Invite one or more persons you want to have exclusive debate with by name. Only those whom you invite will be allowed to post here. Others will be removed if you ask the moderators.
Where the polytheist was the one that attacked the muslims first with their fowl mouth while the muslims made the first hit. Kai still looks at did as if the muslims made the first strike
Hmm what is title of OP Ghaith?? DId the quraysh draw first blood??? THE ANSWER IS NO thank you very much.
You also ignore the fact that it was mo who first denigrated the meccans gods and worship.
Im in the U.S yos- so i dont know how life is in the U.K or canada
I swear i wanted to write US, i figured as much because of the 6 hour difference.
So you are from the U.S, can you locate America on the World map? Nah im only joking
I dont want you to think that i hate Americans Kai, i just dont like the goverment that all.I have been to the US many times and have family in Boston and i am a huge fan of the American People and of Wall Mart : D
or perhaps i like the pakistan and malaysian flags
Or Tunis
Its like Israel and the hexagram Kai. Its not the star of David nor Seal of Solomon or any of that Jewish propaganda. and many others use it.
Can you prove they werent written by a matt. mark luke and john?
Well Kai. Lets look at Matthew for now. He never record his name within the text itself which was a common practice. Is this Matthew really the Tax collecter and a deciple of Jesus? That Matthew we read about in Matthew 9:9 where it is written. As Jesus passed on from there, He saw a man named Matthew sitting at the tax office. And He said to him, “Follow Me.” So he arose and followed Him.
He said to him, why didnt Matthew says, He said to ME. This can raise some eye browns Kai.
Well, they believe that the man jesus died and was ressurected while the father never died.
As i said Kai they are stupid people.
Even the Christians dont know what the trinty really is. Here Jay Smith which you seem to be a fan of.
I used common sense Ghaith about the stories of muslims going to ethiopia etc....etc...
Yup i also used common sense(physics) on 9 11. Still you called it bogus.
I was just making sure yos-
Ok Kai, im no psycho Kai
I considered it because of the hostility you have used when you have commented on ahmadiyans
So because i say they are clown i want them eliminated : - P ???
No Kai, they are misguided people like Trinitarians Hindus Sufis Rafidas JW Mormons and so on unlike Sunnis and Jews. Sunnis are rightly guided people they just go to far with books.
Are you sure of what you are asking dear Ghaith? al tabari and ibn kathir, qurtubi, all referred to paul as a follower of jesus sort of like a tabi'un if you will.
Ohh? Can you show me Ibn Kathir in context about his tafsir on the murasalin?
That is nonsense - The most merciful of the merciful will prepare a place of eternal torment for his creatures whom he knows many will never follow him to burn forever and ever?
What makes you think all who will taste hell fire will be there eternal?
LOL sure we can as long as we can involve them on 2:121 10:94, 2:136, 3:3 etc...etc...
I get to this later today.
So what?
Well Kai, since your a fan of answering-islam. I showed you how someone answering-islam looks up to and calls an Arabic Scholar cant read 2 lines. And still you keep attacking Osama. I challenge you to find me 1 LIE that Osama lied on purpose about in his website. I only want to be fair. And if Osama is "misleading" me like you claim when i sometimes copy contents from his website ^^
Because the shamu whale himself admits he has problem.
"I need to apologize to all of you, but more so to Nadir, for my very bad and un-Christ like behavior. I have come to the realization that my comments were very offensive and contrary to the Bible's teaching om how I am suppose to deal with others who do not share my religious beliefs and convictions.
It was wrong of me to insult and ridicule Nadir, his prophet and his religion. I need to debate and evangelize with a more respectful attitude towards those I disagree with. I know there is room for righteous anger, but my anger has been anything but rightoeus.
So I ask Nadir for forgiveness, and ask the Lord Jesus to forgive me. I will do my best to remain civil when addressing and dealing with Nadir's arguments.
To all my brothers and sisters in the Lord Jesus Christ please forgive me and pray that I can be more like Jesus when I deal with those who hold to different relgious convictions. And also pray for Nadir that God will do a work in his life by drawing him to the truth of his word. I know he feels that he has the truth and that we are the ones in need of gudiance. This where God needs to reveal himself to the individual. Arguments don't convert people, God's Spirit does it.
Again, I apologize to Nadir and wish him the best. "
So if i keep attacking him when you defend him i have a reason to.
