Is Cousin Marriage Natural?

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marduk
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Is Cousin Marriage Natural?

Post by marduk »

As is well known, Muhammad married his own cousin, and Muslims have imitated him ever since. Let's try to find out whether or not that's a natural thing to do, by seeing how gorillas behave in regard to mating.
Females are in heat during 1 or 2 days a month, but before they start having sex partners they must be separated from their born troop and start searching for a “silverback” male from another group. Females are the ones who attract male gorillas with body movements: initially, slowly and leisurely they approach the “silverback” with uninterrupted eye contact while puckering their lips and then they have to assess the male response to take the next step. If the male courted do not react at her insinuation, she gets closer and can even touch him. If this still does not work, she hardly hit the ground in a final attempt to draw his attention once and for all.
https://www.gorillas-world.com/gorilla-reproduction/
Nope, it's not natural at all. And we also see why human women act the way they do. Doesn't that sound exactly like them? It's especially annoying when they hit the ground with their fists if you refuse.

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Ansar al-Zindiqi
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Re: Is Cousin Marriage Natural?

Post by Ansar al-Zindiqi »

I would say that cousin-to-cousin marriage and interbreeding isn't natural but it is traditional.
Inbreeding in Islam: Over 70% Of Muslims Are The Product of Incest
squawker.org
Image

It should not be alarming that the respectability of the Islamic ethical system has been severely questioned in both the far past and contemporary times. According to an article in the Journal of Child Sexual Abuse, until a few years ago the practice of murdering women to preserve family honor enjoyed almost total legitimacy within Palestine, one of the most homogeneously Muslim societies in the world. With this consideration, alongside the alarming rise of Islamic terrorism in Europe centered around Germany, and the radicalization of European converts to the Muslim faith, Islam can be rightly held under intense scrutiny by the public eye.

A Danish news outlet titled Jyllands-Posten released information in 2009 concerning the astonishing rate of stillbirths, physical deformities, and various mental diseases caused by the ever-imminent incest-filled landscape in the Muslim world, concluding that Pakistani, Turkish and Somali women are twice as likely to experience complications during childbirth. Nearly 70% of Pakistanis are the product of inbreeding in Islam, mostly due to the Muslim tradition of marrying cousins via choice or arrangement. BBC also released a study, revealing that approximately 55% of Pakistani immigrants in Britain were married to a first cousin and that Pakistani-British were “at least 13 times likely to than the general population to have children with recessive genetic disorders.”

So, with the cold hard statistics before our eyes and the somewhat shocking information regarding the prominence of inbreeding in Islam, we must ask, What gives? Why is incest such an integrated characteristic of Islam?

According to Bengali ex-Muslim essayist Abul Kaseem, the product of rampant phenomena of inbreeding in Islam is due to several things, but two stick out in particular: 1) interpretations of the Qu’ran which permits a Muslim man to marry and have intercourse with his daughter born out of wedlock (usually 8 or 9 years old), and 2) the popular and widely accepted practice of cousin-marriage initiated by the Prophet Muhammed himself, who infamously had relations with his cousins outside of marriage (Tirmidhi 5.3214).

Regarding the first point, the Qu’ranic passage that is traditionally interpreted to permit the marriage of first cousins is found in the following excerpt:

“Prohibited to you (For marriage) are:- Your mothers, daughters, sisters; father’s sisters, Mother’s sisters; brother’s daughters, sister’s daughters; foster-mothers (Who gave you suck), foster-sisters; your wives’ mothers; your step-daughters under your guardianship, born of your wives to whom ye have gone in,- no prohibition if ye have not gone in;- (Those who have been) wives of your sons proceeding from your loins; and two sisters in wedlock at one and the same time, except for what is past; for Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful,” (Surah An-Nisa 4:23)

The term “daughters” in the above text may initially appear that Islam prohibits fathers marrying their offspring; however, a closer inspection of the Arabic word used in this context denotes a purely judicial definition, meaning that Muslim fathers are allowed to marry their daughters, provided that the latter have been born illegitimately. Kaseem provides in-depth examples regarding the many routes that Muslim men can undergo to marry their prepubescent daughters here.

Regarding the second point, it should be noted that first cousins are nowhere mentioned among the listed family members that are considered off-limits in the above passage. Muhammed himself married his father’s sister’s daughter, a woman named Zaynab bint Jahsh, who had also been divorced from Muhammed’s adopted son, Zayd ibn Haritha. It is clear that there is no recognition of relational boundaries when it comes to incest within Islam.

A study was conducted in the 1960s that concluded that only 0.2% of all Roman Catholics in the United States were married to first cousins, which is an astronomically small statistics compared to Pakistan’s 70% and Turkey’s 25%-30%. Does inbreeding in Islam mean that Islam morally reprehensible? If one considers incest to be a moral evil, specifically due to the 100% increase in the risk of stillbirths, then this particular Muslim tradition needs to be assimilated to Western values in this ethical area.

