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Re: A challenge to yos on did muslims or qurysh draw first blood

PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 8:57 pm
by Ghaith
kaimana1 wrote:I will answer this by tommorow morning my dear yos- when i will have plenty of time.

Ok Kai i am far from done i just could post Part 1 and Part 2 rebutal because i had other things to do :)

Re: A challenge to yos on did muslims or qurysh draw first blood

PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2012 9:55 pm
by Ghaith
Yos im confident that mss is a mistranslation it makes no sense for it to be 616,

Why is that Kai? The 616 is more authentic than the sources for 666.

666 In rev means and symbolized the antichrists imperfection.

No dear kai. Its talking about Nero.

No more imperfect then if i have 666 bucks in my wallet or 777 bucks - the verses arent talking about a transaction yos

Be careful kai some Christians here might think that you are the anti christ.

I dont know about the bismilillah

This is why i insult Christians
Image

Its impossible to make those Greek letters into Bismillah.

ut is 666 neatical miles the difference between the dome and mecca?

665.65 i belive. I guess no other measurement that Neutical Miles fitted.... Stupid Christians...

You have plenty of muslims with similar wacko theories

Enlighten me about this so called "wacko theories".

Why yes they do according to the hebrew of the time.
First of all Take two issues at hand: the definition of "cud" and that of "chewing." Let's take a closer look at the Hebrew version of both. Here is the word for "cud" according to Strong's:

gerah, the cud (as scraping the throat): cud.
. First, this word is used nowhere in the Old Testament besides these verses in Leviticus and Deuteronomy. We have only this context to help us decide what it means in terms of the Mosaic law.

Second, refection is a process whereby these animals pass pellets of partially digested food, which they chew on (along with the waste material) in order to give their stomachs another go at getting the nutrients out. It is not just "dung" that the hares are eating- which is probably why the Hebrew word for dung was not used here.

Contrast this with what cows and some other animals do, rumination, which is what we moderns call "chewing the cud." They regurgitate partially digested food in little clumps called cuds, and chew it a little more while mixing it with saliva.

So then- partially digested food is a common element here. We therefore suggest that the Hebrew word simply refers to any partially digested food -the process is not the issue, just the object.

Or you might say
"verse says 'bring up' the cud- sounds like regurgitation to me."

Yos the Hebrew word in question is not specific to the process of regurgitation but is instead merely a phrase of general movement. And related to the specific issue at hand, the rabbit is an animal that does "maketh" the previously digested material to "come" out of the body (though in a different way than a ruminant does) and does thereafter chew "predigested material." The mistake is in our applying of the scientific terms of rumination to something that does not require it

Eating dung is not chewing the Cud kai in any language :lol:

silly anyways because they dont percieve human politics or kings etc

What does this have anything to do with the case that Solomon could speak to ants?

ngel made balaams donkey APPEAR to talk like a ventriliquist

Non sence as you would have put it.

ts a prophecy of the apocalypse yos with the 7 headed beast representing world govt-

And you call other people whacko. This is just some Christian BS the church put in there when compiling a book calling it Revelation.

Iraneus spoke of the book of revelation in late 2nd century yos

Could you post some proof to this Kai?

Nero died 30 years before john wrote revelation.

John didnt write the revelation Kai :lol: There where prob some legends about Nero and the number 616 so the churche added that to the book aswell.

nd no the dead sea scrolls dont show that

Yes they do kai Exodus, 1 2 Samuel and Jeremiah that where found in the forth cave showed that todays versions are indeed corrupted.

The talmud is based on rabbinic opinion yos

The firstone not the once that where reconstructed in the 16th century.

I can only imagine that yt video where muslims slay the context of james white....

Enlighten me of the context.

Tabaris tafsir is fairly accepted by learned orthodox muslims

Hahahahahahahahahaha :lotpot:

There is no Orthodox Muslim that accepts the Satanic Verse theory kai.

Where did you get such info yos about sam

I posted above.

Really zakir naik really never defended the quran in that debate

He just spend over half of his first 55 min debunking the embryology, mountain, sea barrier did you even watch the debate Kai?????

It is William who didnt defend thebible instead started speaking about prophecies forgeting the topics. He got grilled.




william was old and had the decency to lie

THe older the wise eh Kai? Zakir Naik was 35 years old back then. More over it was an overkill, William didnt even answer 1 of Zakirs arguments. Dr Zakir naik refuted everything William talked about. No Christian has ever come close to Zakirs greatnes sin knowledge of religion.

More over if William felt so old why did he debate him? Why didnt he send Sam Shamoun instead? Who looked like an idiot at 1:07:00 and im sure Naik wouldnt have minded it either after all Sam did debate Shabir in that same year.

Ali sina demolished most if not all of zakirs lies

No i dont think so Kai.

zakir naik has not only refused to debate ali sina but sam shamoun as well.

What what what?! Ive already posted a video refuting this.

None of those clowns are big enough to debate Zakir Naik.
Zakir said he doesnt debate someone that cannot provide 10k in audience.



And as far as i know Ali Sina doesnt debate.

And Ali Sina doesnt have any knowledge about Islam. For crying out loud he tought that Abu Bakr was the foster brother of Muhammad.

As to your cute little link all that have been debunked answering-christianity. I can also play the link game Kai.

http://www.answering-christianity.com/yahya_ahmed/dr_zakir_naik_rebuttal.htm

Re: A challenge to yos on did muslims or qurysh draw first blood

PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2012 1:10 am
by Ghaith
What year did Sami ask sam for help?

From: sami z (sami-zaatari@hotmail.com)
Sent: Fri 6/16/06 10:43 PM
To: sam_shmn40@hotmail.com
hi, i come in peace.


What year did Sami call sam Fatboy, Cross worshiper?

debate
From: sami z (sami-zaatari@hotmail.com)
Sent: Tue 9/04/07 11:27 PM
To: sam_shmn40@hotmail.com


So what is your point Kai? AC had war with ETT so Sami asked a Christian for help. Is this compareble to Sams foul mouth?

More over AC are not debater on paltalk they are preachers. They convert people to Islam.




They once converted a an entire Church.



Sami, Osama, Nadir, Sam, Wood, Christian_Prince, are lone wolfs in Paltalk. When they have a debate if they feel they made an impact they post it on their website if not they dont.

But i did enjoy a good laugh Kai :lol: When nadir said.
Osama, you most excellent kaffir.. how dare you insult our Prophet(P) by saying he has a mental disease wallahi, if I ever meet you on the street.... youre done.... and it WILL happen.I'll triangle choke you You can come down to my ju jitzu gym. This is JIHAD.


Hahahaha i enjoy this Kai im not biased.But Nadir have a ego why AC even takes him serious idk.

Nadir is a clown kai ive already said that he is a child before.

You will love this one yos. Court documents shows that Nadir was accused of beating his wife, divorcing her, marrying someone for a month and then divorcing her!

I dont belive things based on documents but it wouldnt surprise me when he start talking about fights.

But lets find the truth Kai.

>sami z <sami-zaatari@hotmail.com> wrote:
> lol he is very stupid indeed. he claims christian prince humiliated me,
>thats why all the muslims in the room were laughing at cp for running away
>from the debate, which was recorded.

Christian_prince do indeed run from Sami.

Matter infact he runs from any fair debate and only debates in his own room.


Also i dont know why AC wants Nadir to remove the debate. It never took place.
http://www.examinethetruth.com/cp_debate.htm
CP couldnt answer him he just brought some fabricated hadiths and Nadir keep talking about babies being killed.

Here is the Christian foul mouthed clown nr 1 Christian prince.

Re: A challenge to yos on did muslims or qurysh draw first blood

PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2012 1:20 am
by Ghaith
Christian clown nr 2 Sam Shamoun

Since you liked the subject of Muslims disagreeing lets have a look at Christians disagreeing.

Date: Wed, 3 May 2006 16:16:36 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Umar Bin Nasir Mirza" <islamttd786@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: CRUCIFIED SAVIORS
To: "sam shamoun" <sam_shmn40@hotmail.com>, islam_defender@hotmail.com, jokatz@gmx.de, quransearch_com@yahoo.com, sami-zaatari@hotmail.com, b_zawadi@hotmail.com, just_flow11@hotmail.com, islamttd786@yahoo.com, Munir0728@yahoo.com
Assalamu Alaikum,

Hey Mr. "Missionary" Shamoun, apparently your not really popular with your christian crowd.

When I posted these 2 links>> http://www.answering-christianity.com/s ... moun_4.htm
http://www.answering-christianity.com/s ... _mouth.htm

Here is what one Christian said after reading it:

evanslablah: all that's crazy
evanslablah: i was reading them but couldn't continue
evanslablah: i don't think that guy's a missionary. it's only his claim but he's not one
evanslablah: i asure you that wht he's doing is not christian. he's only satisfying his personal ego

Good Job!! LOL

http://www.answering-christianity.com/sam_shamoun_is_despised.htm

John Gilchrist who is held high in Answering-Islam
http://answering-islam.org/authors/gilchrist.html

From: "Yusuf Ismail" <ismaillaw@telkomsa.net>
To: QuranSearchCom@yahoo.com
Subject: FW: CHALLENGE TO A DEBATE-SOUTH AFRICA
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 00:11:35 +0200
Assalamualaikum Osama Abdallah

I thought you would be interested in including this email in ur abusive
email sections. I mailed a copy to Gilchrist in Benoni and he informed
me that Sam Shamoun doesn't represent mainstream Christian thinking but
fanaticism. Post this in the dumpster section. This man has diarrhea of
his mouth. Nothing he says on his site is of any substance and judging
by his emotionalism, bad grammar and response, maybe its not worth
responding to debris. Based in South Africa, I am curious to know: has
this sadist ever engaged in a public debate or does he confine his
irrationality to abusive emails and poor writing?

Salams

-----Original Message-----
From: sam shamoun [mailto:sam_shmn40@hotmail.com]
Sent: 28 January 2007 21:15
To: ismaillaw@telkomsa.net
Subject: RE: CHALLENGE TO A DEBATE-SOUTH AFRICA

I would love nothing more than to destroy a bastard like yourself, not
just your student. In fact, to make it fair I want to squash both you
bastards. Instead of having me come there, set it up here in the USA with one of
your terrorist orgnaizations so I can bury you with Deedat. Afterall, that
fat demon Deedat didn't mind coming here so you should have no problem
doing likewise so I can embarrass you and shw to the world it is your prophet
who was a pervert. And I doubt you are a man to set it up here but I will
wait. Bring your bite next time, not your bark.

>From: "Yusuf Ismail" <ismaillaw@telkomsa.net>
>To: <sam_shmn40@hotmail.com>
>Subject: CHALLENGE TO A DEBATE-SOUTH AFRICA
>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 18:02:21 +0200
>
>
>My name is Yusuf Ismail and for a short period of time I was based at
>the Islamic propagation Center International. I presently reside in
>Durban, South Africa. Over the course of the years I have engaged
>individuals such as John Gilchrist, David Foster and other individuals
>who are not small time barkers such as yourself.
>
>I had the misfortune of recently seeing your abusive emails with Osama
>Abdallah. There are in my opinion two reasons for your abuse. One
being,
>that you are an insecure imbecile and need to make a point. The other
is
>the shallowness of your thinking and failure to come to terms with the
>irrationality of your perverted religion. One could go on speaking of
>the filth that emanates from a book you consider to be "divine", but I
>would rather deal with hardcore scholarly research. Have you for
example studied the documentary hypothesis. You are therefore
>invited to debate a student of mine, if you do not have cold-feet.
>
>We could make the flight arrangements and necessary trip to meet you
if
>you wish. However if you are feeling somewhat weak, we cold have an
>internet debate. Judging by your writings and corrupted views, you
might
>bow down for the latter.
>
>Let me have your response.
>
>Yusuf


Christian_Prince tells Sam to shut up.

http://www.answering-christianity.com/cp_shutting_up_shamoun.mp3


Here a Email you didnt post Kai.

