Attack in London

[manfred]

London terror latest: Six dead in London Bridge and Borough Market van and knife attacks

Six people have been killed and almost 50 people were injured in a "rampage" in central London, the third terrorist attack to hit the UK in less than three months.

Three attackers were shot dead by police in the attack on London Bridge and Borough Market. Police said they believed there were no more than three attackers.

A white transit van ploughed into a crowd of people on the bridge at speed shortly after 10pm. The three men then stabbed people with 12-inch knives at nearby Borough Market, with a transport police officer among those injured.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/06 ... ts-killed/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

In the meantime, the Labour Muslim Mayor of London tells people to "carry on as normal" and "London is a probably the safest city in the world". Obviously according to him "this terrible incident" (as if it was some kind of natural disaster) had nothing at all to do with Islam, even though "Allah akhbar" was heard by almost all eye witnesses.

[Fernando]

Now 7 dead.

"That this should happen in this month of Ramadan, when many Muslims were praying and fasting only goes to show that these people respect neither life nor faith.

Evidently not a traditionalist, eschewing jihad during Ramadan. And how many Muslims were fasting at 11:30 pm?
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/a ... 56406.html
For the benefit of any doubters,

An official Taliban spokesman described jihad as “obligatory worship” and said that there would be no cease-fire during the Muslim holy month of Ramadan. The spokesman’s stance is consistent with Taliban policy.

“Our fight is Jihad & obligatory worship, reward for every obligatory act of worship is multiplied x70 in #Ramadan,” Taliban spokesman Zabihullah Mujahid said on his official Twitter account on May 27, the official start of the Ramadan holiday.

http://www.longwarjournal.org/archives/ ... n-says.php

[Fernando]

Sky News reports that the NHS say 21 people are critically injured in hospital.
This was during a prolonged interview with uber-Guardianista Owen Jones who castigated Theresa May for going political during a statement after the murders. Violated, that's what she did, violated. How? By saying something will have to be done about Islamist terror without consulting her opponents. Who, it must be assumed, he thinks might well disagree.

[Fernando]

uber-Guardianista Owen Jones who castigated Theresa May for going political during a statement after the murders. Violated, that's what she did, violated.

It's now clear that in the extensive interview Jones was clearing the way for Corbyn to make political capital from the murders. He's been giving a speech blaming May for the killings - which were apparently due to a shortage of police, not an excess of Islamic terrorists.

[piscohot]

Now we are learning that in Britain, there are about 23000 muslim terror suspects and another 400 ISIS fighters who came back from Syria.
You can say without any doubt that the British govt brought this bloodshed upon its citizens.

If the Prime Minister wants to face the truth of islamic terrorism, she can start by acknowledging the mistake the govt made with regards to immigration.

[manfred]

Well, yes and no, piscohot... it is true that inaction brought this issue right to the front yet again. Immigration is not the prime cause though, but it is part of the problem.

It is, to me at least, shocking, that these 23000 and the other 400 are free to walk the streets, specially when the government's own anti-terror organisation has repeatedly said this is dangerous and has repeated advised to stop that.

However, the link with immigration is somewhat more tenuous. Most of the jihadists are in fact "home growns", i.e. they may be from an immigrant family but they were born here.

And the step from being a so-called moderate Muslim to becoming a brutal killer is surprisingly small. You may have read that one of the perpetrators organised a community barbecue only a short while back, and he was well liked by his neighbours. Maybe an act, a disguise? Few people can hide their real personality for long though. Maybe it only took one event, one meeting one sermon, one article on the internet to turn the nice neighbour into a killing robot.

Having said that, immigration was allowed to run riot mostly under Labour, but also under the conservatives. Measures that should be considered by our government now are the measures the anti-terror organisation "Cobra" is proposing, and not the ineffective suggestion by the Labour party to merely put some "more policemen and women on the beat". Police officers walking round the neighbourhood at predictable times are doing nothing at all to combat terror attacks.

