Grooming of girls by Asian gangs fuelled by unhappy arranged

[Donnerschlag]

Grooming of girls by Asian gangs fuelled by unhappy arranged marriages to cousins claims Muslim

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... -peer.html

A senior Muslim politician has blamed unhappy arranged marriages to cousins for leading some Pakistani men to prey on vulnerable young white girls to fulfil their sexual needs.

Lord Ahmed of Rotherham, Britain’s first Muslim peer, is the first politician to make a link between first-cousin marriages and sex crimes by Pakistani men.

He has spoken out after a spate of high-profile court cases where groups of Asian men have been sentenced for grooming white girls as young as 12 in Derby, Blackburn and Lord Ahmed’s home town of Rotherham.

Lord Ahmed, who wants an end to cousin marriages, said: ‘They are forced into marriages and they are not happy. They are married to girls from overseas who they don’t have anything in common with, and they have children and a family.

‘But they are looking for fun in their sexual activities and seek out vulnerable girls.’

He said Asian men resort to abusing young white girls because they do not want meaningful relationships with adult white women.

‘An adult woman – if you are having an affair – would want your time, money and for you to break up your marriage,’ the peer added.

His comments come weeks after former Foreign Secretary Jack Straw provoked national outrage by saying that some Pakistani men look at white girls as ‘easy meat’ for sexual abuse.

Labour peer Lord Ahmed said: ‘I get a lot of criticism from Asian people who ask, “How can you say this about Asian men?” But they must wake up and realise there is a problem.

‘I am deeply worried about this as it has happened in my own backyard, and in Rochdale and Bradford.

‘This didn’t happen in my or my father’s generation. This is happening among young Asians. While I respect individual choice, I think the community needs to look at marriages in the UK rather than cousin marriages or economic marriages from abroad.’

Studies have shown that 55 per cent of British Pakistanis marry their first cousins, usually from abroad. In Bradford, the figure is as high as 75 per cent.

Although marriages between first cousins is lawful in Britain, it is frowned upon by many who see it as a form of incest. In America, the practice is illegal in 30 states.

First-cousin marriages among other British Muslim groups such as Bangladeshis or Indians are less prevalent.

Earlier this month, two ringleaders of a Pakistani gang in Derby were given indeterminate jail terms for grooming 26 white girls aged between 12 and 18 after plying them with alcohol and drugs.

Mohammed Liaqat, 28, and Abid Saddique, 27, were jailed for a minimum of 11 and eight years respectively for charges which included rape.

Both had wives through arranged marriages and had young children with them. In Rotherham, a gang of five Asian men were jailed in November for grooming white girls as young as 12.

Since 1997, 56 people with an average age of 28 have been convicted of offences related to on-street grooming of girls aged 11 to 16. Of these, three were white and the rest Asian, of whom 50 were Muslim, with the majority British Pakistani.

A Home Office spokesman said: ‘We should not jump to form conclusions about national patterns of offending without further analysis.’

Health experts have previously warned British Pakistanis to reduce the number of cousin marriages as it is leading to a high number of genetic birth defects in the community.

Lord Ahmed was briefly expelled from Labour after he served 16 days in prison in 2009 for sending text messages at the wheel before a fatal crash.

Lord Ahmed, who wants an end to cousin marriages, said: ‘They are forced into marriages and they are not happy. They are married to girls from overseas who they don’t have anything in common with, and they have children and a family.

‘But they are looking for fun in their sexual activities and seek out vulnerable girls.

That is no excuse my dear Lord.A lot of people have an unhappy marriage or are single but they don't go round raping young girls.

[alemcodon]

ok so you've found one case of an asian gang grooming young girls..btw i doubt any of you guys are from uk but young white girls roaming the streets trying to make money has been goin on for a long time and is an increasing problem in all major cities, these asians might have been using them for sex and money but they didnt put the girls on the streets.

Its the social structure and 'council estate' lifestyle, parents who are drug and alcohol abusers who dont give their children a 2nd thought, which is why their 12yr old daughters are wandering the streets.

Only a few weeks i myself was approached by a 15yr old girl asking me if i wanted 'business' at 4am, i didnt ask her, i didnt follow her, i didnt supply her drugs, i didnt drag her out ther house and put her there either, few days later i seen in the news about a 15yr old girl who ran away from home after an argument with her father, and it was her!! her father was a drunk, they lived a shitty lifestyle, and for her the only way for her to feed herself on the streets was to sell herself....this ship is all too common around here.

