Did God fail mankind?

Does God exist? Is Allah God? Creation vs. evolution.
Is Religion needed? Logic vs. faith. Morality and ethics.
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sum
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Did God fail mankind?

Post by sum »

Should God have made clear to all mankind, at the same time, that he was a reality and what his guidance was? Why did He allow various religions spring up all over the earth which have their own guidance and all starting with a "message" from a claimed "prophet" with no proof at all that God was communicating with mankind through this "prophet"? This has resulted in conflicts which are still ongoing. It is as though He has just sat back and allowed mankind to find its own solutions.

God seems to have a very laid back and indifferent attitude to his creation.

sum

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manfred
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Re: Did God fail mankind?

Post by manfred »

Dear sum I needed a scribe to write this and I am not sure when I can impose on him again. The question you raise was also posed a few years back by iffo. I am waiting for an eye operation and a special keyboard as an interim measure.

The answer I think lies in looking at the consequences of the scenario you suggest. Suppose there was a God which was all powerful and all present, and everyone would see him/it at all times. Sure, he could impose rules easily but how could such a deity have creations that are free to make their own decision, and be free to offer their love to him? We would be in a big brother society, and who would love the big brother from 1984?

So in order to allow free people this God has to square a circle. He has to be both to some degree discoverable/knowable and at the same time remain rejectable. You can only truly love what you can know but and what you can walk away from. It is a tough choice, but given that God wants free people and not puppets, what else could have done?

Next, about “prophets”. I have to say that God is only revealed by these “prophets” is really a very Islamic idea. In other religions all kinds of people had religious insights and ideas they spoke and wrote about, and only Muslims would argue that only a “prophet” conveys anything about God. If you ask a monk he will tell you find God in every person, every animal and plant and in yourself though prayer and meditation. “Prophets” are a phenomenon of the past, of a particular period of Jewish history. They were wandering preachers who warned of both religious apostasy and political corruption in generally very rough and blunt language. Some texts have been interpreted by Christians much later in a different way, and this is rejected by the Jewish scholars.

Then we have many people who claim to be a “prophet” but I am certain most of them are nothing of the sort. There is a big difference between inspired by God and using God for your own aims. So it is perhaps a bit unfair to blame God for various idiots and criminals or con-artists.

Then you say God sys “sat back” and did nothing. Well to some extent he clearly did that, because of the reason I gave. But it is a bit unfair to suggest that he did nothing to help. For a start or ability to resolve questions is not something we made ourselves. Then we have many ideas, such as the golden rule and perhaps the 10 commandment that provide pretty clear guidance, and easy to follow. Are the divine? That depends on what you want to believe. That is part of the choice built into creation.

Perhaps the biggest thing he did is to show us his love through the life and death of a particular man who lived 2000 years ago. Though him we are told that God is there for us even if we think ourselves as utterly unworthy.
Jesus: "Ask and you will receive." Mohammed: "Take and give me 20%"

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Ariel
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Re: Did God fail mankind?

Post by Ariel »

Bless your scribe, and thank you,and him, for this post. These kind of posts is one of the reasons we can't miss you.
The heart of the wise inclines to the right,
but the heart of the fool to the left.

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pr126
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Re: Did God fail mankind?

Post by pr126 »

Welcome back manfred. Hope you are feeling better.

I am not sure that anyone can read this post for you, but I can offer a little help.

If you are using Google Doc or Microsoft Documents, they booth have a dictate facility, which transforms spoken word into written text quite well.
(FREE)

With some help to start this off for you, maybe you will able to post more often?

There is also a text to speech facility, where written text will be read aloud for you.

A chrome extension can be added "Read aloud"


To use Read Aloud, simply navigate to the web page you want to read, then click the Read Aloud icon on the Chrome menu. In addition, the shortcut keys ALT-P, ALT-O, ALT-Comma, and ALT-Period can be used to Play/Pause, Stop, Rewind, and Forward, respectively.

It works, I have tried myself to test this.


Good luck and keep indoors at all times.
Islam: an idea to kill and die for.

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Takeiteasynow
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Re: Did God fail mankind?

Post by Takeiteasynow »

It's good to see Manfred has returned to the forum - inspirational as always!
Abraham= H'ammu'rab(b)i, Historical Muhammad=Benjamin of Tiberias. Theological: Mahmud from Najran Islam: Syncretic Israelite Yahwishm Deity: nameless, epithets Dsr, El Qutbay, ʼAlâhâ, Allāh. Ka'ba: Kutha => Samaria => Petra=> Makkah. Hijrah 622: Petra => Kerak

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Equestrian
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Re: Did God fail mankind?

Post by Equestrian »

MY thoughts and prayers are with you, manfred.
"Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence" ~Carl Sagan

sum
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Re: Did God fail mankind?

Post by sum »

Hello manfred

Absolutely delighted that you are in reasonable health barring the visual problem which I hope will be addressed soon. I can only imagine what it must be like to have very impaired vision - it would devastate my lifestyle. There is now a sense that "the master and friend is back".