RE: 'terror of the Lord'... and Shamoun won.. ooooooook.?
From: sami z (sami-zaatari@hotmail.com)
Sent: Sat 1/05/08 8:02 PM To: Nadir Ahmed (nadir@examinethetruth.com); tariqroshan@gmail.com

Cc: 'sam shamoun' (sam_shmn40@hotmail.com); palmproject@hotmail.com; info@ministrytomuslims.com; info@ylfc.org; press@3xterrorists.com; saleem.kamal@yahoo.com; linden7@attglobal.net; jdavidlehman@msn.com; m2a5@netzero.net; emileh@co.kern.ca.us; thesingingcarpenter@yahoo.com; grace1732@hotmail.com; akitob_prince@yahoo.com; administrator@ministrytomuslims.com; director@ministrytomuslims.com; jwswaney@eastside.com; sabeeldawah@yahoo.com; my.choice.islam@gmail.com; adeel.invitationtotruth@gmail.com; adeenenator@gmail.com; ahmederee@yahoo.com; bklimas@hotmail.com; exposelies@yahoo.com; islam_defender@hotmail.com; islamttd786@yahoo.com; just_flow11@hotmail.com; kzaheeralmawrid@hotmail.com; menj1980@hotmail.com; kmdhn@hotmail.com; mrdebatethehate@earthlink.net; mucahit@islamonline.net; munir0728@yahoo.com; muzjid.al.aziz@hotmail.com; nadermusa@hotmail.com; quransearchcom@yahoo.com; aimoo992000@yahoo.com; sendarticle@faithfreedom.com; umarhassan_63@yahoo.com; islam_the_true_deen786@hotmail.com; ghanmy@gmail.com; yahya-ahmed_@hotmail.com; ipo@muslimphilosophy.com; kzaheer_lums@hotmail.com; zaatari@hotmail.com; admin@thetruereligion.net; b_zawadi@hotmail.com

hey shamoun why is that on a pc you always act hard and talk crap? yet face to face you become this little B and
start begging nadir to be your friend and ending the past beef? i dont understand this...........i hope someone else on this list could explain that? is that a peace-loving Christian trait you guys have or what????????

well paul did sanction lying when you go face to face so i guess you are actually following your bible.....


Seems like 2 years after Sam and Nadir became friends according to Sami? This is 2008 the emals you posted where 2006.

Re: A challenge to yos on did muslims or qurysh draw first blood

PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2012 3:59 am
by Ghaith
Next you had on the list was David Wood who i showed above is a Liar. Here is a video he posted where he got arrested.


Re: A challenge to yos on did muslims or qurysh draw first blood

PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 7:40 pm
by kaimana1
When did Jesus crucifixion bcome the new covenant....?

That was the point of the injeel yos

More over the Quran said بني إسرائيل not spiritual israelites.


I know that- we know the quran is NoT clear


So if Mahatma Ghandi lived in that time in Israel he would have been killed that my argument Kai.


Only if he worshipped other gods inside israel yos. if ghandi was a canaanite at that time then he wouldnt be mahatma ghandi.


o rly?

Isaiah 1:26 Isaiah 2:4 Isaiah 2:17 Isaiah 25:8 Isaiah 51:3, Amos 9:13-15, Ezekiel 36:29-30, Isaiah 11:6-9 Jeremiah 31:33 Isaiah 11:12 Isaiah 11:4.


You left out psalm 91 so you want to play the game of is osama twisting these verses or what?

Can you show me some passages from the OT about a second comming or rising from the dead?

well christians would use daniel 12:9 daniel chapter 9. Now yos do you believe that jesus is coming ?


According to the Tanakh kai.


Or you mean to your distorted view of the tanakh?


Isa ibn Mariam is the Messiah. Not the demon that came to Paul.


You havent been able to prove that isa is jesus name- isa does not correspond with yeshua in any shape or form

How do you know that mo wasnt confronted by a demon who called himself jibreel?
Not that i am aware of.

hmmm

Nope i am trying to prove the Biblical Jesus is not the Messiah not Isa ibn Mariam.

The entire concept of jesus comes from the NT yos- let that sink in

Yup i belive the Tanakh is corrupted and NT is recycled Sun God myth so dont get confused if im attack the prophets in those books.


So you believe the tanakh and the injeel are corrupted??
Check out this link yos by professor abdullah saeed explaining in detail that the charges that most modern day muslims about the bible being corrupted are unfounded
http://www.quranandinjil.org/sites/default/files/pdfs/The-Charge-of-Distortion-of-Jewish-and-Christian-Scriptures_Abdullah%20Saeed.pdf


According to the 4 fake gospels sure.


So where is the real gospel yos god says he protects his words - where are they?



Ohh so Jesus was a worm more over when did Psalm become a book of prophecies?

Jesus said he came to fulfill the torah the prophets david is a prophet- any learned christian knows this- besides luke24:44 He said to them, "This is what I told you while I was still with you: Everything must be fulfilled that is written about me in the Law of Moses, the Prophets and the Psalms."

How is psalm a law more over do Jews or Christians regard David as a Prophet?

again yes david is a prophet- the problem arises when you muslims consider adam and lot prophets.


How is Bukhari a homosexual kai?


Thats the point yos i have as much evidence for bukhari being a homo as you do with paul being a homo


Im sure Naik wouldnt insist on cutting it kai. + He is a Dr.


He wouldnt insist on it huh? how do you know that? its not like first century world was full of clinics yos.

He would have been exposed easily if he did Kai.


Exposed by fellow muslim worshippers?? gimme a break yos hahaaa


Muhammad had a good relation with Banu Qurayza Kai,the reason they backstabed him was because the Quran was insulting them.


Mo had a good relationship with all of the jews yos UNTIL most of the jews rejected his prophethood


Can you show me where Banoo is in 9:30 Kai?
Image

Waqalati alyahoodu AAuzayrun ibnu Allahiwaqalati annasara almaseehuibnu Allahi thalika qawluhum bi-afwahihim yudahi-oonaqawla allatheena kafaroo min qablu qatalahumu Allahuanna yu/fakoon

Thats right yos mo would think the hebrew word banou was IBNU. got it?
Can you show sources that the OT was translated into Arabic in Muhammads time. he only Bible they had back then was in Hebrew and i belive Assyrian.


They had the hebrew, aramaic (syriac)and greek not assyrian-


Sahih Bukhari Volume 1, Book 1, Number 3:
Khadija then accompanied him to her cousin Waraqa bin Naufal bin Asad bin 'Abdul 'Uzza, who, during the PreIslamic Period became a Christian and used to write the writing with Hebrew letters. He would write from the Gospel in Hebrew as much as Allah wished him to write.

As for Volume 6 Number 478
for he never had a dream but it turned out to be true and clear as the bright daylight.
Can you say if any of the biblical prophets had this abilty Kai?




By Allah, Allah will never disgrace you, for by Allah, you keep good relations with your kith and kin, speak the truth, help the poor and the destitute, entertain your guests generously and assist those who are stricken with calamitiesAre any of the biblical Prophets as nice as this? Last i read Elijah let bears eat children and Moses knocked out an angel and Jesus told his deciples to steal a donkey


Yos you left out this part Khadija replied, "Never! By Allah, Allah will never disgrace you
So i khadijah a prophet? :whistling:

There is a contradiction between Volume 1 Number 3 and Volume 6 Number 478 who are we to take most logical Kai? The Gospel was not translated to Arabic untill around 1600Ad thats 1000 years after that event
.

Yes there is a problem with the matn of the ahadith so that is when you have to check out the two isnads

Bukhari Volume 6, Book 60, Number 478:
Narrated Aisha:
...Waraqa had been converted to Christianity in the Pre-lslamic Period and
used to write Arabic and write of the Gospel in Arabic as much as Allah
wished him to write...

Bukhari Volume 4, Book 55, Number 605:
Narrated 'Aisha:
... Waraqa bin Naufal who was a Christian convert and used to read the
Gospels in Arabic ...

Bukhari Volume 9, Book 87, Number 111:
Narrated 'Aisha:
... Waraqa was the son of her paternal uncle, i.e., her father's
brother, who during the Pre-Islamic Period became a Christian and
used to write the Arabic writing and used to write of the Gospels
in Arabic as much as Allah wished him to write."

The isnad with arabic is FAR more stronger but even the one you displayed says the same thing except he wrote the gospel in hebrew
Notice how they all say he became a christian??? Jews dont believe in gospel yos.

So how did they read the Greek Gospels?


They wouldnt have too as the peshitta was in existence- where does the word injil derive from yos? al bishara would be a proper arabic word for the gospel but they used the word derived from the GREEK


"
For Christ also suffered once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit, by whom also He went and preached to the spirits in prison. 1 Peter 3:18-19

Hell is not in the verse yos- the nmeaning of the verses is incomplete without verse 20 yos -verse 20 says " who disobeyed long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water"

Jws and quite a few other christians believe those spirits refer to the fallen angels while other christians believe its referring to the souls of those that died during the flood


No not really this is the Injeel.
Mark 16:15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.


Notice how it says preach THE GOSPEL. thanks for bringing that verse up to prove that the gospels are ONE. Like i said yos jesus was the gospel i told you this before. His disciples wrote the teachings of jesus down.

Now this is where your going to sweat because the Gospel existed before the NT which you call the Gospels Kai and dont blame it on mistranslations.


Me sweat??? Im insulted now

Where did Ibn Kathir consider him a follower?


His tafsir regarding surah al anfal


The Quran is not a story book Kai. Unlike the bible who go the story


Well the quran is UNCLEAR -

,
unlike the Bible who got the story about King Nebuchadnezzar or should i say "prophecy" Ezekiel 30:10-11 Christian try to say this prophecy did come true in the battle in Carchemish but he didnt conquere. In 568 BCE he tried again but the pharaoh Amasis II crushed him.

after shishak was crushed at carchemish nebuchadnezzar took the entire levant and judah as well...they also made egypt tributaory and henceforth nebu made egypt work for him by producing the tribute







This is why you are smart Kai you go to the weakest link of Answerin-Christians Sami Zataari.


Hmmm is that your OPINION ?
Well i acctual like the way Osama build Answerin-Christianity from zero knowledge. And he did sayhe was sorry about the lie and you cant proof the accusation that he wouldnt do the same for the Christians


Osama dtill has ZERI knowledge and he LIES all the time yos- if he was capable of lying MULTIPLE TOMES about abualrab he went as far as making up emails claiming they were abualrabs with deth threats to himself.

Gimme a break yos Are you naive enough to believe that it took osama 8 or 9 years to understand that lying is wrong???? LOL and contrary to what he claims osama was losing alot of viewers and was under alot of pressure to issue that apology- he has lied about answering islam many times and he never retracted those statements.