Anyways moving on
Well shabir acted like a whiny teenager when he was talking about eze. 23 His performance in that debate with sam was terrible
Whiny? Did you read what the topic of the Debate was?
You did tell me a while back that you believed jeremiah was a prophet
I might have, i do like Jeremiah. 1 Prophet i have problems with in the bible is Job(Ayoub) and i will show you why later. As for Jere and isaiah the naked prophet i dont have much problems with.
Yasu'á is the proper arabic term for jesus
No it isnt my dear Kai, if it is than the same role should be played in English.
Isa makes no sense
WHAT!?!? Its older than JESUS. Isa is Arabic Yasua is not. Just like Jesus is english
Theres many more but you havent either paid attention to the minarets of the mosques in morroco
Might be, i dont really care as it has nothing to do with Islam as a religion unlike the Pagan cross in Christianity.
LOL whats wrong with the 12 apostles? bread and wine on last supper makes sense.
Well 12 apostles + Jesus= 13 we might have something there.
Anyways its really nothing wrong with it accept it was barrowed from Pagan cults. Just like the nr 666
Having sex with an animal is not sound Ghaith
For you and me it isnt, but what about some sick Christian individual?
we know sodomy and adultery fornication is forbidden.
Female animals exist to Kai.
Im still waiting for that aya from quran forbidding animal sex.
Very well Kai. Since you want the QURAN because hadiths are not good enough and neither is the Sunnah.
"O ye who believe! Obey God, and obey the Apostle, and those charged with authority among you. If ye differ in anything among yourselves, refer it to God and His Apostle, if ye do believe in God and the Last Day: That is best, and most suitable for final determination. 4:59
So why do you have a problem with the Hadiths Kai? Is there a problem with the Chain?
Going furher
This verse is more legit than 1 timothy 1:10 and cannot be abused like 1 timothy 1:10
7:33
Yusuf Ali Say: the things that my Lord hath indeed forbidden are: shameful deeds, whether open or secret; sins and trespasses against truth or reason; assigning of partners to Allah, for which He hath given no authority; and saying things about Allah of which ye have no knowledge.
Isnt sex with Animals shameful Kai?
Also homosexuality gets ripped apart. 7:81 "For ye practise your lusts on men in preference to women : ye are indeed a people transgressing beyond bounds."
30:21 Shakir And one of His signs is that He created mates for you from yourselves that you may find rest in them, and He put between you love and compassion; most surely there are signs in this for a people who reflect.
Now bring me forth 1 verse from the Bible that says Gay sex isnt allowed.
Okay but then we read in the very next hadee
That why i posted that link to all those hadith Kai.
You mean senate bill S. 1867 which repealed the article 125 prohibiting sodomy and beastiality?! well many of the senators didnt read the bill and didnt realize that- Of course article 134 can still be used against those involved in beastiality
You must ask your self kai what was it doing there in the first place.
No eze 23 likens the flesh of the false idols of assyria and egypt as those of horses and donkeys-the torah is very specific about the punishment of beastiality
I was talking about Muslims Kai. Nailing Saudi Girls will only cause you 100 lashes. While Animals will cause you your head.
But in any case You will find no prohibition of animal sex in the quran
Yup i showed you its Haram.
Thanks for providing link to prove my point.
No problem Kai.
You said you only take bukhari and muslim seriously- now suddenly you have a change of heart? i wonder why my dear Ghaith
I also said i am open minded to an extend that i even are open minded to Kitab al Kafi.
You said you only take bukhari and muslim seriously- now suddenly you have a change of heart? i wonder why my dear Ghaith
No Kai it said naked, he even removed his shoes kai.
Its all over the place Ghaith its god commanding israel through moses.
Give me 1 passages that says any of the laws are not to be used on non Israelies.
The quran is too vague and unambiguous to compare it too bible so we have to go with hadees many times
The Quran is far far far superior than the Bible Kai.
No ants dont talk like humans this has been blown up by the likes of your osama and harun yahyah LOL
Ants do talk Kai, even the buterfly has stolen their language for its own use.
You didnt pay attention to rabbits chewing on their own feces-did you?
Ok Kai the verse says
and the hare, because he cheweth the cud but divideth not the hoof, he is unclean unto you;
WHERE DOES IT SAY THAT IT EATS IT OWN FECES KAI? The verse is very clear saying that hare/rabbit (only 1 world exists for both in hebrews) are rumiants.
Not really changed just alot of commentarys have been added to it.