Whether the Muslim faith is able to surrender its morally reprehensible sexual ethic has yet to be seen, and it is unlikely based on current data to assume that such resistance to Western ethical teachings will lighten anytime in the near future.
Don't be a believer but a heretic unto yourself.

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Ansar al-Zindiqi
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Re: Is Cousin Marriage Natural?

Post by Ansar al-Zindiqi »

When Cousins Marry (Genetic Disorder Documentary) | Only Human
How to calculate inbreeding from a pedigree chart
Joe Rogan and Gavin McInnes Discuss the Islam-Inbreeding Connection
Marry your cousin?! Why royal families inbred
Lots of denial and confused people here :no1:
Don't be a believer but a heretic unto yourself.

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Hombre
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Re: Is Cousin Marriage Natural?

Post by Hombre »

The "kissing cousins".
After all a cousin is like half-sister or brother.

Nosuperstition
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Re: Is Cousin Marriage Natural?

Post by Nosuperstition »

Hombre wrote:The "kissing cousins".
After all a cousin is like half-sister or brother.
If I remember correctly,Sarah,Abraham's wife was his half-sister.Wasn't she?
palli or halli in Dravidian languages means a village just like gaav in Aryan languages means a village.palli or halli in Aryan Mauryan Imperial era around 200 B.C designates a tribal hamlet.So many of those in South India are indeed descendants of tribals and are still keeping up that heritage.

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marduk
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Re: Is Cousin Marriage Natural?

Post by marduk »

Judaism is the same, they marry cousins because they're not on the banned list. The Arabs just made it the norm whereas I assume the Jews didn't. Maybe the long noses are from recessive genes. But we can be sure Allah/YHVH did not write any of that list, because why leave out cousins? It's obvious that the priests just liked cousin sex so they purposely left it out.

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Ibn Rushd
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Re: Is Cousin Marriage Natural?

Post by Ibn Rushd »

The niece-marriage issue came to a boil during the 1st century, when the Idumeans (Herodians and others) married their nieces and raised it to an art form.
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Ibn Rushd
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Re: Is Cousin Marriage Natural?

Post by Ibn Rushd »

marduk wrote:Judaism is the same, they marry cousins because they're not on the banned list. The Arabs just made it the norm whereas I assume the Jews didn't. Maybe the long noses are from recessive genes. But we can be sure Allah/YHVH did not write any of that list, because why leave out cousins? It's obvious that the priests just liked cousin sex so they purposely left it out.
For Jews, they did have a large element of inbreeding due to the initial small breeding stock being foreign men who married local women. The group didn't grow through intermarriage to a great degree after the initial period, so they had a small basis for marriage. They ended up inbreeding because Christians didn't want to mix with them over time.
There is no Master but the Master, and QT-1 is his Prophet.

Asimov's robot story "Reason"

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Hombre
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Re: Is Cousin Marriage Natural?

Post by Hombre »

marduk wrote:Judaism is the same, they marry cousins because they're not on the banned list. The Arabs just made it the norm whereas I assume the Jews didn't. Maybe the long noses are from recessive genes. But we can be sure Allah/YHVH did not write any of that list, because why leave out cousins? It's obvious that the priests just liked cousin sex so they purposely left it out.
maybe it was practiced in ancient times - not today - certainly not in Israel

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SAM
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Re: Is Cousin Marriage Natural?

Post by SAM »

marduk wrote:As is well known, Muhammad married his own cousin, and Muslims have imitated him ever since. Let's try to find out whether or not that's a natural thing to do, by seeing how gorillas behave in regard to mating.
Females are in heat during 1 or 2 days a month, but before they start having sex partners they must be separated from their born troop and start searching for a “silverback” male from another group. Females are the ones who attract male gorillas with body movements: initially, slowly and leisurely they approach the “silverback” with uninterrupted eye contact while puckering their lips and then they have to assess the male response to take the next step. If the male courted do not react at her insinuation, she gets closer and can even touch him. If this still does not work, she hardly hit the ground in a final attempt to draw his attention once and for all.
https://www.gorillas-world.com/gorilla-reproduction/
Nope, it's not natural at all. And we also see why human women act the way they do. Doesn't that sound exactly like them? It's especially annoying when they hit the ground with their fists if you refuse.
Fraternal polyandry is practiced among Tibetans in Nepal, parts of China and part of northern India, in which two or more brothers are married to the same wife, with the wife having equal "sexual access" to them.
Does your wife share a bed with your brother ... In other words a threesome ...marduk :yuk:
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Takeiteasynow
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Re: Is Cousin Marriage Natural?