You wouldnt see asian muslims girls doing that why?!?!? because they are looked after by their parents, you guys can call it suppressing womens rights, but i wander how many of you would let your 14-15yr old daughters wander the ghettos at 4am?!?!?

N0o muslim put her on the street, and if shes's wandering around at 4am in the ghettos, someone will take advanatge of her.

You guys think muslim fathers abuse their daughter, but muslim fathers give thei daughters EVERYTHING they can. When i got married, my wifes father spent his whole life savings on gold for her, about $50,000 worht of gold, just for her. Her father wouldnt let her spend 1penny on the house from her wages, made sure she saved every penny she earnt herself, and spent his own money on household bills. He would also systematically give her $2000-$3000 whenever he accumulated it, by the time she was 21 she had $40,000 saved in her own bank account. her father was a taxi driver btw...so its not like he earns more $20,000 annually.


So you found a handful of abuse cases, these guys might have been born muslim but i really really doubt any of them are practicing muslims, in fact i kNOW their not. These guys are the products of the glorified hip hop culture...

This story you mention.....

There have been 17 court prosecutions since 1997 with 56 men found guilty of rape, child abduction, indecent assault and sex with a child
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... z1CX6SdRjR" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;




http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source ... HQ&cad=rja

There are at least 47,000 rapes annually in the UK. Therefore since 1997...there have been...47,000x13years = 611,000 Rapes in UK (between '97 and '10)

OK so 17 of the prosecuted rapes were done by asian males, who did the other 610,983 rapes the? obviously their not important to your racist assess cus their were white christian males (and females), and you cant blame muslims for that, in fact, bin laden himself musta have held an rpg to their heads and MAKE them commit those crimes....makes perfect sense.

• A third (34%) of people in the UK believe that a woman is partially or totally responsible for being raped...

• More than a quarter (26%) of people think a woman was partially or totally responsible for being raped if she was wearing sexy or revealing clothing

So much for fukced up muslim attituted about womens dress....

Now for a few cases of JESUS FORGIVING CHRSITIANS FOR THEIR SINS...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/nov/2 ... men-jailed

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/arti ... le-ring.do

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews ... rn false;

In the United States, churches have paid more than $2 billion in compensation to victims

The team reported that 10,667 people in the US had made allegations of child sexual abuse between 1950 and 2002 against 4,392 priests….

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic_sex_abuse_cases

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/arti ... priests.do

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2011/ ... hild-abuse


US 'worst' for online child abuse
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/5195460.stm

online child porn ring smashed
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/4811196.stm


CHILD ABUSE CONTENT
USA: 51.1%
Russia: 14/9%
Japan: 11.7%
Spain: 8.8%
Thailand: 3.6%
South Korea: 2.16%
UK: 0.2%
Other: 7.5%

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/BRITAIN%2 ... a060290695

The report found a staggering 650 children were abused at homes in north Wales….
Its funyn how the asian sex gans 100 alleged victoms were the 'WORST CASE OF ABUSE THIS COUNTRY HAS SEEN'....but 650 children being abused in their homes, in a sparsely populated wales doesnt even make national news....
http://www.thefreelibrary.com/I%27LL+NA ... a060293636

In one case, a boy was forced to lick excrement from a priest's shoe….
http://www.thefreelibrary.com/KID+HOMES ... 0200213271

The IT consultant convinced four women - Vanessa George, 40, Tracy Lyons, 41, Tracy Dawber, 44, and Angela Allen, 40 - to sexually assault young children and share the indecent images with him….

http://www.channel4.com/news/man-in-pae ... ing-jailed

And surely the case of these asian males cant be as bad as as nursery staff taking pictures and abusing BABIES....and then sharing pictures with people over the internet, and recriuting more women to help their cause....NO NO NO, the asian males cases are much worse.

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/arti ... le-ring.do

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/UK-New ... 1215451567

http://www.metro.co.uk/news/444470-boy- ... sex-lesson

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/arti ... -mother.do

Paedophile raped boy he met in gay chatroom
http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-529.html/


Quite clearly the conviction of the 17 rape cases by 50 asian males is big concern for this country.

Evidence also quite clearly shows that the white christian men who were reponsible for the other 610,983 rapes in the UK over the same period,
have alot more respect and honour towards a womans dignity, they didnt look at the girls they raped as meat, thye look at em as young female daughters of their fellow british brethren, therefore we can only conclude that these rapes have been in fact committed by muslims disguised as white english males.

