BlacKStaR wrote:You mean to say, that the evidences of a spiritualist is falsible??? Get over it man. You are beginning to sound like a broken record. You have ran out of ideas. I told you many times, the realm of a spiritualist doesnt needs the seal of goddamn atheists. You are irrelevant.
I mean to say: If it's not falsifiable, it's useless. Again: I keep repeating the points because you've proven nothing. And you seem fine with that. Which is a shame, since we're talking about things that have such high stakes.
WEll, atleast you are getting somewhere there. So now, your first lesson, is that, JUST BECAUSE YOU AND YOUR SMALL BRAINS THINK THAT GOD IS NOT THERE, it doesnt mean that it is perfectly allright to think so.
Yeah, no sh!t; here's your issue, though: Science has shown, for instance, that these things exist. The books you keep talking about only prove beliefs. Show me the peer-reviewed evidence for, say, souls, and we'll be getting somewhere.
Of course that you will say things. " uh Uh.. we got scientific tools to show you the IR exists", but then again, I will tell you that The scriptures and the writings of sages fits our quest.
Special pleading, look outside the book, going in circles, blah blah blah blah....
This is interesting. " How can we disprove something that hasn't been conclusively proven to exist?" This is contradiction par excellence. You are chasing your own tails again.
Prove it, then. Prove the supernatural realm exists. You're the one making the assertion; you need to show us the evidence.
Outside your books and sages, please.
Excuse me??? You atheist clowns vomit saying things like " No god, skybunnies, bleh bleh" As far as I am concerned, The burden of proof is on you jokers. Not me. Not any spiritualists. Spiritualists dont go on public barking on atheists to disprove god! We thinks and rationalize differently.
That's right- we're not making assertions- we're saying 'You've proven nothing.'
What you think about the burden of proof is wrong, in this case. You say 'There is a spiritual realm.' We say 'Show us.' You say 'Book! Sages! Personal experience!' We say, 'No, your proof outside special pleading.' You say, 'I just proved it! Book! Sages! Personal experience!' See- this didn't start with us saying 'There is no god, and we know for a fact there is no god.' It started with you saying 'There is a god/spiritual realm, and this is how I know.' Burden of proof is on you.
Spiritualists actually DO go on 'public barking' on atheists to disprove god. You JUST DID IT IN THE LAST POST! And anyway, it happens plenty in the real world. Or a variant gets used, such as 'You think you can disprove god!' Same meaning, though. A presupposition about what 'the atheists' believe and what 'they' want.
You don't rationalize at all. You assert. You've given no evidence that can't be used, exactly in the same way, by any other religion to prove, at the same level of 'truth,' their beliefs.
You are off topic here and is starting to blabber emotionally here. I understand evolution perfectly.
Now come back to my demands, can science create a being? I am not asking scientists to come up with anything fantastically big, all i need is something as big as a fly.
They can't *yet*. That they can't yet is not proof that they won't ever. Your demands are impossible right now, and prove nothing beyond the fact that science must improve.
Oh, dont be a child. Be a man and take my challenge. Explore spirituality. Go to a monastry, take up any religions while you can still be a scientist.
If dualism can't be proven through anything other than self-referential books or special pleading, I'll just be spinning my wheels. I *tried* spirituality, but got stuck on this point: If it's all pretend (and it is- lack of proof and all that) then I could be using my time better.
Whose fault is it anyway???? God has endowed mankind with perfect consciousness. Gave laws to him to use and protect nature, but it is humans who continually disobey the naturalistic orders. Look what science has contributed to global warming!!!. If i would think crude, it is science which will eventually destroy the earth.
And REALLY mis-characterizing what science has done. Most of us on this earth are alive today because of scientific advances. Like visiting with your grandparents? Without science, they, and possibly your parents, wouldn't be alive right now. Without science we couldn't have enjoyable circular arguments like this.
And you're going to focus in on the bad stuff. WELL; we could certainly tell some tales about the harm spiritualism has done to the world, and its negatives would outweigh science's by a good trillion metric tons at least.
Science, regardless, is a methodology, not a philosophy. That's neo-apologetic rubbish-talk, the idea that science is a philosophy. Though if you do want to disregard science- well, stop using cars, buses, planes, trains, etc (so start using horses, I guess), only buy clothes you know are hand-crafted; stop using running water and indoor plumbing; use only wood, coal or cow-pies for heating and cooking; hand-grind your own flour or use a stone... I could go on and on, but your dismissal of scientific progress is pathetic and sets up a false dichotomy between 'good' spiritualism and 'bad' atheism. Nice try, though.
crazymonkie_ wrote:If you read the scriptures and agree with them, and the scriptures in question are spiritual in nature (philosophy or *ugh* theology) then one IS a spiritualist by definition.
Though in the broadest sense, 'Spiritualist' is just fancy-schmachy talk for 'dualist.'
No, you area absolutely wrong. A spiritualist is a personal union, not an agenda like atheism. As I said, even if you agree with scriptures, it doesnt make you a spiritualist. Dont confuse it with your baloney ideologies.
Now you're not making any sense. Look: either you mean the specific 'spiritualist' as in 'one who believes in spiritualism, IE, who believes they can talk to the ghosts of the dead and channel them' OR you're using it in the much more general term of 'one who believes in a spiritual realm'. If there are scriptures that back up this belief, and someone truly believes in the scriptures, they ARE spiritualists.
You're the one with the 'baloney ideology', because you're just making stuff up.