Isis - does this make any sense to anyone?

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manfred
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Isis - does this make any sense to anyone?

Post by manfred »

When you read up about this group, which, laughably Al'Qaida has disowned as "too extreme", there are many things that don't make much sense:

We are told there are some 4000 or so actively fighting "members"., most not professional soldiers, with some 500 roughly young men from the UK. assuming the information we read on the BBC and Wiki are broadly correct.

1) They are very well resourced. Where is the money coming from?
2) Why can the professional army of some 500,000 men in Iraq not handle this problem? Or is there no will to do so?


These are just two things I really like to know, but it seem it is very difficult to get straight answers.

Then on other things we actually know the answer to, we are told in the media that there is some big mystery...

"How are they 'radicalised' "? A Cardiff father of one of the young men fighting in Iraq blames the internet, particularly Internet pornography. Also, it is the doing of the Americans... Yeah, right that makes a lot of sense...

It obviously has nothing whatever to do with that little green book, the Qur'an...

Interestingly, this morning we saw a rather funny TV interview... a man from the "Welsh council of Muslims" (LOL) was ruminating the profound mystery of radicalisation with the BBC interviewer , when they got interrupted by an Iraqi refugee: "What you need to do is to close all the mosques. That is where the problem lies." He interviewer looked at him as if he was insane. The fact that he ATTENDS several local mosques obviously adds no weight to his comment at all. Religion of peace, go back to sleep.
Jesus: "Ask and you will receive." Mohammed: "Take and give me 20%"

idesigner1
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Re: Isis - does this make any sense to anyone?

Post by idesigner1 »

I started a thread about ISIS while ago.Looks like no one was interested in any serious discussion.

So let me start with light hearted discussion.

This saturday I witnessed a demonstration by some Muslims in Calgary City square. Their theme was "Shia-Sunnis are brothers. Many clerics both shia and sunni gave lectures. They all opposed Wahabis, Saudis and other extremists. They all blamed USA, Israel and all western powers for the war going on in Iraq.I told them they should start praying in each others mosque. I drew blank.

Many muslims seriously believe that western countries are supporting ISIS.

Well as long as Shia fights with Sunnis they will leave us Kaffirs alone. Peace for Christians, Hindus and Jews.

I praise Bush and Chenney for their vision. If they would not have sent US forces there , the country would have been living in peace under Sadaam. Hope Obama attacks Iraq from sky so that Shia and Sunnis keep on fighting. Iran next door will keep on sending fanatics to fight in Iraq and leave Israel alone.

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manfred
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Re: Isis - does this make any sense to anyone?

Post by manfred »

where is the other thread? I missed that....
Jesus: "Ask and you will receive." Mohammed: "Take and give me 20%"

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enceladus
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Re: Isis - does this make any sense to anyone?

Post by enceladus »

manfred wrote: (snip)
1) They are very well resourced. Where is the money coming from?

Some of it could be coming from the Saudis (given that the Saudis are Sunnis as the Isis guys are). Then again, given that Isis robbed the bank in Mosul (IIRC) and grabbed over $500 million (plus a massive amount of gold), they don't need much money from anyone else.

As far as weapons go, some of them may well have come from the stupid Americans - Obama and his fellow bumblers. They have been supplying the "rebels" in Syria, and many of those same rebels have now moved to Iraq (and kept their weapons).
manfred wrote: 2) Why can the professional army of some 500,000 men in Iraq not handle this problem? Or is there no will to do so?

Good question. They do (or did) have more than enough weapons to defeat Isis. However, I go with the "no will" scenario. Muslim armies (as opposed to insurgent groups) are well-known for their lack of fighting spirit and tendency to crumble under pressure. Israel has seen this first-hand with their victories in 1948, '67 and '73.
manfred wrote: "How are they 'radicalised' "?

The Quran will be responsible for most of that, and I'm sure that it won't have been at all hard for Isis to find a few ultra-fanatical Muslims (both in the West and in Iraq) to "top off" the Quran's work and get their fighters foaming at the mouth (at least those who weren't already like that......).

