opposites co-exist''! But a sectarian Allah
couldn't match this, so more and more Muslims are getting aware that this thing about Allah as a proper name is bound to reflect as
'The idol of the Muhammadans'... instead of the intended embodiment of The One!

As a proper name 'Allah' would be equated with any sectarian deity, any tribal leading god, like the Edomite 'Kaus'. By its proper
name he ceases to be the Supreme Being of All, a specific reference to The All, to become the Islamic tribal divinity, loosing its
universal belonging. The sectarian Allah cannot anymore be said of anything infinite, since he has been identified with a finite
wording. Allah is classified information, a registered trademark like: Allah Inc. Worse still: this 'Allah' would lose all affinities
with the Biblical G-d and its recognized prophets, including Abraham and Moses, so going against a flock of Koranic statements!

http://www.submission.org/allah-god.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Insisting on the use of the word "Allah" which is the Arabic word for God immediately creates the illusion that "Allah" is a whole different deity than God of the whole world. It creates a god that belongs ONLY to the Muslims, and takes the universality of Islam out of it.

We found the comment sent by Abu Iman Robert Squires to be very informative and we re-produced it here: ''...Many people think that Muslims worship a different God. I've come across some Arab brothers who insist in using only the word "Allah". They somehow think that it implies Tawhid while the word "God" implies the Trinity, etc., etc. You know, the problem with such people is not their knowledge of Arabic, but their ignorance of English. The mushriks (disbelievers) at the time of the Prophet (saws) used the word Allah, and so do Arabic-speaking Christians. The word itself in no way implies tawhid. The reason it implies tawhid to Muslims is that they're Muslims. Others use this word in ways that are nothing but shirk.

The word God implies tawhid to me because I have the Islamic concept of Him. It's all in the concept, but has nothing to do with the word itself. Also, there are statements in some da'wah pamphlets that say "all prophets since Adam used the word Allah" and that "the word Allah is exactly the same as the Aramaic word Jesus used for God". The first statement is baseless and can be proved to be logically incorrect from the Quran. The second statement is incorrect, but the words are only similar, but NOT exactly alike. This whole trend of using "Allah" in English seems to come about rather recently. (...)

The word "ilah" in Arabic can be used for a false god or for Allah. (Like when God says (paraphrased) the "ilah" of Ibrahim", and numerous other example.) Anyone who can read the Quran should know this. However, unlike the word "god" in English, which ALWAYS implies a false god. Non-native English speakers sometimes mistakenly believe that "god" and "God" are the same English word, but they are not. They carry completely different meanings. If they doubt this, then they simply don't know how to speak the English language. And to say that the word "Allah" can only be used for the Supreme Almighty Creator is refuted by the Quran itself.

It clearly says (and I paraphrase here rather liberally) that Christians say that "Allah is Jesus". There you have it, applying "Allah" to something that isn't "Allah" right there in the Quran. You see, what people really mean to say is that you SHOULDN'T use "Allah" for anything except the Almighty Creator, but you still CAN. The same thing goes for the word God. People can use it in the wrong way, but that doesn't make it right. The truth is that this word too should only be used for the Almighty Creator.

Remember...God has sent prophets to everyone in their OWN LANGUAGE, i.e. a language that they can understand. (...) There is ONLY one God. His name in English is God, in French: dieu; in Italian: dio, in German: Gott; in Spanish: Dios, in Portuguese: Deus; in Arabic: Allah, and in Aramaic : alaha. All these are no more than the names of God in different languages. To this day the Christian Arabs pray to Allah and talk about Allah. They called Him Allah even before Islam was born and they know they were not worshiping any moon god. Those who still speak Jesus language (Aramaic/syriac) call God alaha to this day like Jesus did. Jesus did not pray to a moon god but to alaha (Allah), the One and Only God. The Arabic Bible, use the word Allah for God.


In fact the wording 'Allah' hasn't been translated as it should have been (through 'The God'), so acquiring a proper name by the side.
In many languages Allah is translated differently: in Turkey the usage of Teng'ri as a synonymous for 'The God' i.e. 'Allah' is common;
in Chinese, it is written: Ala, Anla or Zhenzhu; in Serbia and Macedonia we find: Alah or Anax; in Greek it becomes: Allach or Theos,
same as how it's written in Russia. In Japanese it becomes: Arra or Arranu! 'Allah' simply can't be a proper name like that of 'Robert'!

If Muslims insist on this meaning, they reduce G-d as an idol and commit shirk whenever they pray to a somewhat 'Robert'!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allah" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Etymology
The term Allāh is derived from a contraction of the Arabic definite article al- "the" and ʼilāh "deity, god" to al-lāh meaning "the [sole] deity, God" (ho theos monos). Cognates of the name "Allāh" exist in other Semitic languages, including Hebrew and Aramaic. The corresponding Aramaic form is אֱלָהָא ʼĔlāhā in Biblical Aramaic and ܐܰܠܳܗܳܐ Alâhâ or Ālōho in Syriac. The contraction of al- and ʼilāh in forming the term Allāh ("the god", masculine form) parallels the contraction of al- and ʼilāha in forming the term Allāt ("the goddess", feminine form)........

Some Muslims leave the name "Allāh" untranslated in English. Sometimes this comes from a zeal for the Arabic text of the Qur'an and sometimes with a more or less conscious implication that the Jewish and Christian concept of God is not completely true in its details. Conversely, the usage of the term Allah by English speaking non-Muslims in reference to the God in Islam, Marshall G. S. Hodgson says, can imply that Muslims are worshiping a mythical god named 'Allah' rather than God, the creator. This usage is therefore appropriate only for those who are prepared to accept its theological implications...
In short, creating a proper name out of al-Ilah comes down to associate Allah as a partner to 'The One God'! :evil2:

In my next post we'll have a look upon Hubal as Allah...
Authority has the same etymological root as authenticity.

GrupoCupda
Posts: 97
Joined: Sun Feb 07, 2010 10:34 pm

Re: Allah= Al+ilah ?

Post by GrupoCupda »

!Cat said :

Oh, my bad. I should have known that 'Rasulullah' was really a Finnish dialect! :D
Really you make me think of an old forum poster named 'Berber'. Arabic is such
a defunct language that it can hardly cope with modern technologies and terms.
The Koranic 'classical' Arabic is much worse. Few people can translate it properly.
And, then, more translations are being done every year or so. Clarity my foot

You are not worth my time . You guys are kafirs with mental problems you need to visit a doctor as soon as possible . You are debating a language which you do not even speak or read and with who ? with somebody whose mother tongue is Arabic claiming that you guys are right and I am wrong . This is how sick people you are . You are not even accepting video proofs from Rabbis what proof are you going to accept ? .

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