The immediate measures suggested by Cobra are: Those who are terror suspects should be detained in remote areas. Mosques should be supervised and sermons recorded. Radical preachers should be arrested. The link in the teachings of Islam to terror attacks should be acknowledged.

[Fernando]

You may have read that one of the perpetrators organised a community barbecue only a short while back, and he was well liked by his neighbours. Maybe an act, a disguise? Few people can hide their real personality for long though.

Not really a disguise, but certainly an act: an act of proselytising. Neighbours had previously complained that he was giving money and sweets to children and then trying to convert them to Islam. Such that little children went home saying that they wanted to become Muslims. Their parents had reported him to the police two years ago, to no avail.

Telegraph News

'Mummy, I want to be a Muslim': How alleged attacker was reported to police for trying to radicalise children

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/06 ... adicalise/

[SAM]

London tragedy is not terrorism or acts of extremism, it is an act of butchery like what ex White Helmets (funded by British and other Western govts) did in Aleppo, Syria... don't act stupid.

[Fernando]

One of the London Bridge attackers was allegedly a well-known Islamist, who appeared on national TV, was reported to police, and can be linked to the network around notorious hate preacher Anjem Choudary.

More leaks, or just asking the locals? The latter, probably. Breitbart cites "numerous sources" and in particular relatives. An interesting bit is this, about his appearance on Channel 4

The group mock the police when they are questioned and tread a delicate line throughout the film, appearing to praise Islamic State, a banned group, but not openly backing them

Which could be accounted for by their having been coached by Choudary.
It seems, btw, that this is the same person who tried to convert childen as mentioned earlier.
http://www.breitbart.com/london/2017/06 ... -choudary/

[pr126]

[manfred]

London tragedy is not terrorism or acts of extremism, it is an act of butchery like what ex White Helmets (funded by British and other Western govts) did in Aleppo, Syria... don't act stupid.

SAM you ability to divorce yourself from reality in mind-boggling.

[pr126]

SAM wrote

London tragedy is not terrorism or acts of extremism, it is an act of butchery

It is an act of piety from devout Muslims following Muhammad's example, as it is commanded in the Quran.
Just practising their religion as prescribed.

Sura 9:111 "to slay and be slain" for Allah.

[frankie]

Sam belongs to the Muslim tribe “El hypocrites”, those who prefer to stay in their homes, than practice their faith as per Mohammed, the role model action man of Islam, who preferred the “holy war “tactic

Quran 4.95
Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and receive no hurt, and those who strive and fight in the cause of Allah with their goods and their persons. Allah hath granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with their goods and persons than to those who sit (at home). Unto all (in Faith) Hath Allah promised good: But those who strive and fight Hath He distinguished above those who sit (at home) by a special reward,-



Sahih Muslim: Book 019, Number 4294:
It has been reported from Sulaiman b. Buraid through his father that when the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) appointed anyone as leader of an army or detachment he would especially exhort him to fear Allah and to be good to the Muslims who were with him. He would say:Fight in the name of Allah and in the way of Allah. Fight against those who disbelieve in Allah. Make a holy war, do not embezzle the spoils; do not break your pledge; and do not mutilate (the dead) bodies; do not kill the children. When you meet your enemies who are polytheists, invite them to three courses of action. If they respond to any one of these, you also accept it and withold yourself from doing them any harm. Invite them to (accept) Islam; if they respond to you, accept it from them and desist from fighting against them. Then invite them to migrate from their lands to the land of Muhairs and inform them that, if they do so, they shall have all the privileges and obligations of the Muhajirs. If they refuse to migrate, tell them that they will have the status of Bedouin Muilims and will be subjected to the Commands of Allah like other Muslims, but they will not get any share from the spoils of war or Fai' except when they actually fight with the Muslims (against the disbelievers). [/b]If they refuse to accept Islam, demand from them the Jizya. If they agree to pay, accept it from them and hold off your hands. If they refuse to pay the tax, seek Allah's help and fight them.