As to Sami i think he did a bad thing and he didnt follow surah 5:51




.
More over i dont se why Sam wanted Nadir to debate him so bad

He didnt yos samI set it up because he knew nadir wouldnt debate sam! sami kept it going to expose nadir

.
Besides Nadirs foul mouth and childish behaviour he is well read.


After he has been proven a liar by sami and even osama you still think so??


Thank you Kai i am not a hafiz


You are most welcome! i cant wait till the day when you complete your apostacy and write articles against islam for iffo's new site.

He is lying about it Kai you know dam well each of those ayas where for specific wars.

The rashidun didnt think so. nor did the ummayads ,seljuks, rasulids safavids, ottomans or the moghuls etc....etc...

More over Kai i posted Audios the best you can do is Email to defend Sam Shamoun?


Audios??? are you serious yos? so emails arent good enough yos?


He is according to Nadir


Nadir has been exposed and you still insist on taking him seriously? do you have any integrity yos?

I also remember reading this in Answering-Christianity but could find it now. Can you prove other wise Kai?


Okay http://www.answeringmuslims.com/2012/05/muslim-commenter-sinks-to-new-low.html
A muslim made a threat to sam shamouns wife yos. In order for that to happen sam would have to be married.

you dont even know the context of those snapshots from paltalk on osamas site

Is there really a context where a man in his 30-40s using the word Fag?


We will see about that.

Yes indeed


Ofcourse not Kai maybe i should have added the word Christian before.


Well you havent proven that beyond jimmy swaggart and anis which is unfair


James White admited the bible is corrupt Kai.


That is twisting what james was saying.

If you dont agree that the Bible is corrupt Kai than Christians must be able to Drink deadly drinks and play with snakes.
Mark 16:18 They shall take up serpents, and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them. They shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.”



Any christian knows this was refering to jesus disciples- You missed the part of verse that says they miraculously could speak in foreign tongues. why to spread the gospel and to testify that they had gods holy spirit

as for handling snakes it isnt a test yos- it was merely telling how they would be protected any serious christian knows that you never put God to the test like that. If naik knew the bible so well he would have known that.



Really Kai David Wood? Who will you mention next Nabeel Qureshi? Ergun Caner? Robert Spencer? Since i had the Idea that Sam Shamoun was rock buttom here but we can go under that Kai no problem.


ergun caner is a fraud no doubt but lets go to your yahyah snow videos
David Wood lying.


More lies from both clowns.


That isnt lying yos- they took the fatwah seriously ? why should you be surprised yos- theres isnads of multiple hadees and sirat that say aisha was 9 when mo pierced her. So thighing a little girl wouldnt be surprising

I agree that they jumped on it ill advised because even if an imam made such a fatwa- it does nothing to sunni islam as a whole with no hadees or fiqh to back it up.

But yahyah snow actually lied here he said the fatwa was made up by a christian- without any proof- in fact i will show you where sam got it from

http://www.islamic-fatwa.net/fatawa/index.php You want to tell me that is a christian site YOS??????? All yahyah had to do was go to sams article.

Anyways i remember both times this was done the sunni imams pointed there fingers to shias making the fatwa up to make sunnis look bad.



Id like to se you try defend this one from the filthy Sam Shamoun Kai.

What is there to defend

Dr James White sinks to an level where he wants to debate on ABN Sat against Dr Zakir Naik.

Are you joking yos?
Audio records of Sam running from Nadir.

You still take nadir seriously yos i will post a series of debates that nadir had with james white sam shamoun and david wood- and you tell me honestly who won? the muslims that were in the audience in all three of them walked out pissed off at nadir- i will show you.



There are some good Christians to Kai, like Dr William Craig. Did you watch this debate?

It was sad he used the talmud to defend his claims but atleast he put up a Good show.


So how is that proving him a liar yos?


If the entire building went on fire and lives was lost wouldnt that be a massacre Kai. Arson is still a crime. No i didnt source for the charges being dropped?


It is a crime indeed if the intent is malicious yos.

Yes any one saying the bible is word of god is a clown Kai.

That makes muhammad a clown then HA hAAA

Please do Kai
http://www.answeringmuslims.com/2012/05/muslim-commenter-sinks-to-new-low.html


idk about that maybe he just obtained a picture and used tineye.com to get the rest.


Suree yos ha haaa




Typo, Christians Internet Evangelists who attack Islam.

Your claims are unfounded



Dont we all make mistakes Kai?
] public apology to brother Jalal Abualrub for lying on him


Sure but this is so insincere anyone can tell.

Is that not impressive Kai?

Not really yos

How do you know that Kai?

Because i already shown you why

Because the filth coming from his mouth is very Christian alike.


Good god yos

and raise you to Myself and purify you from those who disbelieve and make those who follow you [in submission to Allah alone] superior to those who disbelieve until the Day of Resurrection.
The belivers here are muslims Kai not Nasara.


Nasara were the muslims yos...that is what mo was alluding to.

Ohh how do you know that Kai?

Prove me wrong yos- what jews were using it at time of mamluks??

There is not a single shred of evidence that Jesus was crucified either Kai,

Dont you believe in swoon theory yos?


Deceptions and Myths of the Bible, p. 343


And because of their saying (in boast), "We killed Messiah 'Iesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary), the Messenger of Allah," - but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but the resemblance of 'Iesa (Jesus) was put over another man (and they killed that man), and those who differ therein are full of doubts. They have no (certain) knowledge, they follow nothing but conjecture. For surely; they killed him not [i.e. 'Iesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary)]:

Read that carefully yos.

Jesus was crucified on a Tree kai. The cross came 400 years later.

it wasnt a tree yos.
Prove the cross came 400 years later! romans executed pirates and others for treason on crosses or stakes
Ancient Greek has two verbs for crucify: ana-stauro (ἀνασταυρόω), from stauros, "stake", and apo-tumpanizo (ἀποτυμπανίζω) "crucify on a plank
They are more right than the filty Catholics.
Jws are god people Kai, if they would drop the son god doctrine tey would be as good as the Jews.


LOL and if you muslims dropped the crescent and venus symbol you would be like the jews.

Christianity was created in the Councile of Nicea not a religion of the followers of Christ.

They are the ones that prevailed according to quran yos.


Like Tom Harper states:

“The divine teacher is called, is tested by the “adversary”, gathers disciples, heals the sick, preaches the Good News about God’s kingdom, finally runs afoul of his bitter enemies, suffers, dies, and is resurrected after three days. This is the total pattern of the sun god in all the ancient dramas”. (The Pagan Christ, p. 145)

Dont you believe that jesus was born to a virgin preached the good news ran afoul to his enemies and suffers (according to swoon theory)

Thanks for exposing muhammad as a pagan yos?? LMAO
The pagan christ??? Your orpheus amulet isnt accepted by any expert in the field secular or otherwise except by some muslims like osama LOL

Image

Orpheus


Timothy Freke and Peter Gandy published that in a 1999 book it's a fake yos osama is proven a liar again.
According to a Late Antique summary of Aeschylus's lost play Bassarids, Orpheus at the end of his life disdained the worship of all gods save the sun, whom he called Apollo. One early morning he went to the oracle of Dionysus at Mount Pangaion[42] to salute his god at dawn, but was ripped to shreds by Thracian Maenads for not honoring his previous patron (Dionysus) and buried in Pieria.[14] Here his death is analogous with the death of Pentheus. For this reason it is sometimes speculated that the Orphic mystery cult regarded Orpheus as a parallel figure to or even an incarnation of Dionysus himself]


That isnt the same as jesus by a long shot.
Where can i find the Gospel of Jesus Christ?


The NT yos.

At that time the knowledge of this wasnt as known as it is today.


How do we know the abbasids didnt use it either.


I
know Kai this one is more authentic.

How so?
Maybe god was testing Muhammad when he took the life of his son. Even so God gave him Hasan and Hussein.

You mean the life'S of his son'S- wake up yos.
No you mean fatima gave him hasan and husayn




Thanks Kai. Is it in English?

No yos- but aisha bewley is translating it as we speak.




Did the verse says that?


Was the verse saying animal sex???


Ive debated Muslims on this who even included masterbating here.

Hmm really?

No kai pork is more unhealty.


Why because the quran says to not eat pork- that is the only reason muslims say this.


Is read meat as filthy as a pig?


Yep


Unsure what you meant there Kai.


Kitab means book or kitabun books just like bible.

I will refute this later Kai. I just asked you a question you didnt give me an answer. I aska again.

I answered yos and im sure you will saifullah thought he refuted it too. :nono:

Btw its also from 10th 11th and 12th century.

So?

Yup Kai that why their faith is dying.


You really think their faith is dying because they pronounce jesus correctly as yasua
Yup what about it? Did you also know it didnt contain Revelation?


It has since 250 years before muhammad-

Might not be kai.


Highly unlikely
3:55 is talking about muslims Kai.


Yos Dont you get it? mo is calling those christians "MUSLIMS" even the christians at najran told mo that they were muslims already (in the arabic sense)

So you expect me to believe that sheikh imam constantine and sheikh imam simon peter were muhammads muslims yos?

61:14
O you who have believed, be supporters of Allah , as when Jesus, the son of Mary, said to the disciples, "Who are my supporters for Allah ?" The disciples said, "We are supporters of Allah ." And a faction of the Children of Israel believed and a faction disbelieved. So We supported those who believed against their enemy, and they became dominant.


1. It said Childrne of Israel not Rum.


Yos israel was not a nation at the time judea and samaria and galilee were provinces of the roman empire

And who were jesus supporters those that taught his gospel- the jews didnt believe in the gospel yos. therefor it is talking about the christians.

Image


Dont you think coming to the most Anti-Islamic forum in the world is a little bit unfair kai ?


Are you serious yos? do you really think ummah.com or sunni forums etc... would let me post that kind of research???


Yup that why i called her a retard.

You called her a retard because mary is the ONLY woman named in quran????

Imam Mehdi is not the Messiah. No muslim will say this.

I have to look at ygalgs comments on that again- but let me tell you just because he may have made a mistake on that doesnt mean he was lying yos.
He might be a Messiah according to the Bible as according to the Dead Sea Scrolls there are 3 Messias

No yos- show me that dead sea mss
but Ygalg knowledge is not that high that he meant to go that far. We tried mixing Dajjal with Mehdi which is why i got angry.


Calm down

Ok lets talk about Rafida scum Kai. 12er garbage.


They are the main shia sect 12ers that is- alawis are officially the same but they are not.

Image

Because Alawis count them self as twelver also.
Only since about 1971- they differ in many ways- alawis drink alcohol- celebrate epiphanes etc....
Are their books really authentic enough Kai? Maybe i should start using Eastern Orthodox books also and claim its Christian?

According to shia and yos 25% remember about the same as bukhari. E O are essentially the same as catholics with some differences.
No Kai Shias are clowns and Imam Mehdi will return with Jesus Inshallah.

based on what? the quran?

You know that hadith is a bit weak.

Do you believe jesus is coming at time of dajjal


No you didnt kai try again.

Yos if you refuse to accept what i post- then what good would it do?
Yup only ?of them is a Zionist to.



Can you show me this claim? Also didnt you watch the videos i posted?


5:82-83 christians are closer then the jews. Granted magi and sabians are only mentioned twice in quran.

