You are not only a moron but also a fraud.
How can i be a fraud when i never made any claims about myself?? See?? See what an idiot you are making of yourself?? And you claim that people pay you to make an arss of yourself like this and we are supposed to believe that??
You are a liar. You are an intellectually dishonest person.
You're just trying to call me that because I caught you lying. You're so stupid that you didn't think someone would see that you were lying right away. And now, you are so illogical that you think you can merely attempt the childish saying "I know you are but what am I". Every word yuou use for me, is actually an admittance of how you see yourself. you know you lied and got caught, so now I am a liar. You know you are frustrated, so now I am frustrated.
Muhammad bin Lyin wrote:
Doesn't ones wisdom (or perceived wisdom) merely come from their experiences (environment) and their mental abilities and/or genetic predispositions?
That wisdom is then part of the OPTIONS (experiences, environment, etc). There's no Free Will involved in the world of options or contingency. It stems from an -original- action once the options (static) are left over in the course of acting.
Free Will is instantaneous
. It can only exist in the present, not in the past-future equation.
I agreed that these would be the only conditions that free will could exist in if it existed, and you didn't read the part where I asked him whether the actions that he thinks are spontaneous are really spontaneous. So once again, you have twisted, incomplete information. You are the cross eyed moron, who can't follow the conversation properly once again.
Mohammad BIn Lying the liar,
And, you are shown to be wrong again. Don't you get tired of continually being shown to be wrong? I would.
MBL wrote:Love comes as a result of an understanding or a truth suddenly sighted as a result of a certain attitude towards one's self, life, and people in general.
..and what is understanding?
How can we truly know? How can we "understand" understanding itself? That is like the knife cutting itself or the tooth biting itself.
That is like the knife cutting itself or the tooth biting itself
Your above statement doesn’t say anything. It is gibberish as found in Quranic and Biblical texts.
No it's not in the Bible or the Quran. Show me where since you claim it is. You can't because that has it's roots in Eastern thought. So yet again, you are wrong. Wow, do you say anything
that is actually correct??
You will see below how rational mind define “understanding".
You owe me for educating you on this.
Abdul the fool. I owe you for the good laughs you provide, but that's about all.
Muhammad bin Lyin wrote:
"Understanding” if it is it not a reconfiguration of your neural network (memory) via electrochemical actions in your brain then what is it?
It could sure seem
“Could” “Sure” in the same sentence, in the context they are contradictory.
You mean someone can't say "I could be sure about it if I.....??? What an arss.
Your Islamic upbringing taqya, double talk.
I was raised as a Catholic in the US. WOW, you get EVERYTHING wrong. It's almost like it's a talent for you. If I were a former Muslim, do you think i would equate a turban with a diaper in my avatar?? What is the matter with your head?? It's blinking right in front of you and you don't even notice. Anybody with the least amount of common sense could know that i was never a Muslim and never an Arab, Persian, Egyptian, Indian....If I was, i certainly wouldn't be making fun of turbans and long beards.
There is no other better way to define “Understanding”. than this....
Abdul wrote:As one cross checks his/her ideas from many different angles more valid neural connections are established and invalid connections are taken down. An “Understood Mind” can retrieve his/her memory/idea from many different angles, or can be triggered by far more things than a non understood mind. However, understood indoctrinated mind, both can recite the same result.
More valid connection in the brain, least invalid connection in the brain, produces a coherent brain, an understood brain. This brain will be able to process information far faster than others and get to the truth a lot quicker.
There is no mystery there. It is very simple to me.
You don't think I've seen that definition before??
The person cannot think deeply enough about the problem. He thinks he's right and you think he's right, because you both have a very narrow focus in your thinking. It's not wrong, it's merely incomplete. So i'm sure to you, that this definition seems perfectly fine.
But you were so weak to acknowledge that.
I'm weak when I acknowledge something??? Do you get free internet access at the mental hospital you are writing from?
It could sure seem that way.
That is a very weak statement of yours. Weak statements come from weak mind.
One speaks firmly only about black and white issues or "self evident" truths.
Irrationality can come as Allah or Ghost Or Free Will or Alien Abduction, Astrology. You have no rights to make fun of Islam while you yourself using the crutch of superstition of Free Will.
I never said free will necessarily exists and have merely said the conditions that must exist for free will to be able to exist. In order for free will to be able to exist, XYZ cionditions would have to be met. That's precisely what I have been saying this entire time, but you still can't get that through your thick head. You need absolute black and whites because that's all your limited focus can understand.
Muhammad bin Lyin wrote:Where?? Quote the sentence. I never once said it necessarily exists and merely claimed the necessary conditions that would have to exist before it could. But you have such strong, preconceived notions about everything, that you simply cannot see when someone is telling you this. You do not see things as they are, you see them as you are. Perhaps, you're nose was buried in the Quran in the past and that you think that's over now that it isn't buried in the Quran and is instead buried in science. But an education in philosophy is very important as well. Science gives you information, philosophy and logic teaches you how to think. This is what you need right now.
Smart people judges other’s arguments not only by what they say but what they did not say. If you do not pass a more accurate statement when it was available to you then you are either do not understand or playing deception. Here is the proof:
Muhammad bin Lyin wrote:The only way there can be free will is if someone no longer acts with their perceived self interest in mind.
You should have said. “No one has free will. Free Will is an illusion. Period.”
But that would mean that it is impossible for one to behave in any other way other than in their own self interest, and i am not convinced that this is impossible. That is the crux of the argument and we've been here about 6 times now. you claim that's impossible and I don't. So why are we still discussing this retard?? What does it take with you? Why are you so thick?