Post by Takeiteasynow »

Marduk wrote:Judaism is the same, they marry cousins because they're not on the banned list. The Arabs just made it the norm whereas I assume the Jews didn't. Maybe the long noses are from recessive genes. But we can be sure Allah/YHVH did not write any of that list, because why leave out cousins? It's obvious that the priests just liked cousin sex so they purposely left it out.
:lol: :lol: I love your noncausal explanations... more frames please!
Abraham= H'ammu'rab(b)i, Historical Muhammad=Benjamin of Tiberias. Islam: Syncretic Israelite Yahwishm Deity: nameless, epithets Dsr, El Qutbay, ʼAlâhâ, Allāh. Ka'ba: Kutha => Samaria => Petra=> Makkah. Hijrah 622: Petra => Kerak

Nosuperstition
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Re: Is Cousin Marriage Natural?

Post by Nosuperstition »

SAM wrote:Fraternal polyandry is practiced among Tibetans in Nepal, parts of China and part of northern India, in which two or more brothers are married to the same wife, with the wife having equal "sexual access" to them.
This system of polyandry came into existence mostly among martial castes as their menfolk can die any moment in wars.Much similar to what they had shown in a hollywood film about a hubby about to go to war bequeathing his entire property to his wife even if she married once again,in case he died in the war. Also,if you had cared to read the Mahabharat,clearly they mention or caution such people using the story of Sunda and Upasunda and Tilottama that fights over woman can cause even the closest brothers to kill each other and the brothers are advised to sleep with the same woman following the rule of one year in one's house,not at the same time.
palli or halli in Dravidian languages means a village just like gaav in Aryan languages means a village.palli or halli in Aryan Mauryan Imperial era around 200 B.C designates a tribal hamlet.So many of those in South India are indeed descendants of tribals and are still keeping up that heritage.

Nosuperstition
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Re: Is Cousin Marriage Natural?

Post by Nosuperstition »

chiti mantala sahagamanam okasaarey bali chestundi,pati vidichina sati gamanam prati nimisham ragilistundi.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QmL9ByW4ais

The fires of Sati Sahagamanam ritual/Sati pyre will take a sacrifice only for once,however if your husband leaves you ,the wife will burn every minute for the rest of her life.That is the meaning of the above line.

In medieval periods,Suttee was abetted more or less by forcing the essense of the above line.Not that any widow who did not commit Suttee lived for long,as she would sooner or later die slowly of depression due to the way a widow is treated in the then Hindu society atleast right from 1100 A.D onwards when Islamic invasions began on a huge scale.

Widow remarriage was mostly not allowed and existence of polyandry was historically documented to the best of my knowledge only amongst the Nair caste people of Kerala who formed the ruling martial caste but with limited land possession due to overpopulation.Similarly , it is quite possible that some families , mind you not even castes , might have been practicing polyandry in North India in order to uphold their limited land possession.Even in Judaic and Christian literature,in order to keep family property within the joint family,the childless widow is allowed to have children but only with those of the brothers of her deceased husband.

Onan's example stands out in this regard.Now is that right or is it right to go out and slaughter other nations,snatch their land and make a complete genocide of them so as to erase your crimes just as had happened in case of Caanaanite nations etc ,as soon as you are overpopulated,who can tell and with what authority?Who can indulge in divination with 100% accuracy with regards to morality or what is right and wrong?
palli or halli in Dravidian languages means a village just like gaav in Aryan languages means a village.palli or halli in Aryan Mauryan Imperial era around 200 B.C designates a tribal hamlet.So many of those in South India are indeed descendants of tribals and are still keeping up that heritage.

Nosuperstition
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Re: Is Cousin Marriage Natural?

Post by Nosuperstition »

That the life of a Hindu widow is made almost a hell in this very world was acknowledged at Kamat's/Kamaat's potpurri site and at this very site by idesigner1/crazy canuck of this forum when he said the Hindi word for widow is 'rand' which literally means bitch.Right now I am not able to access some parts of Kamaat's pot purri site which describe the scenes of Johar/Suttee committed by the queens of Vijayanagar Empire and as had been witnessed by Portuguese and other contemporary foreigners.These sacrifices are akin to retainer sacrifices of ancient Pharonic Egypt that lasted for almost 5000 years,which were too little in gross numbers,however were too graphic if you try to put yourself the place of the victims.Might be those moderating those sites in India deemed those descriptions to be too graphic for the present generation to handle.
palli or halli in Dravidian languages means a village just like gaav in Aryan languages means a village.palli or halli in Aryan Mauryan Imperial era around 200 B.C designates a tribal hamlet.So many of those in South India are indeed descendants of tribals and are still keeping up that heritage.

Nosuperstition
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Re: Is Cousin Marriage Natural?

Post by Nosuperstition »

While a widow is called "rand" in Hindi and while even Swami Vivekananda justified insulting widows,whoring is called "ranku" in Telugu.Perhaps the root is the same.
palli or halli in Dravidian languages means a village just like gaav in Aryan languages means a village.palli or halli in Aryan Mauryan Imperial era around 200 B.C designates a tribal hamlet.So many of those in South India are indeed descendants of tribals and are still keeping up that heritage.

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