And quite clearly the biggest problem UK faces is ONE gang of asian males who are grooming white girls....

but the fact that the countries broke, and parents are not bothered about sending their daughters out at 4am is not a problem, british families benefits are being cut because we'd rather fund a war, while destroying families on low incomes but thats not the biggest issues we face, the big issue is ONE GANG of asian males grooming our white women, somewhere in derby, the most posh and upperclass area of the UK, where getting drunk and high of drugs ISNT part of the culture....

These must be the same people that popularised and glrofied the 'niche' culture and underground raves, they must also be the people that own and run the MASSIVE undercover illegal 'raves' where EVERY drug is available, and if your not taking pills, you're seen as a loner. these muslim male must be putting guns in our poor defenesless white population heads and forcing them to take these drugs
forcing our children into schizo's.

[Lili]

And quite clearly the biggest problem UK faces is ONE gang of asian males who are grooming white girls....

Alemcodon, yes, the original poster found an article about that ONE gang and reporting the issue. Do you have a problem with it? Or does having people of other religions being guilty of similar crimes make it OK for British Pakistani Muslims to engage it rape and pedophilia? I mean, it's just that one gang, right? The Brits should probably apologize to them and thank them for not making white Brits the only criminals in the country.

On a second thought, don't Pakistanis REALLY view white women as an easy prey? Just be honest for once and answer me.

[Sten]

Of COURSE, Alemcodon. Why didn't we think of it before? It's obviously the fault of the girls, their parents, British society, you name it - but it's definitely not the fault of the Pakistanis committing the crimes. They are only innocent victims of circumstance, eh?

Don't forget to repeat the Islamic mantra - It's everyone else's fault, it's everyone else's fault, it's everyone else's fault. Maybe if you say it enough times, it will come true and your religion and everyone attached to it will magically become civilized, modern, and non-mysogynistic!

[diotima64]

We DO have plenty of problems in the West, that much IS true... but still the men abusing 12 year olds JUST BECAUSE THEY CAN are the one at fault for THEIR actions. Also, there are many such stories OUTSIDE the UK - and in many such cases, the girls involved were NOT the ones from council-estate-dysfuctional-alcohol-abuse-families, but well-looked after, middle-class girls, just at a vulnerable moment in their life.
Also - I dón´t think "unhappy marriages" are behind this. An unhappy marriage doesn´t turn any regular man into a pimp of 12 year olds!

[RichardTheLionheart]

.
CHILD ABUSE CONTENT
USA: 51.1%
Russia: 14/9%
Japan: 11.7%
Spain: 8.8%
Thailand: 3.6%
South Korea: 2.16%
UK: 0.2%
Other: 7.5%

Judging by those figures Britain has less of a problem than many other countries.

Child abuse does happen, no one is denying that. However what disgusts me about these Muslims gangs is : The authorities knew about it and yet chose to ignore it and brush it under the carpet out of fear of being accused as racists etc... The fact that you alemcodon and Lord Ahmed are playing the race card here and trying to blame the victims and looking for excuses on behalf of the vermin that committed these crimes just shows how carefully the police have to tread.

And the same is true for investigating Islamic terrorism in the UK.

[Sten]

We DO have plenty of problems in the West, that much IS true... but still the men abusing 12 year olds JUST BECAUSE THEY CAN are the one at fault for THEIR actions.

The religion started by a guy who married a child probably doesn't help either.

[alemcodon]

chaps

im not saying these guys are saints, their scum.

im not saying everyone else to blame....my point is there are far bigger problems in UK, dunno how many of you guys are from UK but social structure here is totally breaking down, and these are the root causes of incidents like above.

im not defending those guys, but i dnt hear anything contrsuctive from anyone about we could avoid above circumstances, i feel more sorry for the girls that any of you guys do, trust me, you guys dnt have no sympathy, ur all heartless just tryna find something to fuel ur hate..nothing about morals, or sympathies.

just ;last night i seen a working girl bopsing along ladypool road, btw she was english white, young probably only 18/19. now she wlil get abused by someone womehere, she was high as a kite, whoever abuses her IS SCUM.

but its our society as whole thats deteriorating that allows for sh*t like this to happen, if she recieved enough on her income support or jobseekers to survive, she wouldnt be trying to sell herself on the street, but youd rather spend your taxes on killing people on the other side of the world, and watch ur daughters sell themselves, than spend those taxes on feeding your children

or should i say, youd rather spend your taxes so george bush and his cronies can get rich on oil and construction contracts, even if it means your daughters will sell themselves on the streets as DIRECT result of cuts in benefits.

all the benefits in thuis country are gone down, government contracts have been cancelled, people are losing their jobs, the sterling value is collapsing by the minute, our interest rates are almost 0, and most of it is due to funding the war on terrorism.