Yes the one from as-samiri was really intriguing :D


So Russian Rabbis are Dhimmis?

That wasnt my point yos they are khazars according to you - they follow the talmud despite the fact that most other jews including yemeni jews follow talmud.


They think the are some kind of choosen people Kai.


The quran says they were 5:20-21

Im sorry 1 of the prophets was suppose to be Elijah.
Source: John 1:21

Jews at the time believed elijah would come back during the end of days. The pharisees simply asked him are you the messiah john said no then they asked if he was elijah he said no, and if he was a prophet, he said no.
He was actually the forerunne or to announce and testify that jesus was the messiah according to christians
Didnt Muhammad do this? His prophecies beats on of the biblical ones.


UHHHH NO LOL


I didnt expect something like this from you Kai. Muhammad did this to remove the attached love Muslims had for the Paganism
,

Did mo do this or ALLAH??? in any case that makes no sense so the meccans had to pray towards jerusalem for five years after they converted when he conquered it.to remove their attached love.
No yos rather mo did that because he was desperately trying to get the jews on his side yos. when he was getting converts from medinas pagans he didnt need the jews.

after 5 years they could then turn back to the Kaba that Prophet Ibrahim build and inshallah Archelogical evidenc ewill one day prove this Kai, what excuse will you have then?

What would you do if archeology proved otherwise yos?

Ofcourse you mak ask Kai, you may ask anything.
To give you answer i want you to give me your definition of a devout muslim.


It depends on the individual yos- when i was a youngster 16 i considered myself a devout christian- I didnt commit fornication(i had opportunities) smoke cigs or drugs - i would pray to god almost every dayand night. before and AFTER every meal - i would witness to people even colleagues in my high school. I even auxilliary poineered (60 hours of knocking on doors a month) I was pretty devout
That of course fell apart when i went to college
WhY do you consider yourself nOT devoutas a muslim, do you miss prayers? do you commit fornication etc.... eat sausage pizza? drink a beer


No it not well documented Kai. A Fox News report is not well documented Kai.

What about cnn?

Anwar Al Awlaki was a historian america didnt like him exposing them so they called him an Al Qaeda member announced his deaht 4 or 5 times than they killed him Illegaly in Yemen and 2 weeks later his 15 year old Son this is your goverment Kai this is why i dont like it.


Esposing them??? no yos he ran jihad sites he influenced muslims like the soldier of allah major nidal hassan
Have you heard any of his lectures Kai? They are quiet good.


Good huh???

Re: A challenge to yos on did muslims or qurysh draw first blood

PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 3:35 pm
by Ozes
Yos1994 wrote:Next you had on the list was David Wood who i showed above is a Liar. Here is a video he posted where he got arrested.



Yea... thats why the judge ordered to give him compensation :*)

Re: A challenge to yos on did muslims or qurysh draw first blood

PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2012 6:40 pm
by kaimana1
Ozes wrote:
Yos1994 wrote:Next you had on the list was David Wood who i showed above is a Liar. Here is a video he posted where he got arrested.



Yea... thats why the judge ordered to give him compensation :*)


Not only that ozes- but it looks like david and company went there recently again this time with full police cooperation :roflmao:


Re: A challenge to yos on did muslims or qurysh draw first blood

PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 4:30 pm
by kaimana1
Why is that Kai? The 616 is more authentic than the sources for 666.


Not really yos, 616 makes no sense- in many parts of the revelation 7 is used to symbolize gods perfect judgement- 6 simply represents the number of imperfection or MANS number as oppsed to gods number.


No dear kai. Its talking about Nero.

No it doesnt yos, this is an opinion of preterist christians


Be careful kai some Christians here might think that you are the anti christ.


Like i said i have been called everything but a one legged eskimo.

This is why i insult Christians
Image

Its impossible to make those Greek letters into Bismillah.


No wonder you hate christians- because this is similar to those crackpot illuminate theories you believe in yos. it's like looking into a mirror for you yos :roflmao:


665.65 i belive. I guess no other measurement that Neutical Miles fitted.... Stupid Christians...

Again sounds familar to those illuminate dajjal freemasonry theories you believe in yos.


Enlighten me about this so called "wacko theories".


Asides from the illuminati and aids was created by cia type theories what about the wacko theory that every christian scribe and preist along with every jewish scribe and rabbi colluded with one another to corrupt the bible in the SAME MANNER.

Yos, it takes a mindset that believes elephants can fly to believe such nonsense.


Eating dung is not chewing the Cud kai in any language


Okay yos you refuse to read what i posted?


What does this have anything to do with the case that Solomon could speak to ants?


because the quran is saying that solomon heard the ant queen percieve solomon being a king and his army marching along- explain how the ants percieve human affairs yos? do you actually believe this?

Non sence as you would have put it.


It is clear yos from the passage Then
THE LORD OPENED THE DONKEY’S MOUTH, and she said to Balaam, ‘What have I done to you to make you beat me these three times?’" Numbers 22:28



Could you post some proof to this Kai?

Irenaeus, Against Heresies, Book 5, Chp. 30

John didnt write the revelation Kai There where prob some legends about Nero and the number 616 so the churche added that to the book aswell.


616 is most likely a mistranslation yos. 666 has nothing to do with nero or domitian or any individual per se.


Yes they do kai Exodus, 1 2 Samuel and Jeremiah that where found in the forth cave showed that todays versions are indeed corrupted.

You should have proved that.

The firstone not the once that where reconstructed in the 16th century.


That is like saying the reconstructed 12th century quran!!! LOL




Hahahahahahahahahaha

There is no Orthodox Muslim that accepts the Satanic Verse theory kai.


Yos do you know who the narrator is that tabari used for one of the isnads? IBN ISHAQ
Besides theres more than 35 isnads regarding the satanic verses incident- some of the later ones like zamakhsahri claim that satan revealed it while they were praying in kaba in order to make it appear that mo was revealing it. but in reality later muslim scholars tried to erase the narrations going back to ibn abbas because the doctrine of mos isma was more important.
Can i laugh now??



He just spend over half of his first 55 min debunking the embryology, mountain, sea barrier did you even watch the debate Kai?????


Of course i did he didnt debunk anything yos- he lied about meanings of the words

It is William who didnt defend thebible instead started speaking about prophecies forgeting the topics. He got grilled.


That is why i say he was too old to debate like that- some older people like williams have that forgetfulness problem





Good god yos ! hahaha

THe older the wise eh Kai? Zakir Naik was 35 years old back then. More over it was an overkill, William didnt even answer 1 of Zakirs arguments. Dr Zakir naik refuted everything William talked about. No Christian has ever come close to Zakirs greatnes sin knowledge of religion.

Williams is the only christian that he has ever debated yos - even zakir naik said that williams answered two of his 20 challenges yos zakir naik didnt refute anything yos he deliberately lied about the meaning of nur daha etc... amongst other things

More over if William felt so old why did he debate him? Why didnt he send Sam Shamoun instead? Who looked like an idiot at 1:07:00 and im sure Naik wouldnt have minded it either after all Sam did debate Shabir in that same year.

Because zakir has always refused to debate anyone from any creed knowledgable about islam- that is fact



No i dont think so Kai.


I thought you were NOT biased yos :roflmao:

What what what?! Ive already posted a video refuting this.

Your video didnt refute anything yos

None of those clowns are big enough to debate Zakir Naik.
Zakir said he doesnt debate someone that cannot provide 10k in audience.

Why is that yos? what about 5 k in audience? what difference does it make? don't you find that strange?



And as far as i know Ali Sina doesnt debate.

He does written debates.

And Ali Sina doesnt have any knowledge about Islam. For crying out loud he tought that Abu Bakr was the foster brother of Muhammad.


Ali sina has quite a bit of knowlege of islam yos- Sahih Bukhari V.7, B62, N. 37
Narrated Ibn 'Abbas:
It was said to the Prophet, "Won't you marry the daughter of Hamza?" He said, "She is my foster niece (brother's daughter). "

As to your cute little link all that have been debunked answering-christianity. I can also play the link game Kai.

http://www.answering-christianity.com/y ... buttal.htm[/url


You call that a refutation???? This clown didnt even rebut half of sinas article- not only that the defense of the word nur was despicable.

Re: A challenge to yos on did muslims or qurysh draw first blood

PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 5:36 pm
by kaimana1
What year did Sami ask sam for help?

Whats up with this smokescreen yos? are you biased? :D


What year did Sami call sam Fatboy, Cross worshiper?


Did you forget about the 2005 emails you posted by that ac link??

debate
From: sami z (sami-zaatari@hotmail.com)
Sent: Tue 9/04/07 11:27 PM
To: sam_shmn40@hotmail.com

So what is your point Kai? AC had war with ETT so Sami asked a Christian for help. Is this compareble to Sams foul mouth?

And AC was never at war with AI LOL okay yos- That depends yos

More over AC are not debater on paltalk they are preachers. They convert people to Islam.



They convert a couple of people to islam -so what? the first two videos are the same girl

So now A/C are not debaters??? WOW yos
They once converted a an entire Church.


Where on earth did you get the idea that the entire church converted to islam??? did you watch that video? They converted an abandoned church into a mosque yos

Good god

Sami, Osama, Nadir, Sam, Wood, Christian_Prince, are lone wolfs in Paltalk. When they have a debate if they feel they made an impact they post it on their website if not they dont.


Lone wolf's?

But i did enjoy a good laugh Kai When nadir said.
Osama, you most excellent kaffir.. how dare you insult our Prophet(P) by saying he has a mental disease wallahi, if I ever meet you on the street.... youre done.... and it WILL happen.I'll triangle choke you You can come down to my ju jitzu gym. This is JIHAD.


Hahahaha i enjoy this Kai im not biased.But Nadir have a ego why AC even takes him serious idk.


You arent biased??? Do you really believe that yos?
Nadir is a clown kai ive already said that he is a child before.


So why do you take his site seriously?


I dont belive things based on documents but it wouldnt surprise me when he start talking about fights.


Would that include the quran?? LMAO
But lets find the truth Kai.

Sure dearest yos -will you?

sami z <sami-zaatari@hotmail.com> wrote:
> lol he is very stupid indeed. he claims christian prince humiliated me,
>thats why all the muslims in the room were laughing at cp for running away
>from the debate, which was recorded
Christian_prince do indeed run from Sami.


Well, sami was answering nadir here. in any case the video with the chicken doesnt prove anything yos-

Was osama making the chicken sound for the video in the bg? LMAO


Matter infact he runs from any fair debate and only debates in his own room.


A FAIR DEBATE huh? have you been in paltalk yos.

Also i dont know why AC wants Nadir to remove the debate. It never took place.


So you are calling AC liars now?
http://www.examinethetruth.com/cp_debate.htm
CP couldnt answer him he just brought some fabricated hadiths and Nadir keep talking about babies being killed.

First of all yos nadir lost that debate because he never answered cps claim about animal sex- did you watch the clip yos??
Ive posted enough links to show that nadir is indeed a liar

Re: A challenge to yos on did muslims or qurysh draw first blood

PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 7:18 pm
by kaimana1
Since you liked the subject of Muslims disagreeing lets have a look at Christians disagreeing.


You missed the point of why i posted those links and emails yos :nono: if it was merely to show there disagreements i could post pages upon pages of intermuslim disagreements.