You need to understand, that your interest or not, you can’t do anything other than what nature will do you.
You can decide to react in the most likely way that meets your perceived self interest and that would be the expected, deterministic reaction. But, someone can decide to not serve their self interest, and that would break the last link on the deterministic chain right at it's most important part, the human reaction. Although the latter seems odd, I don't think it's impossible. When people stop perceiving themselves and their needs as the center of the universe and instead perceive themselves as a satellite, then it could be possible.
You can’t even think without nature making you think. There is no IFs. No BUTs, period.
Well, one certainly needs the tools. That much can be said. And BTW, all of your no IFs, no BUTs stuff is pointless. It's just you stamping up and down repeating yourself. It's pointless to merely repeat No IFs no BUTs until you demonstrate why. But you haven't successfully done that.
You not being able to understand and say the way I wrote above shows, you are still a fake, half-baked baby atheist, who is in love with his/her Faith on Free Will. You just love to discredit Muslims while guilty of same illogic.
Well, now that I answered exactly what you said, once again this is not true. and, i am not an atheist, so you're even wrong about that. My goodness, you get EVERYTHING wrong.
Philosophy without reason, logic, rationality, and science is fairy tale. Go ahead believe on Santa.
Philosophy is the usage of reason. Philosophy created math and science. Hasn't anybody ever told you this mister accredited scientist??
Muhammad bin Lyin wrote:Nobody can be sure of that, especially a dogmatic knucklehead such as yourself. What decides to do something with that electrochemical action? When the doctor hits your knee, what is that?? That's a "reflex", right?? No thought given, a pure mechanical and chemical reaction. So according to your point of view, everything we do is a reflex reaction??? Are you sure of that?? I know people who can run scientific rings around you and strangely enough, they're not sure of that.
In science there is nothing 100% guaranteed. But still one explanation is better than other.
Then get rid of your no IF and no BUTs statement please.
1. Reflex reaction by passes conscious level computing. Reflex action is little computing at the lower than limbic system. Reflex action is just pass through conscious layer.
How do you know that? Let's see your source.
2. Intuition and subconscious level computation Practice pushes initial conscious level effortful computing (when babies learn to walk, or toddler learning to bike etc.) to the subconscious level. By practice responsibility of future processing is pushed down the subconscious level so that later it can be used directly from the subconscious mind without conscious effort. It frees up the conscious mind for more difficult cognitive tasks. Sub conscious mind is 800 times faster than conscious mind. Intuition originates from subconscious or sometime even from the lower level of limbic system.
And now you are telling me that a reflex in yoiur knee has to do with the subconcious mind?
3. Cognition-conscious level computing No. Everything we do is not reflex action.
If there is no free will decision making, then of course it is merely a reflex to the stimulus provided. We think we are making a decision and think that are thoughts are decisions, but they really are not, right? it is mere chemical activity that is a reflex to the stimulus provide, right?
When computing takes place in the conscious level it is not reflexive reaction nor intuition.
The computing is a reflex of the stimulus, right?
We are aware of some of the computing results that occur in conscious mind only. We are not aware of the computing that are occurring in the lower level.
Then how can one be certain that it is all deterministic?
Our mind computing and instructing heart to beat faster or slower or make us to breath harder or softer all the time. We are not aware of that. But brain is computing.
First the pre-thought activity starts from the lower level then moves to the higher level. When it gets to the conscious level only then we are aware of that thought, that you call Free Will, choice, or decision. But that choice is already have started a long before you realize it.
What choice?? Choice is free will. Get your story straight, will you?
That is why Free Will is an illusion.
Thought doesn’t affects matter but matter generates thought. A train of “cause of affect” already has departed from your lover level of computation in our body before we are aware of it as thought/free will. Thought is just a passive helpless result of a priory electrochemical action triggered by internal or external events. Thought doesn’t affect matter but the reverse is true.
So the computation is merely a reflex to the stimulus.
Awareness is only a state. A state of brain. Brain functions are purely of matter and energy (electro-chemical) – material world.
Leave mystic bullshiit now.
You don't even know what that is. That's obvious.
You have given up Allah
Allah?? Dumb arss. I haven't even given up God and never had any need to give up Allah because I never followed him in the first place.
Now, step back for a moment and review all of the mistakes you have made on your posts. Look at how you project your qualities onto others. And look at how often you end up being completely wrong when you do this. Just look at it. What does that say about you? What a mess.
Now it is time for you to take the next giant step, give up the false faith on Free Will.
Boy, you're going to ram this down people's throats if it's the last thing you do.
If you have even a bone of intellectual honestly left in your body or brain then you should thank me for this.
I did not do cut and paste. I typed it up for you.
I could tell
Understand and then say, “There is no free will, whatsoever. Period.”
In science there is nothing 100% guaranteed.
Can you say that?
Which part of your contradiction would you like me to say? There is no free will, period, or in science there is nothing 100% guaranteed?
And don’t lie to me know.
You have said, that Buddha comes close to it (Free Will)
Yes, I said perhaps.
No. No Budha, no Mohammad, No Jesus, No one in the entire universe, no body, had ever had or have any free will of any sort, ever.
Can you say that?
No because I do not pretend to be certain about things that are not certain, like you do. I'm not that much of a fool, Abdul. Obfool
Nop. You want to maintain your superstition.
You are going to loop around, go around the bushes; play taqya game clearly shows you haven’t understood the story of NO Free Will.
Now there's a very frustrated person. Next you'll start projecting on to me and tell me how frustrated I am, so that your frustration gets hidden.