7/7 wasnt done by muslims, but even if you think it was, uk decided to join americas war, why? theyve got the money, and the artillery, the dollar and control over all the arabs states, worlds oil supplies are sold in $, thereefore ensuring a strong $ for years to come even if US economy collapses....

...so why did threy need us, why are we taking away money from every person in this nation to fund this stupid war?

we not like america, we dnt sell cocaine and guns for money, we're broke ass since ww2, we cant just print off bank notes like america does, we cant take loans that dont exist and pump omney into our economy.

blair decided to take UK into the war, now lets see how many blame him when their daughters resort to selling themselves on the streets.

then ASIAN guys that did thjis are scum, but their defo not muslim, no proper muslim would ever do sh*t like thattheir just ghetto kids, and thats the sorta sh*t you get in ghettos worldwide.

and for your information pakis dnt look at white girls as easy meat...bull crap.

jack straw, how much time as he spent with pakis, or ni any ghettos that he can get up n say sh*t like that? same as you their just filled by fantasy from newspapers with no real life experiance wotsoever.

as i said before, send you wife thorugh sparkhill, then send her through black area like handsworth, and COUNT how many times she got apporached by horny men....then comment on who looks at ur women as meat.

[alemcodon]

better still, why doesnt someone conduct a survey and ask the working girls themselves who are their pimps....i already know the answers but you guys wnt take my word for it, so conduct a survey yourselves.


i promise you my estimates will be 75% accurate...

>50% will say black guy who is also their crack dealer
>20% will say old white woman who owns a sauna
>10% wil say romanian pimp
>19.999% independant
>0.00001? will be 'other' - not even paki or muslim

now go ask all the prostitutes.....

[sum]

Hello alemcodon

There is more than a strong suspicion that the muslims who perpetrated the offences were strongly influenced by the Islamic attitude towards women. This sets them apart from all people of other religions.

sum

[Lili]

better still, why doesnt someone conduct a survey and ask the working girls themselves who are their pimps....i already know the answers but you guys wnt take my word for it, so conduct a survey yourselves.


i promise you my estimates will be 75% accurate...

>50% will say black guy who is also their crack dealer
>20% will say old white woman who owns a sauna
>10% wil say romanian pimp
>19.999% independant
>0.00001? will be 'other' - not even paki or muslim

now go ask all the prostitutes.....

You know, alemcodon, I've been reading your posts and you do have a point sometimes, but most of the time it seems as if you are a bit uninformed, or perhaps, you are a lucky person who manages to avoid all the sh*t from happening to you. Or may be the things that you consider normal, would scare the hell out of a person from the West.

I don't know how you came up with your estimates. Since I can only speak from my own experience, I'd say the percentages depend on the country. I am from Russia, and I can honestly say that most people involved in human trafficking are from the North Caucasus, and yes, they are muslim. After the USSR collapsed, Chechens, Azeris, etc. sort of made a habit of killing off non-muslim families that lived in their neighborhoods and sending the younger women to sexual slavery. Of course, since the world is used to Russia being the bad guy, they couldn't possibly report any of that. Later in the nineties, those guys spread through the former Soviet republics in Eastern Europe and kidnapped thousands more women for the same purpose. I was still a kid at the time, but I do personally know SEVERAL women that were driven to countries like Turkey, Saudi Arabia, UAE and never returned. The madness stopped when Putin came to power, though.

In your earlier post, you were talking about the British society deteriorating, degrading, etc. Please breathe. The Brits are just fine, as are many more Western nations. They do produce bad eggs every once in a while, but luckily the law enforcement works well in the West, and those nasties are dealt with.

On the other hand, the corrupt nations like most muslim countries and even my native Russia are the ones that really have a huge problem, and be rest assured, Islam is not going to solve it. If anything, Islam is going to make it worse. I urge you to show me ONE muslim country that's not corrupt, where you can truly rely on law enforcement to set things right when you have been unjustly harmed.