My main purpose was to show that nadir was a liar yos

secondly to show that bassam and sami zataari both left AC because osama doesnt teach sound islamic doctrine on basic islam.

Thirdly to show the inconsistencies of sami zataari and osama


Hey Mr. "Missionary" Shamoun, apparently your not really popular with your christian crowd.

When I posted these 2 links>> http://www.answering-christianity.com/s ... moun_4.htm
http://www.answering-christianity.com/s ... _mouth.htm

Here is what one Christian said after reading it:

evanslablah: all that's crazy
evanslablah: i was reading them but couldn't continue
evanslablah: i don't think that guy's a missionary. it's only his claim but he's not one
evanslablah: i asure you that wht he's doing is not christian. he's only satisfying his personal ego

Good Job!! LOL[/quote]

Yos where does sam ever say that he is a missionary?? LMAO these are the words of the muslims yos

Who is evanslablah? has he read the correspondence from both sides?

John Gilchrist who is held high in Answering-Islam
http://answering-islam.org/authors/gilchrist.html


Yeah , but where's the proof yos?
From: "Yusuf Ismail" <ismaillaw@telkomsa.net>
To: QuranSearchCom@yahoo.com
Subject: FW: CHALLENGE TO A DEBATE-SOUTH AFRICA
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 00:11:35 +0200
Assalamualaikum Osama Abdallah

I thought you would be interested in including this email in ur abusive
email sections. I mailed a copy to Gilchrist in Benoni and he informed
me that Sam Shamoun doesn't represent mainstream Christian thinking but
fanaticism. Post this in the dumpster section. This man has diarrhea of
his mouth. Nothing he says on his site is of any substance and judging
by his emotionalism, bad grammar and response, maybe its not worth
responding to debris. Based in South Africa, I am curious to know: has
this sadist ever engaged in a public debate or does he confine his
irrationality to abusive emails and poor writing?

Salams

-----Original Message-----
From: sam shamoun [mailto:sam_shmn40@hotmail.com]
Sent: 28 January 2007 21:15
To: ismaillaw@telkomsa.net
Subject: RE: CHALLENGE TO A DEBATE-SOUTH AFRICA

I would love nothing more than to destroy a bastard like yourself, not
just your student. In fact, to make it fair I want to squash both you
bastards. Instead of having me come there, set it up here in the USA with one of
your terrorist orgnaizations so I can bury you with Deedat. Afterall, that
fat demon Deedat didn't mind coming here so you should have no problem
doing likewise so I can embarrass you and shw to the world it is your prophet
who was a pervert. And I doubt you are a man to set it up here but I will
wait. Bring your bite next time, not your bark.

>From: "Yusuf Ismail" <ismaillaw@telkomsa.net>
>To: <sam_shmn40@hotmail.com>
>Subject: CHALLENGE TO A DEBATE-SOUTH AFRICA
>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 18:02:21 +0200
>
>
>My name is Yusuf Ismail and for a short period of time I was based at
>the Islamic propagation Center International. I presently reside in
>Durban, South Africa. Over the course of the years I have engaged
>individuals such as John Gilchrist, David Foster and other individuals
>who are not small time barkers such as yourself.
>
>I had the misfortune of recently seeing your abusive emails with Osama
>Abdallah. There are in my opinion two reasons for your abuse. One
being,
>that you are an insecure imbecile and need to make a point. The other
is
>the shallowness of your thinking and failure to come to terms with the
>irrationality of your perverted religion. One could go on speaking of
>the filth that emanates from a book you consider to be "divine", but I
>would rather deal with hardcore scholarly research. Have you for
example studied the documentary hypothesis. You are therefore
>invited to debate a student of mine, if you do not have cold-feet.
>
>We could make the flight arrangements and necessary trip to meet you
if
>you wish. However if you are feeling somewhat weak, we cold have an
>internet debate. Judging by your writings and corrupted views, you
might
>bow down for the latter.
>
>Let me have your response.
>
>Yusuf


Yos that was deceptive on your part the sam shamoun reply should have been last. how would you repond to an email that was worded like yusufs? clearly he was taunting sam. i thought you were unbiased yos?



You can't be serious yos... cp was suddenly cut off how did you know that was cp telling sam to shut up?

Here a Email you didnt post Kai.


O posted the LINK yos with all of those emails
RE: 'terror of the Lord'... and Shamoun won.. ooooooook.?
From: sami z (sami-zaatari@hotmail.com)
Sent: Sat 1/05/08 8:02 PM To: Nadir Ahmed (nadir@examinethetruth.com); tariqroshan@gmail.com

Cc: 'sam shamoun' (sam_shmn40@hotmail.com); palmproject@hotmail.com; info@ministrytomuslims.com; info@ylfc.org; press@3xterrorists.com; saleem.kamal@yahoo.com; linden7@attglobal.net; jdavidlehman@msn.com; m2a5@netzero.net; emileh@co.kern.ca.us; thesingingcarpenter@yahoo.com; grace1732@hotmail.com; akitob_prince@yahoo.com; administrator@ministrytomuslims.com; director@ministrytomuslims.com; jwswaney@eastside.com; sabeeldawah@yahoo.com; my.choice.islam@gmail.com; adeel.invitationtotruth@gmail.com; adeenenator@gmail.com; ahmederee@yahoo.com; bklimas@hotmail.com; exposelies@yahoo.com; islam_defender@hotmail.com; islamttd786@yahoo.com; just_flow11@hotmail.com; kzaheeralmawrid@hotmail.com; menj1980@hotmail.com; kmdhn@hotmail.com; mrdebatethehate@earthlink.net; mucahit@islamonline.net; munir0728@yahoo.com; muzjid.al.aziz@hotmail.com; nadermusa@hotmail.com; quransearchcom@yahoo.com; aimoo992000@yahoo.com; sendarticle@faithfreedom.com; umarhassan_63@yahoo.com; islam_the_true_deen786@hotmail.com; ghanmy@gmail.com; yahya-ahmed_@hotmail.com; ipo@muslimphilosophy.com; kzaheer_lums@hotmail.com; zaatari@hotmail.com; admin@thetruereligion.net; b_zawadi@hotmail.com

hey shamoun why is that on a pc you always act hard and talk crap? yet face to face you become this little B and
start begging nadir to be your friend and ending the past beef? i dont understand this...........i hope someone else on this list could explain that? is that a peace-loving Christian trait you guys have or what????????[


Seems like 2 years after Sam and Nadir became friends according to Sami? This is 2008 the emals you posted where 2006.


Sami and sam were going at it since the summer of 2007 when they had a written debate on Ai and samis site call to monothesim- sami and sam were in a heated exchange for months when sami posted that email . By december of 2008 sami and sam stopped the beef
http://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=6590312557191237519&postID=358155093369604128

Sami Zaatari said...
http://muslim-responses.com/Wood_and_Tr ... and_Truth_

the link, these were old emails people, i admit they were wrong, thats why me and shamoun made a treaty. but these emails have nothing to do with the present situation, Wood is taking an old situation completely out of context.

December 14, 2008 8:12 PM


You see yos sami was only insulting sam in that email you posted- not because of any substance- but rather because of his temper- this is the debate sami was referring to







This was so one sided against nadir it isnt funny!!

Re: A challenge to yos on did muslims or qurysh draw first b

PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2012 4:10 pm
by Monotheism
Hello my dear kai.

That was the point of the injeel yos

According to the Christians yes. There is no concept of a Old or New testament in Islam. Jesus had the original Torah with him when it was corrupted around the Pharisees.

I know that- we know the quran is NoT clear

It is very clear in Arabic kai. I take it that your an arabic speaker?

Only if he worshipped other gods inside israel yos. if ghandi was a canaanite at that time then he wouldnt be mahatma ghandi.

If he worshiped Krisna im sure Solomon wouldnt have been happy Kai.

You left out psalm 91 so you want to play the game of is osama twisting these verses or what?

Freshen my mind kai what where talking about there?

well christians would use daniel 12:9 daniel chapter 9. Now yos do you believe that jesus is coming ?

Dont see any indication there Kai.

Or you mean to your distorted view of the tanakh?

The jewish view Kai.

You havent been able to prove that isa is jesus name- isa does not correspond with yeshua in any shape or form

Its Arabic Kai. Just like Dhul-Kifl for Ezekiel. Mahomet has no correspond with Muhammad. Yet when Joseph Smith was shoting that he belive Muhammad (saw) was a true prophet he used the name Muhammad. And must i reminde you what your founding fathers called muslims? Here the treaty of tripoli to refreshen your memory kai.

As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion,—as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Mussulmen [Muslims],—and as the said States never entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mahometan [Muslim] nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries

More over the Je sound doesnt even exist in hebrew Kai.

in modern Hebrew the ג (Gimmel - third letter of the Hebrew alphabet) is used with an apostrophe to change it from G "as in Give" to J as in "Jay". This is a linguistic invention to allow transliteration from other languages.

So Yeshua or Jesus makes no sence Kai.

How do you know that mo wasnt confronted by a demon who called himself jibreel?

Pleas Kai dont say mo.

Because of the Miraj and the Quran Kai.
Paul contradicted Jesus.

The entire concept of jesus comes from the NT yos- let that sink in

Thats your wishful thinking Kai. The concept of a son of god jesus is from the NT which is confronted in the Quran.


So you believe the tanakh and the injeel are corrupted??
Check out this link yos by professor abdullah saeed explaining in detail that the charges that most modern day muslims about the bible being corrupted are unfounded
http://www.quranandinjil.org/sites/defa ... 0Saeed.pdf

Prophet Muhammad (saw) himself said they are corrupted my dear Kai.

Narrated Ubaidullah: "Ibn 'Abbas said, "Why do you ask the people of the scripture about anything while your Book (Quran) which has been revealed to Allah's Apostle is newer and the latest? You read it pure, undistorted and unchanged, and Allah has told you that the people of the scripture (Jews and Christians) changed their scripture and distorted it, and wrote the scripture with their own hands and said, 'It is from Allah,' to sell it for a little gain. Does not the knowledge which has come to you prevent you from asking them about anything? No, by Allah, we have never seen any man from them asking you regarding what has been revealed to you!" (S Bukhari, Volume 9, Book 92, Number 461)"

So where is the real gospel yos god says he protects his words - where are they?

Jesus preached it. It doesnt mean it was written down :lol: Parts of it sure.

Jesus said he came to fulfill the torah the prophets david is a prophet- any learned christian knows this- besides luke24:44 He said to them, "This is what I told you while I was still with you: Everything must be fulfilled that is written about me in the Law of Moses, the Prophets and the Psalms."

Not only didnt he fullfiel any of the original Messianic prophecies he even gave a false prophecy

Matthew 24:34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

again yes david is a prophet- the problem arises when you muslims consider adam and lot prophets.

Adam was indeed a prophet and so was Lot. However i dont want to mention how Lot is portrayed in the Tanach kai as you are aware.

Thats the point yos i have as much evidence for bukhari being a homo as you do with paul being a homo

I have his sexism and him giving Timothy a good time.
Also read this kai(im not providing this as proof)
http://www.nytimes.com/1991/02/02/nyreg ... -fury.html

Thats right yos mo would think the hebrew word banou was IBNU. got it?

Im confused kai can you explain to me. From what ive understood it Banu doesn mean ibnu is that your argument?