As far as my post is concerned, I think that it gave an exaggerated impression. I have often thought that if there was a God how would he let mankind know that he was there and how would he convey his guidance if he was to give any.

I would have thought that it would have been better if he could have contacted mankind over all the planet at some particular point to advise mankind that he was there and this was his general guidance. That would have been the only guidance. What would I suggest the guidance should be? You beat me to it by mentioning the Ten Commandments and the Golden Rule. I feel that these two suggestions would allow man quite enough freedom to do his own thing rather than the Islamic guidance which converts people into robots having to perform rituals for just about every single aspect of life. The guidance should be simple and easy to follow.

If there had to be certain person to advise and set an example for mankind there would be no better person than a certain person 2,000yrs ago.

sum

iffo
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Re: Did God fail mankind?

Post by iffo »

@sum
I couldn’t have agreed more.
Sending a guy 2000 years ago and expecting whole planet And coming generations to believe he was divine is a silly idea. I am sure God could have done better than that if he was really serious.

He could have saved us from so much confusion.

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manfred
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Re: Did God fail mankind?

Post by manfred »

Hello iffo! Missed you....
Jesus: "Ask and you will receive." Mohammed: "Take and give me 20%"

iffo
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Re: Did God fail mankind?

Post by iffo »

How are you manfred. I missed you too and others here. I thought this site was taken down as I could not find it in google search for long time.

Nosuperstition
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Re: Did God fail mankind?

Post by Nosuperstition »

iffo wrote:
Mon Aug 17, 2020 5:08 am
@sum
I couldn’t have agreed more.
Sending a guy 2000 years ago and expecting whole planet And coming generations to believe he was divine is a silly idea. I am sure God could have done better than that if he was really serious.

He could have saved us from so much confusion.
Hindu God Siva has a trident (trishuul in Sanskrit) in his hand.Though the Hindu God of sea,called Samudra has no weapons in his hand,his equivalent in the Greek pantheon , Poseidon too has trident in his hand.Various Hindu goddesses have tridents in their hand and so does Boudica the first freedom fighter queen of the English lands.So no wonder,the English realised the value of the terrifying Trident and named their nuclear tipped missiles as "Tridents" as they know very well what is practical and what is impractical.
palli or halli in Dravidian languages means a village just like gaav in Aryan languages means a village.palli or halli in Aryan Mauryan Imperial era around 200 B.C designates a tribal hamlet.So many of those in South India are indeed descendants of tribals and are still keeping up that heritage.

sum
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Re: Did God fail mankind?

Post by sum »

Hello Nosuperstition

Try as I might, I can not see the relevance of your post to this thread.

sum

Nosuperstition
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Re: Did God fail mankind?

Post by Nosuperstition »

Both "tri" of Greek and Latin and "tri" of Sanskrit mean three.So the pronunciation of numbers is the same just as the ideas are.The thirteenth day of the fortnight is called "triodasi" in Sanskrit based on tri=three and dasi=deci or the deci of the decimal system."deci" is from Greek and it also means ten.ten+three=10+3=13=thirteen.
Last edited by Nosuperstition on Sun Sep 06, 2020 2:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
palli or halli in Dravidian languages means a village just like gaav in Aryan languages means a village.palli or halli in Aryan Mauryan Imperial era around 200 B.C designates a tribal hamlet.So many of those in South India are indeed descendants of tribals and are still keeping up that heritage.

Nosuperstition
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Re: Did God fail mankind?

Post by Nosuperstition »

sum wrote:
Mon Aug 31, 2020 9:28 pm
Hello Nosuperstition

Try as I might, I can not see the relevance of your post to this thread.

sum
O.K,then let it remain here.Those who have brains will be able to comprehend what I have just stated.
palli or halli in Dravidian languages means a village just like gaav in Aryan languages means a village.palli or halli in Aryan Mauryan Imperial era around 200 B.C designates a tribal hamlet.So many of those in South India are indeed descendants of tribals and are still keeping up that heritage.

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manfred
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Re: Did God fail mankind?

Post by manfred »

NS it is YOUR responsibility to write in ways that are understood and relate to the topic. To write any old thing you just thought of after too much toddy and then call stupid anyone who cannot follow the ramblings of a drunk is what is called "trolling".
Kindly write clearly and on tropic.
Jesus: "Ask and you will receive." Mohammed: "Take and give me 20%"

sum
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Re: Did God fail mankind?

Post by sum »

Hello Nosuperstition

Your quote -
O.K,then let it remain here.Those who have brains will be able to comprehend what I have just stated.

You made me laugh.

sum

iffo
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Re: Did God fail mankind?

Post by iffo »

Nosuperstition wrote:
Sun Sep 06, 2020 2:27 am
sum wrote:
Mon Aug 31, 2020 9:28 pm
Hello Nosuperstition

Try as I might, I can not see the relevance of your post to this thread.

sum
O.K,then let it remain here.Those who have brains will be able to comprehend what I have just stated.
NS why you like to bring Hinduism in every thread when no one is talking about it. Hinduism is also full of fairy tales and imaginary characters

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