You said your country has been broke since WWII. Why's that? 65 years is enough time to set the country on the right track. Heck, Russia's lost 27 frickin' million in that horrific war, yet we managed to rebuild the country, feed and educate the people, all under that nasty, evil commie regime. After the collapse of the USSR and 10 years in limbo, we again managed to regain a lot of our power, again without Islam! So what's Pakistan's problem? Don't you all have Islam, the best thing that can happen to anyone?

[alemcodon]

Hi Lilly

Thanks for a normal reply wot normal people might expect instead of the usual sheiBe we see around here. the rest of you - see its possible to criticise without insulting.

Unfortunately i am from the west!! i was born and bred in the UK.

Im sorry to hear about your friends that went missing, them guys might have been 'muslim' but they were definately not acting within islamic teachings, despite the verse people throw around about slave girls and wot not, but the verse does only say 'what your right hand possess', then people like cassie and co add brackets and use lyrics likt booty of war, slave girls, paedophile etc).

you being Russian you should be more than familiar with the propaganda tactics against Russia, then it was about bringing downb the USSR, since USSR was a threat to world dominance for the USA, now its about preventing the muslim nations from re-uniting, divide and conquer!!! they did it in USSR, they did to islamic empire, but they sense islamic empire about to re-unite, so they want to prevent it in order to keep control of the oil exports out of the arab world - which is by far the most valuable land on earth.

nearly every Arab nation has a dictatorship, no elections, all kings and princes n sh*t, but why doesnt 'operation enduring freedom' go and liberate the tunisians, or the egyptions, or the jordanians? or the saudis? because they already kiss americas ass, so their not evil, even tho their dictatorships.

They sell oil in dollars, thus helping american economy, then deposit those americans dollars into american banks (which later declare bankruptcy and money vanishes). Sadam wanted to sell oil in Yens and Euros, which was a threat to the dollar, thats why he was evil, in reality he was no better or worse than the other arab leaders, he just didnt wanna bow down to the usa - so they killed him.

Ill be honest i dont know too much about the russian situation, but definately what those guys were doing is wrong, and any proper practicing muslim would agree, they probably did it out of hate and anger, hate and anger can drive poeple to do things which even the devil would probably be ashmed of - just listen to the homocidal fantasies wot the people on this website have no hesitation in expressing - its sickening to the bone. thats wot happens when people are driven by hate and anger.

You're russian? you know fedor!! (my hero) - no hate, no anger, calm, collected, result = superior!!

Corruption is a disease in nearly every government, most muslim governments are corrupt because their not really muslims, same as how hitler wasnt really christian, or george bush even.

In my eyes the usa is the most corrupt nation on earth, russia may have been bad in the past, but not anymore, their not invading no-ones land, their not killing anyone, they not robbing anyones wealth, america is doign all 3, just because they wear suites and ties, and attend all these fancy meetings, doesnt mean their good, they just know how to hide and lie,

I agree pakistan is very corrupt, but i promise you, NONE of those polititians are proper muslim, and i know some of them polititians personally. the currrent paki president is my uncles friend, criminals born and bred, drug dealers, murderers, but they accept money from usa and give them help on the war in afghanistan, therefore america loves em, they dnt care if their corrupt domestically, they only care that they get what they want.

Iran is not corrupt - despite what the western media tells you, iran is far from corrupt - you might say stoning this and some women who commited adultry that, or nuclear this and mullah that.

ok they may have strict judicial laws (btw that woman was convicted for murder, not just adultry - and more women are presecuted/executed in the usa than iran)

iraq before war wasnt corrupt, its was a exotic well built modern developed country, until america destroyed almsot every building there...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iy4uDGJmMWE



i used to have a Kuwaitee friend, he told me when sadam invaded not one innocent person was harmed, sadam only invaded kuwait because they made a deal to sell sh*t loads of oil to america for virtually free - sadam didnt like that the other arab nations had already sold out to USA, allowing them to build military bases all around arabia, this was way before 9/11, usa has been preparing to invade the oil rich arab nations since the 80's, i knew before bucket loads of oil was discovered in iraq, before 9/11 that america would invade iraq and iran - how could i have possibly known their intentions before they even did it?

why was usa so adament on building hundreds of military bases in the arab world? have you ever seen a map of military bases in arabia before 9/11? they were ready and waiting to strike for a long long time.

Turkey isnt corrupt (relatively) - countries like jordan and kuwait are not corrupt - except they sold out to usa.