They had the hebrew, aramaic (syriac)and greek not assyrian-


Sahih Bukhari Volume 1, Book 1, Number 3:
Khadija then accompanied him to her cousin Waraqa bin Naufal bin Asad bin 'Abdul 'Uzza, who, during the PreIslamic Period became a Christian and used to write the writing with Hebrew letters. He would write from the Gospel in Hebrew as much as Allah wished him to write.

Waraqa was an Ebionite Kai. His Gospel(singular) is not the one in the NT.

Yos you left out this part Khadija replied, "Never! By Allah, Allah will never disgrace you
So i khadijah a prophet

No kai. She pointed out God wouldnt be unfair because his not unfair like Christian belive he is.

The isnad with arabic is FAR more stronger but even the one you displayed says the same thing except he wrote the gospel in hebrew
Notice how they all say he became a christian??? Jews dont believe in gospel yos.
[/quote
Christians dont belive in that Gospel either kai? Can you find me a Peshitta or an New Testament including The Gospel of the Nazarenes orThe Gospel of the Ebionites orThe Gospel of the Hebrews?

They wouldnt have too as the peshitta was in existence- where does the word injil derive from yos? al bishara would be a proper arabic word for the gospel but they used the word derived from the GREEK

Coptics still use Injeel today so im confused now Kai what you mean when was the word al bishara used?

Notice how it says preach THE GOSPEL. thanks for bringing that verse up to prove that the gospels are ONE. Like i said yos jesus was the gospel i told you this before. His disciples wrote the teachings of jesus down.

So the 30 gospels are 1? More over i bet i can make a 101 contradiction out of the 4 in the New Testament if i took the time so how are they 1?

His tafsir regarding surah al anfal

post it please. Also im a Ibn Abbas fan so i dont pay much attention to Ibn Kathir. But im sure Ibn Kathir had more sence than to say Bulus is a Prophet.

Well the quran is UNCLEAR -

Its clear enough for me Kai.

after shishak was crushed at carchemish nebuchadnezzar took the entire levant and judah as well...they also made egypt tributaory and henceforth nebu made egypt work for him by producing the tribute

Read the prophecy Kai. Nebuchadnezzar was crushed in 568 and therfor never fullfield.

Hmmm is that your OPINION ?

Compare him with Abdullah Smith and than say my Opinion.

Gimme a break yos Are you naive enough to believe that it took osama 8 or 9 years to understand that lying is wrong???? LOL and contrary to what he claims osama was losing alot of viewers and was under alot of pressure to issue that apology- he has lied about answering islam many times and he never retracted those statements.

Come on Kai give Osama a break. Sam is just much of a liar. Just take a look at his translation of

"Do not hurt me regarding Aisha, as the Divine Inspirations do not come to me when I am in the [thowb] cloth (i.e. blanket) of any of wives except [in that of] Aisha.” (Sahih Bukhari, Hadith 2393)

In his translation he has فِي ثَوْبِ as wearing clothes .

Ofcourse 1 hadith refutes that.

“Don't trouble me regarding 'Aisha, for by Allah, the Divine Inspiration never came to me while I was under the blanket of any woman amongst you except her." (Sahih Bukhari, Hadith 3491)

You are most welcome! i cant wait till the day when you complete your apostacy and write articles against islam for iffo's new site.

Hahahaha.

The rashidun didnt think so. nor did the ummayads ,seljuks, rasulids safavids, ottomans or the moghuls etc....etc...

Omar bin al Khattab allowed Jews back to Jerusalem Kai.

Nadir has been exposed and you still insist on taking him seriously? do you have any integrity yos?

Nadir seems to know Sam real well Kai. Making such a lie would easily been refuted by Sam. Sam never refuted it from my understanding.

That is twisting what james was saying.

White is an Calvinist or should i say Reformed. He reject 1 john 5:7 isnt that enough to say he belives bible is corrupted? 1 interpolation is enough for me Kai.

Any christian knows this was refering to jesus disciples

Does the verse say disciples kai? Dont think so.

You missed the part of verse that says they miraculously could speak in foreign tongues. why to spread the gospel and to testify that they had gods holy spirit

as for handling snakes it isnt a test yos- it was merely telling how they would be protected any serious christian knows that you never put God to the test like that. If naik knew the bible so well he would have known that.

Kai christian lies isnt a fact. THe verse doesnt say anything that you portrayed and even snake handeling pastor take it as a test.

[url]http://news.yahoo.com/serpent-handling-west-virginia-pastor-dies-snake-bite-173406645--abc-news-topstories.html
[/url]


That isnt lying yos- they took the fatwah seriously ? why should you be surprised yos- theres isnads of multiple hadees and sirat that say aisha was 9 when mo pierced her. So thighing a little girl wouldnt be surprising

All those Isnads are from Iraq and most of them are from a 71year old guy who was reported to have a very very bad memory :lol:

thinging is very very surprising kai and thats why Sam is a filty liar. Just like the bible translators.

So how is that proving him a liar yos?

Im confused you yourself said Yesu of the bible is that Wizard that lived 100years before Jesus if im not misrepresenting you(long time ago). So isnt William craig lying by your own criteria for Yesu?

That makes muhammad a clown then HA hAAA

Where did Muhammad(saw) say the Kitab is from God?

Nasara were the muslims yos...that is what mo was alluding to.

No kai. No. Nasara are not muslims. Just like Bani Israel are not Jews.

Dont you believe in swoon theory yos?

Its a good theory kai. But Jesus himself isnt a historical figure and if i wasnt a muslim i would probly not belive he didnt exist so there are lacks Kai.

Read that carefully yos.

Thats why i have problem with the swoon.

Re: A challenge to yos on did muslims or qurysh draw first b

PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2012 5:50 pm
by Monotheism
LOL and if you muslims dropped the crescent and venus symbol you would be like the jews.

It mostly represents the month of ramadan. But im against symbolism my self.

Dont you believe that jesus was born to a virgin preached the good news ran afoul to his enemies and suffers (according to swoon theory)

Where did you get that i accept the swoon theory from?

The NT yos.

Why not in the 30other gospels?

No yos- but aisha bewley is translating it as we speak.

Ok kai. No doubt now that you are an Arabic speaker?

Hmm really?

Yup. Ibn Hazm didnt think so to.

It has since 250 years before muhammad-

The original one didnt along many other books like 2 and 3 john i belive.

Yos Dont you get it? mo is calling those christians "MUSLIMS" even the christians at najran told mo that they were muslims already (in the arabic sense)

What are you on about Children of Israel where not Jew and the term Christian wasnt coined for the first followers.

So you expect me to believe that sheikh imam constantine and sheikh imam simon peter were muhammads muslims yos?

Constantine was never even a christian. And Peter was a deciple not an Imam. More over by that logic Peter would have been a Yahoodi.

Yos israel was not a nation at the time judea and samaria and galilee were provinces of the roman empire

The romans where the once who mostly followed the Tunisian Tertullians new doctrine called Trinity when Athanasius and Constatine made it Orthodox. Can you prove to me that the Pharisees belived in the trinity :lol: ?

Are you serious yos? do you really think ummah.com or sunni forums etc... would let me post that kind of research???

Why dont you go to a hindu or a sikh forum instead?

No yos- show me that dead sea mss

Wasnt Cyrus a messiah?

5:82-83 christians are closer then the jews. Granted magi and sabians are only mentioned twice in quran.

"qaloo inna nasara" Can you show me 1 christian saying his a nasrani today kai :D ?

More over that verse is talking to Muhammad (saw9 about the people that lived BACK then.

Tafsir al-Jalalayn
You, O Muhammad (s), will truly find the most hostile of people to those who believe to be the Jews and the idolaters, of Mecca, because of the intensity of their disbelief, ignorance and utter preoccupation with following whims; and you will truly find the nearest of them in love to those who believe to be those who say ‘Verily, we are Christians’; that, nearness of theirs in love to the believers is, because some of them are priests, scholars, and monks, devout worshippers, and because they are not disdainful, of following the truth, as the Jews and the Meccans are.

Tanwîr al-Miqbâs min Tafsîr Ibn ‘Abbâs
Allah then showed their enmity towards the Prophet (pbuh) and his Companions, saying: (Thou wilt find) O Muhammad (the most vehement of mankind in hostility) and most vile in speech (to those who believe) Muhammad and his Companions ((to be) the Jews) the Jews of the Banu Qurayzah, Banu'l-Nadir, Fadak and Khaybar (and the idolaters) and the most vehement in hostility to the believers among the idolaters are the idolaters of Mecca. (And thou wilt find the nearest of them in affection) in their bond and most lenient in speech (to those who believe) Muhammad and his Companions ((to be) those who say: Lo! We are Christians) the Negus and his followers who were 32 men; it is also said that they were 40 people in total: 32 from Abyssinia, and eight monks from Historic Syria: the monk Bahirah and his followers Abrahah, Ashraf, Idris, Tamim, Tammam, Durayd and Ayman. (That) affection (is because there are among them priests) ascetics whose heads are shaved in the middle (and monks) secluded in monasteries who are their men of knowledge, (and because they are not proud) in believing in Muhammad and the Qur'an.

We really need to start getting into context my dear kai.

That wasnt my point yos they are khazars according to you - they follow the talmud despite the fact that most other jews including yemeni jews follow talmud.

These Yemeni Jews?


The quran says they were 5:20-21

Is the Quran talking about Bani Israel or Bani Askenasi in that verse Kai?

Jews at the time believed elijah would come back during the end of days.

Can you prove this Kai? NT is an unhistorical book of fiction. It also says Jews belived Messiah is the son of God
UHHHH NO LOL

Did Jesus predict that Arabs would build tall buildings ?

That one was good you have to admit kai.

What would you do if archeology proved otherwise yos?

I would yes. I also become atheist if they find the missing link which we hahahah :lotpot: Not some hoax like Lucy to but acctual evidence.

when i was a youngster 16 i considered myself a devout christian- I didnt commit fornication(i had opportunities) smoke cigs or drugs - i would pray to god almost every dayand night. before and AFTER every meal - i would witness to people even colleagues in my high school. I even auxilliary poineered (60 hours of knocking on doors a month) I was pretty devout

Yeah than im devout to

WhY do you consider yourself nOT devoutas a muslim, do you miss prayers? do you commit fornication etc.... eat sausage pizza? drink a beer

That stuff is avrage not devout kai. Maybe in the 80s yes but Islam has gotten stronger since then No more topless parties in Iraq and Beirut isnt the "Paris of the Middle East" anymore.

What about cnn?

Nope.

Esposing them??? no yos he ran jihad sites he influenced muslims like the soldier of allah major nidal hassan

Thats a lie Kai. Imam Awlaki was exposing them and he did nothing more than what you call freespeach

Not really yos, 616 makes no sense- in many parts of the revelation 7 is used to symbolize gods perfect judgement- 6 simply represents the number of imperfection or MANS number as oppsed to gods number.

Book of revelation is a book paganism Kai. If you take a look at my signature you see what i mean. 616 would make perfect sence refering to Nero.

Like i said i have been called everything but a one legged eskimo.

Ok kai you one legged eskimo.

No wonder you hate christians- because this is similar to those crackpot illuminate theories you believe in yos. it's like looking into a mirror for you yos

is that so Kai?

because the quran is saying that solomon heard the ant queen percieve solomon being a king and his army marching along- explain how the ants percieve human affairs yos? do you actually believe this?