- enceladus
Undermining Islam -
http://forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=15110

Refuting "divine Quran" -
http://forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=11329

Refuting a Quran verse -
http://forum09.faithfreedom.org/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=13098

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Fernando
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Re: Isis - does this make any sense to anyone?

Post by Fernando »

manfred wrote:2) Why can the professional army of some 500,000 men in Iraq not handle this problem? Or is there no will to do so?
Of course, the long-standing tradition of Muslim armies is to attack - preferably to attack weaker victims. Defending against ravaging hordes is the opposite of that and even if they won there would be no booty or slaves to be had from their own citizens.
‘Hindus and Muslims belong to two different religious philosophies, social customs and literary traditions. They neither intermarry nor eat together, and indeed they belong to two different civilisations which are based mainly on conflicting ideas and conceptions.’ Muhammad Ali Jinnah

idesigner1
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Re: Isis - does this make any sense to anyone?

Post by idesigner1 »

Obama asked for $500 million dollars to arm Syrian Sunni moderates.

Show me a moderate Sunni!!

Chances are he will get it. Many white warrior Republican class love helping any one who is considered moderate muslims eg. Afghani sunnis against USSR, Porkistan against India, Iraqis, Yemenes, Qataris , Saudis, Kuwaitis etc.

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Fernando
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Re: Isis - does this make any sense to anyone?

Post by Fernando »

Meanwhile ISIS, suffering from delusions of grandeur, have appointed a Caliph Of All Muslims.http://www.ibtimes.co.in/caliph-all-mus ... adi-603350
That should wind up the Shia considerably!
‘Hindus and Muslims belong to two different religious philosophies, social customs and literary traditions. They neither intermarry nor eat together, and indeed they belong to two different civilisations which are based mainly on conflicting ideas and conceptions.’ Muhammad Ali Jinnah

Nosuperstition
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Re: Isis - does this make any sense to anyone?

Post by Nosuperstition »

idesigner1 wrote:Obama asked for $500 million dollars to arm Syrian Sunni moderates.

Show me a moderate Sunni!!

Chances are he will get it.
Many white warrior Republican class love helping any one who is considered moderate muslims eg. Afghani sunnis against USSR, Porkistan against India, Iraqis, Yemenes, Qataris , Saudis, Kuwaitis etc.
This strategy is exemplified in then-U. S. Senator Harry Truman's statement in 1941 regarding the Nazi invasion of Russia, "If we see that Germany is winning we ought to help Russia, and if Russia is winning we ought to help Germany, and that way let them kill as many as possible."[4]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bait_and_bleed

Perhaps it is the bait and bleed strategy at work.If the Sunnis and Shias have any iota of intelligence left in them,they should divide up the territories on the basis of majority and live in peace with one another.
palli or halli in Dravidian languages means a village just like gaav in Aryan languages means a village.palli or halli in Aryan Mauryan Imperial era around 200 B.C designates a tribal hamlet.So many of those in South India are indeed descendants of tribals and are still keeping up that heritage.

yeezevee
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Re: Isis - does this make any sense to anyone?

Post by yeezevee »

The Islamic State, ISIS 2014 Calipha Amir ul Mumineen Abu Bakr al Baghdadi - Khutbah Speech



Isis chief appears in first video
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-28177848" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, the leader of Islamist militant group Isis, has called on Muslims to obey him, in his first video sermon. Baghdadi has been appointed caliph by the jihadist group, which has seized large swathes of Iraq and Syria.

The video appears to have been filmed on Friday during a sermon at the Al-Nouri Mosque in Mosul, northern Iraq. The release of the video comes amid rumours that Baghdadi was killed or injured in an attack.

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manfred
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Re: Isis - does this make any sense to anyone?

Post by manfred »

Oh, what the world needs, another guy to obey...
Jesus: "Ask and you will receive." Mohammed: "Take and give me 20%"

yeezevee
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Re: Isis - does this make any sense to anyone?

Post by yeezevee »

manfred wrote:Oh, what the world needs, another guy to obey...
well let me add a link that translates this 21st century Calipha

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