Taliban wasnt corrupt in afghanistam, they cut heroine production by 95%, only thing bad they did was make women wear scarves (not full hijaab/niqaab/burka), only scarves!! and the there were no girls schools cus afghanistan barely had resources for schools at all, there were no girls schools before taliban, and there are still no girls schools AFTER the taliban UNDER AMERICAN CONTROL STILL NO GIRLS SCHOOLS (thas not their doing) - and if you really think that cavemen from afghan mountains hijacked and crashed in 9/11 i suggets you do some research on the actual hijackers themselves, find me some cctv of them at airports....airports werent blown up, wheres the cctv? cctv of plane going into pentagon, find it?!?!

Reality is most muslims countries are in the 3rd world, 3rd world countries corruption is always ripe, ie eastern europe, africa, parts of asia, some of these counties are muslims, some are christian, some are nothing or everything - its not the religion that made them corrupt, its the lack of it.

indonesia, malaysia? their relatively not corrupt, bangladesh, canada!! lol (will be majority muslim population in 20-30yrs).

when people are broke, they resort to desperate measures, the palestinians werent corrupt until israel got made...even now i wouldnt call them corrupt - they fight for basic human rights which they still dont have. my home country kashmir wasnt corrupt intil the pakis and indians started fighting over it.

uk isnt that bad, but in 15-20yrs it will be bad, currently its deteriorating slowly, many people are losing their jobs, when i work last yr there 500 poeple, government cut costts, contracts got cancelled, we went down to like 50 people in the whole office,,!!! lots of people have lost their jobs!!

standard of living has dropped rapidly last 5 yrs, i earn about £30k, before anything i get taxed about £8000-£9000 annually, then theres 20% vat on everything we buy take out another £4000 from wot i have left. fuel has 80% tax, £300 a month average to fuel taxes (x12 = £3600 for tax). add another £1000 for council tax.

so before i even buy toilet paper to clean my bum im being taxed 9+4+3.5+1= £17000-£18000.

Rent for my flat is £450 a month (sh*tty 1 bed flat) = £5400 annually add about £3000 for electric and gas (so thats about £26k of my wages gone before i even bought any food).

my car is worth £500, the insurance companies (regulated by the government) want £7500 to insure it!!! 7grand to insure a £500 car, if thats not a desperate country what is?

most months i struggle, i usually have to go 2 weeks just eating bread cus i cant afford proper food, and im an IT consultant earnig double the average wage in this country!!

and 3 days ago they announced more increase in taxes!! this is the price we pay to fund USA's thirst for oil.

The law enforcement in this country is a joke, the dnt care about crime, the just try to make more money, they set up road side checks weekly purely just trying to fine drivers for stupid things like mot, tyres, lights etc. when theres a murder, or a rape, their not interested, i got shot at by a thief, and when we call police they didnt turn up for 1hr. if you call the police and tell them theres a paki with a spliff the whole army turns up.

5 days ago there was a massive gang fight, police came, flashed their lights and drove off, people were getting stabbed!!! they wnt make money from real criminals, real criminals cost money.

they dnt look for drugs, or stolen goods, just trying to issue fines to generate revenue. ive been in these checks with drugs and/or potential weapons in the car, but they would fine me for small lettering on my numberplate and let me go!!!

[peoshi]

most months i struggle, i usually have to go 2 weeks just eating bread cus i cant afford proper food,

Then how did you plan on paying someone 100,000 dollars to memorize Sherlock Holmes?

The book i propose is The Adventures of Sherlock Holmes (Arthur Conan Doyle, published 1892). This book is only half the size of the quraan (100,000 words as opposed to 170,000). You could choose your own book if you want, maybe something your a bit more familiar with - but should be at least 80,000 words making it only half the size of the quraan.

if anyone can accomplish this task i will personally give them $100,000 dollars in cash.

Were you lying then or are you lying now?

ive been in these checks with drugs and/or potential weapons in the car, but they would fine me for small lettering on my numberplate and let me go!!

So which are you...dealer or addict?

[Sten]

Were you lying then or are you lying now?

I would be surprised if anything he says is true.

[Lili]

@ alemcodon,

Thank you for your reply. I appreciate you explaining your point of view without insults, yet very thoroughly. I must say I agree with you on many points here, the most important one being huge world-wide corruption. I have personally met several representatives of Pakistani government, and you are absolutely correct -- Islam is the last thing on their mind.