[SAM]

frankie,

You failed to present logical arguments, and continue to say an old debate that has been stale and outdated.

[sum]

Hello SAM

Do you agree that what Frankie presented was authentic and pure Islam, or not?

Do you support it?

sum

[frankie]

frankie,

You failed to present logical arguments, and continue to say an old debate that has been stale and outdated.

Sam:

I would agree Sam, the quotes I presented are very much "stale and outdated "only trouble is, Muslims don't think they are, they believe them to be very much fresh and eternal guidance for them to put in to practice in accordance with Allah's will.

If only these Islamic quotes were as you say "stale and outdated", the world would be a much safer place to live in.

[manfred]

A MUSLIM telling us the Quran is "stale and outdated." Well done SAM, you finally begin to realise.

[SAM]

frankie,

You failed to present logical arguments, and continue to say an old debate that has been stale and outdated.

Sam:

I would agree Sam, the quotes I presented are very much "stale and outdated "only trouble is, Muslims don't think they are, they believe them to be very much fresh and eternal guidance for them to put in to practice in accordance with Allah's will.

If only these Islamic quotes were as you say "stale and outdated", the world would be a much safer place to live in.

It's not a quote that become stale and outdated, it is a weak argument and you run out of ideas for debate.

These verses will be valid if the infidels against Muslims, or declare war on Allah's religion, Islam. The true believer (Mukmins) will fight all out in Allah's way.

Unlike idiot white Christians fighting and die for Zonist Jews.

[frankie]

frankie,

You failed to present logical arguments, and continue to say an old debate that has been stale and outdated.

Sam:

I would agree Sam, the quotes I presented are very much "stale and outdated "only trouble is, Muslims don't think they are, they believe them to be very much fresh and eternal guidance for them to put in to practice in accordance with Allah's will.

If only these Islamic quotes were as you say "stale and outdated", the world would be a much safer place to live in.

It's not a quote that become stale and outdated, it is a weak argument and you run out of ideas for debate.

These verses will be valid if the infidels against Muslims, or declare war on Allah's religion, Islam. The true believer (Mukmins) will fight all out in Allah's way.

Unlike idiot white Christians fighting and die for Zonist Jews.

Sam:

These verses will be valid if the infidels against Muslims, or declare war on Allah's religion, Islam.

You have things the wrong way round, it is Islam that puts Muslims at war with the rest of the world, your own scholars confirm it.


Reliance of the Traveller:
[Section o9.0, page 599]
"Jihad means to war against non-Muslims, and is etymologically derived from the word "mujahada", signifying warfare to establish the religion. And it is the lesser jihad. As for the greater jihad, it is spiritual warfare against the lower self, (nafs), which is why the Prophet said as he was returning from jihad, "We have returned from the lesser jihad to the greater jihad."
o9.0 JIHAD
(O: Jihad means to war against non-Muslims, and is etymologically derived from the word mujahada, signifying warfare to establish the religion…
The scriptural basis for jihad, prior to scholarly consensus is such Koranic verses as:
(1) “Fighting is prescribed for you” (Koran 2:216);
(2) “Slay them wherever you find them” (Koran 4:89);
(3) “Fight the idolators utterly” (Koran 9:36);
and such hadiths as the one related by Bukhari and Muslim that the Prophet (Allah bless him and give him peace) said:
“I have been commanded to fight people until they testify that there is no god but Allah and that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah, and perform the prayer, and pay zakat. If they say it, they have saved their blood and possessions from me, except for the rights of Islam over them. And their final reckoning is with Allah”;
and the hadith reported by Muslim,
Sahih Muslim Volume 4, Book 52, Number 50:
“To go forth in the morning or evening to fight in the path of Allah is better than the whole world and everything in it.

[Fernando]

Munchkins? Muslim Friends of Dorothy? Surely some mistake!