Nothing is impossible for God. Even Trees can vote according to the Bible.

You should have proved that.

Dont you know what they found in Qumran cave 4 kai?

That is like saying the reconstructed 12th century quran!!! LOL

Sana manuscripts refutes you there my dear kai.

Yos do you know who the narrator is that tabari used for one of the isnads? IBN ISHAQ

The same Ibn Ishaq that was kicked out of Medina for making up hadiths?

Williams is the only christian that he has ever debated yos

No Kai.


Why is that yos? what about 5 k in audience? what difference does it make? don't you find that strange?

You you think Scam Shamoun could get an 5k audience?

Ali sina has quite a bit of knowlege of islam yos- Sahih Bukhari V.7, B62, N. 37
Narrated Ibn 'Abbas:
It was said to the Prophet, "Won't you marry the daughter of Hamza?" He said, "She is my foster niece (brother's daughter). "

How does that say Abu Bakr is the foster brother of Prophet Muhammad (saw)?

A FAIR DEBATE huh? have you been in paltalk yos.

Yes Kai i have and i hope you are there to sometimes. CP left before he got the mic.

First of all yos nadir lost that debate because he never answered cps claim about animal sex- did you watch the clip yos??

Cp never answer Nadir question.

Re: A challenge to yos on did muslims or qurysh draw first b

PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 2:39 pm
by Ghaith
kaimana1 wrote:
Ozes wrote:
Yos1994 wrote:Next you had on the list was David Wood who i showed above is a Liar. Here is a video he posted where he got arrested.



Yea... thats why the judge ordered to give him compensation :*)


Not only that ozes- but it looks like david and company went there recently again this time with full police cooperation :roflmao:



Police cooperation. Police is asking for trouble, trying to evangelize people in a arab festival one cant exactly expect a warm welcome.

You think i would get a warm welcome from this christians Kai if i tried to preach Quran and revert them to Islam?



Re: A challenge to Ghaith on did muslims or qurysh draw firs

PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 6:42 pm
by kaimana1
My dearest ghaith?? You came back! anyways ive been a busy man i will respond to your smokescreens in a couple days

Hang tight little buddy

Re: A challenge to Ghaith on did muslims or qurysh draw firs

PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 8:33 pm
by monotheism
Kai :lol2:

Heard you moved?

Yeah i came back why notyou seemed to get bored here if im not around?

Re: A challenge to Ghaith on did muslims or qurysh draw firs

PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2012 12:44 pm
by monotheism
You gotta check out my stuff kai :lol2:





http://answering-bibleca.weebly.com/mary-trinity.html

Anyways hit me up with an email once you have replied.

little buddy kai ;)

Re: A challenge to Ghaith on did muslims or qurysh draw firs

PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:17 pm
by kaimana1
Hello my dear kai.



Hello d mono- what happened to your name?


According to the Christians yes. There is no concept of a Old or New testament in Islam. Jesus had the original Torah with him when it was corrupted around the Pharisees.

Mono... mo knew what he called "the nasara" had the injeel and the torah. Not once did he or his quran say the torah was corrupted much less by the Pharisees. :lotpot:


It is very clear in Arabic kai. I take it that your an arabic speaker?


The quran is NOT clear on many issues my dear mono whether in Arabic or English. Iv'e learned quite a bit over the years mono.


If he worshiped Krisna im sure Solomon wouldnt have been happy Kai.


You miss the point - why would ghandi transport himself to 1000 bc Israel to worship khrishna?




Dont see any indication there Kai.


Because you don't want to. :heh:


The jewish view Kai.


You mean the corrupted jewish view mono. Hmmm


Its Arabic Kai. Just like Dhul-Kifl for Ezekiel. Mahomet has no correspond with Muhammad.


Are you kidding me mono??? that was a god awful example
Dhul-kifl has no correlation with the name Ezekiel whatsoever mono- while many mufassir believed dhul khifl was Ezekiel - some were not sure- some believe it was Obadiah and I believe al- qutba believed it was Isaiah (ahmadis believe dhul khifl was Siddhartha Gautama) The word in Arabic that corresponds to Ezekiel is HIZ'QUL- that is why there is so much confusion about dhil khufl mono-because it doesn't correspond in any way to Ezekiel .
As for Mahomet that is the Turkish pronounciation of mo simple as that- those Barbary pirates in Libya and Algeria were vassals of the ottomans- so when American diplomats referred to muslims and Muhammad they woulkd use Turkish pronounciation.

Lastly, didn't you know that many muslims at that time would call themselves muhammadens?

Yet when Joseph Smith was shoting that he belive Muhammad (saw) was a true prophet he used the name Muhammad

Was this prophet joseph smith using Turkish pronounciation??

.
And must i reminde you what your founding fathers called muslims? Here the treaty of tripoli to refreshen your memory kai.

As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion,—as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Mussulmen [Muslims],—and as the said States never entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mahometan [Muslim] nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries


answered you above

More over the Je sound doesnt even exist in hebrew Kai.

in modern Hebrew the ג (Gimmel - third letter of the Hebrew alphabet) is used with an apostrophe to change it from G "as in Give" to J as in "Jay". This is a linguistic invention to allow transliteration from other languages
So Yeshua or Jesus makes no sence Kai.


You are attacking strawman here mono I didn't make that argument. And you are going to tell me there is no YOD in Hebrew. :lotpot: maybe you meant there is no y or j in koine greek which is true- that is why they used iesous for jesus
in any case yasu or yeshua certainly is the correct pronounciatian -greek and English are NOT semetic languages so the differences will be more glaring.

Pleas Kai dont say mo.


Mo is not a derogatory term- are you monotheistic to Muhammad or allah perhaps they are one in the same.?
Because of the Miraj and the Quran Kai.

Really mono?
Paul contradicted Jesus
.

That depends on how you selectively quote paul and jesus on various issues

The quran contradicts the torah and gospel even plenty of hades for that matter

Thats your wishful thinking Kai. The concept of a son of god jesus is from the NT which is confronted in the Quran.


It doesn't matter mono. the concept of jesus the messiah born to a virgin comes from the Christians and there injeel



Prophet Muhammad (saw) himself said they are corrupted my dear Kai.


did you read that link I provided by professor Abdullah saeed? anyways

Narrated Ubaidullah: "Ibn 'Abbas said, "Why do you ask the people of the scripture about anything while your Book (Quran) which has been revealed to Allah's Apostle is newer and the latest? You read it pure, undistorted and unchanged, and Allah has told you that the people of the scripture (Jews and Christians) changed their scripture and distorted it, and wrote the scripture with their own hands and said, 'It is from Allah,' to sell it for a little gain. Does not the knowledge which has come to you prevent you from asking them about anything? No, by Allah, we have never seen any man from them asking you regarding what has been revealed to you!" (S Bukhari, Volume 9, Book 92, Number 461)"


That is talking about 2:79 it wasn't referring to Christians by any measure and it was referring to SOME UNLETTERED jews who would write books then again ummiyah dould mean gentile and refer to some arabs like musaylima receiving their own scripture or some arabs meeting the quranic challenge. Ha ha
http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari52.html
Lets emphacize on ibn abbas tafsir on 5:68 we will find that most of your ulema didn't subscribe to that. same thing with ibn kathir and al bukhari also shows contradictory reports

Before you say there is no isnad remember that any hadee contradicting the quran must be discarded. It doesn't matter though theres plenty of tafsir that believe allahs books can't be changed like the gospels and torah and prophets


http://altafsir.com/Tafasir.asp?tMadhNo=0&tTafsirNo=73&tSoraNo=5&tAyahNo=68&tDisplay=yes&UserProfile=0
and this * تفسير
Tanwîr al-Miqbâs min Tafsîr Ibn ‘Abbâs مصنف و مدقق مرحلة اولى

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------







{ قُلْ يَـٰأَهْلَ ٱلْكِتَابِ لَسْتُمْ عَلَىٰ شَيْءٍ حَتَّىٰ تُقِيمُواْ ٱلتَّوْرَاةَ وَٱلإِنْجِيلَ وَمَآ أُنزِلَ إِلَيْكُمْ مِّن رَّبِّكُمْ وَلَيَزِيدَنَّ كَثِيراً مِّنْهُمْ مَّآ أُنْزِلَ إِلَيْكَ مِن رَّبِّكَ طُغْيَاناً وَكُفْراً فَلاَ تَأْسَ عَلَى ٱلْقَوْمِ ٱلْكَافِرِينَ }


(Say) O Muhammad: (O People of the Scripture!) i.e. the Jews and Christians. (You have naught) of the religion of Allah (till ye observe the Torah and the Gospel) until you truly believe in what is in the Torah and the Gospel (and that which was revealed unto thee (Muhammad) from your Lord) in all Scriptures given to all messengers. (That which is revealed unto you (Muhammad) from your Lord) the Qur'an (is certain to increase the contumacy) constancy in disbelief (and disbelief) and firmness in disbelief (of many of them) of their disbelievers. (But grieve not for the disbelieving folk) do not be saddened for their destruction in their state of disbelief, if they do not believe.

{
and this is the tafsir al jalalayn the two jalils mono


وَوَهَبْنَا لَهُ إِسْحَاقَ وَيَعْقُوبَ وَجَعَلْنَا فِي ذُرِّيَّتِهِ ٱلنُّبُوَّةَ وَٱلْكِتَابَ وَآتَيْنَاهُ أَجْرَهُ فِي ٱلدُّنْيَا وَإِنَّهُ فِي ٱلآخِرَةِ لَمِنَ ٱلصَّالِحِينَ }


And We gave him, after Ishmael, Isaac, and Jacob, after Isaac; and We ordained among his descendants prophethood, thus all prophets after Abraham are descended from him, and the Scripture, meaning, the [Holy] Books, the Torah, THE GOSPELS, the Psalms and the Criterion (al-furqān). And We gave him his reward in this world, which is fair praise [of him] by members of all the [Abrahamic] religions. And in the Hereafter he shall truly be among the righteous, for whom there shall be the highest degrees [of reward].



Theres many more but


Jesus preached it. It doesnt mean it was written down Parts of it sure.


The quran alludes to their present scripture repeatedly mono.


Not only didnt he fullfiel any of the original Messianic prophecies he even gave a false prophecy

Matthew 24:34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.


Most Christians believe it is a parallel prophecy regarding the 2nd temple destruction of Jerusalem and the end times.

Adam was indeed a prophet and so was Lot. However i dont want to mention how Lot is portrayed in the Tanach kai as you are aware.

So allegedly adam who was supposedly kicked down from paradise in heaven to earth because he disobeyed is sent down to earth as punishment along with his offspring to be was suddenly made a prophet?

I know you are on a straight path to APOSTACY.


I have his sexism and him giving Timothy a good time.


His sexism which is so abundant in the muslim world and the quran and hades - get real mono also, what is up with paul giving timothy a good time- getting circumcised is a good time?? are you for real mono?

Also read this kai(im not providing this as proof)
http://www.nytimes.com/1991/02/02/nyreg ... -fury.html


so


Im confused kai can you explain to me. From what ive understood it Banu doesn mean ibnu is that your argument?


yes im saying that Muhammad heard some of the jewish scribes refer to ezra as banu messenger.... and mo thought they were saying ibnu or son of


Waraqa was an Ebionite Kai. His Gospel(singular) is not the one in the NT.