The same applies to Saudi officials to an even greater extent, yet they are keen on exporting the "Islamic revival" to muslim countries and give the impoverished muslims world wide an idea that Islam will stop their troubles. Somehow I am afraid it will do more bad than good in most places. Again, I am only judging by my own experience of living in a multi-cultural society where religion was strictly a private matter. After the Soviet Union seized to exist, the "divide and conquer" politics came to Russia and it's been having devastating effects so far. Guess what they used to divide the people? That's right, religion. I am angry with Saudis who fund that mess with generous American petrodollars. I do understand the oppressed, poor muslims' desire for some kind of justice and order, and they see the light in reverting to Islam. Somehow, I am afraid it will bring only more poverty and oppression to muslim lands in the long run, with lazy, egocentric Saudis gaining millions of undereducated slaves.

My hopes for Islamic world lie with Iran. Although they are living under a religious doctrine right now, they pay a great deal of attention to scientific progress and education. With so many young, hard working intellectuals in the country, I hope they overcome the shackles of theocracy and achieve even more progress while still preserving their great Persian culture.

[iffo]

@ alemcodon,

Thank you for your reply. I appreciate you explaining your point of view without insults, yet very thoroughly. I must say I agree with you on many points here, the most important one being huge world-wide corruption. I have personally met several representatives of Pakistani government, and you are absolutely correct -- Islam is the last thing on their mind.

The same applies to Saudi officials to an even greater extent, yet they are keen on exporting the "Islamic revival" to muslim countries and give the impoverished muslims world wide an idea that Islam will stop their troubles. Somehow I am afraid it will do more bad than good in most places. Again, I am only judging by my own experience of living in a multi-cultural society where religion was strictly a private matter. After the Soviet Union seized to exist, the "divide and conquer" politics came to Russia and it's been having devastating effects so far. Guess what they used to divide the people? That's right, religion. I am angry with Saudis who fund that mess with generous American petrodollars. I do understand the oppressed, poor muslims' desire for some kind of justice and order, and they see the light in reverting to Islam. Somehow, I am afraid it will bring only more poverty and oppression to muslim lands in the long run, with lazy, egocentric Saudis gaining millions of undereducated slaves.

My hopes for Islamic world lie with Iran. Although they are living under a religious doctrine right now, they pay a great deal of attention to scientific progress and education. With so many young, hard working intellectuals in the country, I hope they overcome the shackles of theocracy and achieve even more progress while still preserving their great Persian culture.

let them have N-technology then.

[Lili]

let them have N-technology then.

Please stop stalking me, it's no longer funny and does not contribute to the discussion. Keep your student-teacher jokes to yourself, too. They have nothing to do with dangers of Islam, except may be proving me right.

I clearly said I wish for young generation of Iranians to "overcome the shackles of theocracy" first and then develop whatever it is they want. Hey, evil USSR had developed tons of nukes, and look, we are all still alive.

[alemcodon]

Hi Lili

Thank YOU for your reply, i liked your last post, and it shows there is some logic and decency floating around this place.

In a way im glad you have met some paki government officials so you can say with confidence, their have absolutely nothing to do with islam. There is alot of corruption in pakistan, and its one of the reasons why so many proper muslims are against the the government, not because they want to see sharia law imposed there - because they want to see an end to corruption.

Musharaf lost alot of popularity while he was in power, but i think now most paki's have realised he wasnt too bad and would like to have seen him back in power - the current leader zardari is a hardened criminal, again has nothing to do with islam, he's a drug dealing murdering mafia boss.

its quite well known too, he only got into power because his wife (Bhutto) was murdered, and it was him that ordered his wifes assassination - because the last time she was in power, he used her power to make millions, expanded his opreations in the drugs game, had rival drug dealers assassinated too, and got his wifes name tarnished with corruption.

So when she wanted to run for prime minister again, she made sure he had nothing to do with his campaign, so he killed her, and because hes her husband, and they have a son, it was almost a guaranteed victory for their PPP party, and it was....

these peple do not have religion on their minds, if they did, and they had any fear of god, they would commit such atrocities.

Saudies too are a lost cause, i didnt know they fund operations in Russia, and to be honest id be surprised if that really was the case. They probably do get money from some arabs, but defo not the kings/royal family since they only bow to american orders...

but then again....its hard to say sometimes whos on what side and why?

its been proven on a good few occasions so called sunni/shi'ite battles it iraq were in fact british/american agents instigating war, they want to create civil unrest as this prevents social and economic progression. Same in pakistan and india, hindu religious leaders have admitted numerous bombings at mosques and trains etc...

and in pakistan alot of american agents have been arrested with remote controlled devices whenever a bomb is going off, apparently they would grab a homless peasant witha beard (because he cant afford to shave), they would drug them up, strap em with explosives which would have a remote detonation, send them into a crowded area/mosque etc....activate the bomb via remote....then scream to the whole world, taiban is taking over pakistan, giving them the perfect reason to invade pakistan next...

They would be doing the same thing in iran, but the iranians are smart..they wouldnt let americans inside their country so easily, the pakis, you just give them money and they would do anything.

I agree with you the hope for the islamic world is iran, and its also the reason its public enemy number 1 right now, i dnt know how iran is perceived in russia but in UK they are nothing short of evil.

I know in the past iran and russia have enjoyed good trade relations and i hope this continues as both countries can benefit each other greatly.

you might disagree with me but science is a core part of islam, others may laugh at that statement, and tis true in todays world it seems far from reality, but knowledge and science is as important as prayer in islam, and many muslims even today do not realise that - but many do, like the iranians.

you only have to learn abit of history to see the achievments they enjoyed in the past, its not about who invesnted it first, they sought knowlegde from all corners of the globe and tried to prgress on it, not for competiveness or to boast about it, but to benefit their societies and its occupants as a whole.

I dont think you should worry about the 'islamic revival'....the only coutnry in the world today that had anything of the sort is iran - and you can see the successs they've enjoyed, without civil unrest and without foreign occupation and/or foreign intervention that have been able to get back to what really matters, progress, currently iran has a much bigger motor industry than the UK!! their even making mercedes now, and making huge leaps is science developing what even most western countries do not have.

iraq was actually not that far behind iran until the sanctions and wars started, saddam had a good deal going on with the japs, and the country was fully devleoped, it was not a 3rd world country how you would imagine - and that was british journalists who were saying that.

peoshi...

im a drug dealing drug addict.

if anyone can complete 'the challenge'...TUN TUN TERRRNNN!!! i will raise the 100,000 dnt you worry. i could sell my soul to the devil (like you) or just do a couple of crops.....

[StrongLove]

OK,OK all the personal bul*%hit aside.............They marry FIRST cousins? That could cause genetic problems in an entire society especially if it was perpetrated multigenerational!

[RichardTheLionheart]

uk isnt that bad, but in 15-20yrs it will be bad, currently its deteriorating slowly, many people are losing their jobs, when i work last yr there 500 poeple, government cut costts, contracts got cancelled, we went down to like 50 people in the whole office,,!!! lots of people have lost their jobs!!

standard of living has dropped rapidly last 5 yrs, i earn about £30k, before anything i get taxed about £8000-£9000 annually, then theres 20% vat on everything we buy take out another £4000 from wot i have left. fuel has 80% tax, £300 a month average to fuel taxes (x12 = £3600 for tax). add another £1000 for council tax.

so before i even buy toilet paper to clean my bum im being taxed 9+4+3.5+1= £17000-£18000.

Rent for my flat is £450 a month (sh*tty 1 bed flat) = £5400 annually add about £3000 for electric and gas (so thats about £26k of my wages gone before i even bought any food).

my car is worth £500, the insurance companies (regulated by the government) want £7500 to insure it!!! 7grand to insure a £500 car, if thats not a desperate country what is?

most months i struggle, i usually have to go 2 weeks just eating bread cus i cant afford proper food, and im an IT consultant earnig double the average wage in this country!!

and 3 days ago they announced more increase in taxes!! this is the price we pay to fund USA's thirst for oil.

The law enforcement in this country is a joke, the dnt care about crime, the just try to make more money, they set up road side checks weekly purely just trying to fine drivers for stupid things like mot, tyres, lights etc. when theres a murder, or a rape, their not interested, i got shot at by a thief, and when we call police they didnt turn up for 1hr. if you call the police and tell them theres a paki with a spliff the whole army turns up.

5 days ago there was a massive gang fight, police came, flashed their lights and drove off, people were getting stabbed!!! they wnt make money from real criminals, real criminals cost money.

they dnt look for drugs, or stolen goods, just trying to issue fines to generate revenue. ive been in these checks with drugs and/or potential weapons in the car, but they would fine me for small lettering on my numberplate and let me go!!!

Do you live in Luton? Or a similar town nearby?