It says nasara for Christian not ebionite- so how do you know waraqa was an ebionite?

It doesn't matter because they had their gospel which many experts believe was the gospel of matthew.
or the gospel which contained all four in one.


No kai. She pointed out God wouldnt be unfair because his not unfair like Christian belive he is.

The isnad with arabic is FAR more stronger but even the one you displayed says the same thing except he wrote the gospel in hebrew
Notice how they all say he became a christian??? Jews dont believe in gospel Ghaith.
[/quote
Christians dont belive in that Gospel either kai? Can you find me a Peshitta or an New Testament including The Gospel of the Nazarenes orThe Gospel of the Ebionites orThe Gospel of the Hebrews?


The gospel of the Hebrews and Nazarenes mentioned that jesus was baptized by john the Baptist. islam doesn't even recognize baptism. Nestorians were somewhat common in Arabia at that time they adhere to the peshitta. so prove that waraqa was NOT a nestorian


Coptics still use Injeel today so im confused now Kai what you mean when was the word al bishara used?

That makes sense that the copts would use a word derived from the greek to use for the gospel. what I was saying was why not use the Arabic equivelant of the Aramaic ha bishara for the gospel?


So the 30 gospels are 1? More over i bet i can make a 101 contradiction out of the 4 in the New Testament if i took the time so how are they 1?

You?? You mean shabir ally? well Christians made their 101 contradictions cleared up- anyways the thirty gospels have you seen them ? like the gospel of Thomas which says jesus was GOD in those words as well as many others. If I was a Trinitarian in those days I would have made sure those gospels were canonized. but they didn't mono.

post it please. Also im a Ibn Abbas fan so i dont pay much attention to Ibn Kathir. But im sure Ibn Kathir had more sence than to say Bulus is a Prophet.


Really so you have become an ibn abbas fan?

Its clear enough for me Kai.

If vague is clear then sure




Compare him with Abdullah Smith and than say my Opinion.

Abdullah smith who got crushed about his jesus had female breasts article???? LOL


Come on Kai give Osama a break


why?
.
Sam is just much of a liar. Just take a look at his translation of

"Do not hurt me regarding Aisha, as the Divine Inspirations do not come to me when I am in the [thowb] cloth (i.e. blanket) of any of wives except [in that of] Aisha.” (Sahih Bukhari, Hadith 2393)

In his translation he has فِي ثَوْبِ as wearing clothes
.

Did you see the context of why sam was saying that? go back and look.



Hahahaha.

Im not laughing

DEAD SERIOUS

Omar bin al Khattab allowed Jews back to Jerusalem Kai.


So omar allowed those jews he kicked out of Arabia to go back to Jerusalem. HMMMMM


Nadir seems to know Sam real well Kai. Making such a lie would easily been refuted by Sam. Sam never refuted it from my understanding.


Nadir is like that with anyone he talks to. he is a very manipulative personality did you see him crop that video about the rationalizer saying Muhammad prophecied correctly?

LMAO I suggest you go to the jinn and tonic show and check out the unedited version.


White is an Calvinist or should i say Reformed. He reject 1 john 5:7 isnt that enough to say he belives bible is corrupted? 1 interpolation is enough for me Kai.


Havent I explained this to you before? 1 john 5:7 was not in ANY original mss it was obviously a confusion of a footnote from Athanasius being mistaken as part of the verse.




Kai christian lies isnt a fact. THe verse doesnt say anything that you portrayed and even snake handeling pastor take it as a test.

[url]http://news.yahoo.com/serpent-handling-west-virginia-pastor-dies-snake-bite-173406645--abc-news-topstories.html
[/url]


Those nuts are not mainstream Christians mono, not even marginal read the verses it says everything I portrayed. you don't put god to the test that is Christianity 101


All those Isnads are from Iraq and most of them are from a 71year old guy who was reported to have a very very bad memory


No they are not mono- moiz amjad obviously knows nothing of hadith- there are numerous chains directly from Aisha through mecca and medina and Palestine even.

thinging is very very surprising kai and thats why Sam is a filty liar. Just like the bible translators.

No it came from shia accusations of sunnis.


Im confused you yourself said Yesu of the bible is that Wizard that lived 100years before Jesus if im not misrepresenting you(long time ago). So isnt William craig lying by your own criteria for Yesu?


HMMM NO

Where did Muhammad(saw) say the Kitab is from God?


3:93-94

from sarwars translation
and Believers, have faith in God and His Messenger, the Book which is revealed to him, and THE BIBLE which has been revealed before. Whoever refuses to believe in God, His angels, Books, Messengers and the Day of Judgment, has gone far away from the right path. S. 4:136

The bible is al kitab so mono I guess that sadistic monster god is going to burn you forever and ever for refusing to believe in ALL his books.

No kai. No. Nasara are not muslims. Just like Bani Israel are not Jews.


In the Arabic sense they were mono yes. the sons of Israel included yehuud mono.


Its a good theory kai. But Jesus himself isnt a historical figure and if i wasnt a muslim i would probly not belive he didnt exist so there are lacks Kai.


so you are saying you will not believe in jesus shortly???

Re: A challenge to Ghaith on did muslims or qurysh draw firs

PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:54 pm
by kaimana1
[
It mostly represents the month of ramadan. But im against symbolism my self.


Hmmm idol is an idol.

[
Where did you get that i accept the swoon theory from?


Okay so you believe god put someone in jesus place to suffer?


Why not in the 30other gospels?


Because the councils knew they were not written by the claimed author.

Ok kai. No doubt now that you are an Arabic speaker?


You are not going with the quran was sent to the arabs only mantra?? :lotpot:
Yup. Ibn Hazm didnt think so to.


He believed that the earlier books became corrupted after Muhammad of course without any evidence.


The original one didnt along many other books like 2 and 3 john i belive.


all of those books were included in the peshitta by 200 years before mo


What are you on about Children of Israel where not Jew and the term Christian wasnt coined for the first followers.

Christian simply means follower of Christ which in turn means messiah hence AL masihi

Constantine was never even a christian. And Peter was a deciple not an Imam. More over by that logic Peter would have been a Yahoodi.

Yes jesus disciples were yahoodi and not muslims.

Constantine claimed to be a Christian.


The romans where the once who mostly followed the Tunisian Tertullians new doctrine called Trinity when Athanasius and Constatine made it Orthodox. Can you prove to me that the Pharisees belived in the trinity ?

whats with this smokescreen mono? didn't you know that Constantine became an arian Christian after council of nicea? I never believed the Pharisees believed in trinity. they didn't even believe jesus was the messiah.

Why dont you go to a hindu or a sikh forum instead?


HMMM???


Wasnt Cyrus a messiah?

Yes but not THE messiah as your quran agrees with was jesus.


More over that verse is talking to Muhammad (saw9 about the people that lived BACK then.


Did you read those tafsirs thoroughly my dear mono?

Tafsir al-Jalalayn
You, O Muhammad (s), will truly find the most hostile of people to those who believe to be the Jews and the idolaters, of Mecca, because of the intensity of their disbelief, ignorance and utter preoccupation with following whims; and you will truly find the nearest of them in love to those who believe to be those who say ‘Verily, we are Christians’; that, nearness of theirs in love to the believers is, because some of them are priests, scholars, and monks, devout worshippers, and because they are not disdainful, of following the truth, as the Jews and the Meccans are.

Tanwîr al-Miqbâs min Tafsîr Ibn ‘Abbâs
Allah then showed their enmity towards the Prophet (pbuh) and his Companions, saying: (Thou wilt find) O Muhammad (the most vehement of mankind in hostility) and most vile in speech (to those who believe) Muhammad and his Companions ((to be) the Jews) the Jews of the Banu Qurayzah, Banu'l-Nadir, Fadak and Khaybar (and the idolaters) and the most vehement in hostility to the believers among the idolaters are the idolaters of Mecca. (And thou wilt find the nearest of them in affection) in their bond and most lenient in speech (to those who believe) Muhammad and his Companions ((to be) those who say: Lo! We are Christians) the Negus and his followers who were 32 men; it is also said that they were 40 people in total: 32 from Abyssinia, and eight monks from Historic Syria: the monk Bahirah and his followers Abrahah, Ashraf, Idris, Tamim, Tammam, Durayd and Ayman. (That) affection (is because there are among them priests) ascetics whose heads are shaved in the middle (and monks) secluded in monasteries who are their men of knowledge, (and because they are not proud) in believing in Muhammad and the Qur'an.

We really need to start getting into context my dear kai.


Ah yes the context . Its talking about Christians who become muslims im glad you saved me from digging up those tafsir.

These Yemeni Jews?


I hope the muslim claiming to be joseph the Yemeni jew isn't acting in this one LMAO

Is the Quran talking about Bani Israel or Bani Askenasi in that verse Kai?


Mono obviously we are going in circles on this I am in no mood to explain that to you again.


Can you prove this Kai? NT is an unhistorical book of fiction. It also says Jews belived Messiah is the son of God


It says some jews.


Did Jesus predict that Arabs would build tall buildings ?


why would he?

would yes. I also become atheist if they find the missing link which we hahahah Not some hoax like Lucy to but acctual evidence.

Rather you should say when you are READY to accept the evidence.



Yeah than im devout to

K


That stuff is avrage not devout kai. Maybe in the 80s yes but Islam has gotten stronger since then No more topless parties in Iraq and Beirut isnt the "Paris of the Middle East" anymore.


Average?? Yeah I agree Hezbollah has turned southern Beirut into an oppressive hell hole.




Thats a lie Kai. Imam Awlaki was exposing them and he did nothing more than what you call freespeach


BS mono a couple of years ago I was on one of his websites it was jihad deluxe. why do you think he moved to yemen?


Book of revelation is a book paganism Kai. If you take a look at my signature you see what i mean. 616 would make perfect sence refering to Nero.


Wrong ive already showed you why?


Ok kai you one legged eskimo.


WOW :lotpot:


Nothing is impossible for God. Even Trees can vote according to the Bible.


Please post the verse


Dont you know what they found in Qumran cave 4 kai?


Enlighten me?

Sana manuscripts refutes you there my dear kai.

No they don't

The same Ibn Ishaq that was kicked out of Medina for making up hadiths?


That story is disputed but yeah the very same ibn ishaq that is also a major basis of the sealed nectar.




You you think Scam Shamoun could get an 5k audience?

IDK but what I do know is that naik is a fraud he will debate little know Christian pastors in india where 300 people don't even know. but he wont debate sam shamoun who is far more well known.

That is BS


Yes Kai i have and i hope you are there to sometimes. CP left before he got the mic.


I quit going there two years ago I was getting booted off too much .


Cp never answer Nadir question


What question?

Re: A challenge to Ghaith on did muslims or qurysh draw firs

PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 8:06 pm
by kaimana1
Police cooperation. Police is asking for trouble, trying to evangelize people in a arab festival one cant exactly expect a warm welcome.

You think i would get a warm welcome from this christians Kai if i tried to preach Quran and revert them to Islam?


You can try to convert anyone to anything here mono.
As for the videos you posted of that Filipino catholic sect that nails themselves to crosses as nutty as it is they do that on their own accord. there is no evidence of them hurting anyone outside of their sect. and they get proselytized all the time by other Christians. so why would they not accept it by muslims. its nothing like the treatment ahmadiyas get in Indonesia by sunnis.


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