No Kai it has been changed alongisde the Midrash and ive showen you that Jews barrowed stories from the Quran in other Books.
Show me those passages Ghaith I guarantee you Ghaith that It that there is no consensus whether Jesus is mentioned at all in the Talmud. Most of the supposed "blasphemies" of Jesus and Mary in the Talmud do not refer to them at all. However, there can be no denying, and no rabbi would deny this, that the authors of the Talmud did not believe in Jesus' messiahship or his divinity- soof course f you are looking for Christian fellowship then Jewish literature is not the place to look. However, there is no basis at all to state unequivocably that the Talmud calls Jesus a bastard or that Mary was a prostitute who had sex with many men.
Ok Kai before i do that can you tell me who is the other guy its debated on? Is there another guy who had the same/similair. name is Jesus and did magic?
That is subjective and a matter of opinion
Out of all the clowns who do you find to be the best debater?
Anyways Kai i am sick and tired and just got home and dont feel like adressing the issuei promised you above. I will response to it in the next rebutal if i am feeling better.
So you are from the U.S, can you locate America on the World map? Nah im only joking
Theres people in college like that here in the U.S Ghaith many of them dont see how its relevant in their day to day lives, but they dont realize how it makes them look so stupid- but i can guarantee you im not like that
I dont want you to think that i hate Americans Kai, i just dont like the goverment that all.
Of course you dont yos- You hate ALL KAFR- J/K If i believed half of the freemasonry illuminati crap that you did- i wouldnt even go out of my house.
I have been to the US many times and have family in Boston and i am a huge fan of the American People and of Wall Mart
Likewise- i am a hugh fan of arab people- i just dont like islam- You like wallmart huh? they practically have those in every town with at least 10,000 people in the U.S . don't they have wall-mart's in spain and norway?
Or Tunis
Its like Israel and the hexagram Kai. Its not the star of David nor Seal of Solomon or any of that Jewish propaganda. and many others use it.
Ghaith Let's say you are right for the sake of argument- How does that justify the paganism in islam????
If the jews do it then it's ok for muslims to do it?
Let's get serious Ghaith!
Well Kai. Lets look at Matthew for now. He never record his name within the text itself which was a common practice. Is this Matthew really the Tax collecter and a deciple of Jesus? That Matthew we read about in Matthew 9:9 where it is written. As Jesus passed on from there, He saw a man named Matthew sitting at the tax office. And He said to him, “Follow Me.” So he arose and followed Him.
He said to him, why didnt Matthew says, He said to ME. This can raise some eye browns Kai.
Matthew was using the third person vocative for himself-
As i said Kai they are stupid people.
you only say this for the purpose of polemics- if the quran said jesus was not born of a virgin- you would say christians are stupid for believing it- see how that works Ghaith.
Even the Christians dont know what the trinty really is. Here Jay Smith which you seem to be a fan of.
did i say i was a FAN of jay smith?
Yup i also used common sense(physics) on 9 11. Still you called it bogus.
That was wishful thinking on your part yos- It is bogus
Ok Kai, im no psycho Kai
Good to see
So because i say they are clown i want them eliminated ???
No, that is not why- because you said they are NOT muslims with intensity
No Kai, they are misguided people like Trinitarians Hindus Sufis Rafidas JW Mormons and so on unlike Sunnis and Jews. Sunnis are rightly guided people they just go to far with books.
??? You really are misguided.
Ohh? Can you show me Ibn Kathir in context about his tafsir on the murasalin?
Ha haaa you think im not aware of umars (A/C writer) mismash of throwing numerous muslim scholars under the bus. Umar says this
Regarding the first source cited by Sam, the source says Sura 7 Ayat includes disciples of Isa (A). However, when one reads the Ayat in CONTEXT, we find that it says there are multiple interpretations to that verse, however it is highly likely that the source is reporting what Ibn Ishaq says on the authority of Ibn Abbas, that is Ibn Ishaq allegedly quoting from Ibn Abbas.
REALLY Ghaith? HIGHLY LIKELY in umars dreams -The chain is there?
Ghaith what your mentors at A/C dont seem to realize is by dumping on ibn ishaq and ibn sa'd then they are dumping most persecution of muslim stories down the tube. its a stand based on convenience
Like i told you yos- islamic apologetics is the most dishonest profession in the world.
I am certain one day you will realize this.
What makes you think all who will taste hell fire will be there eternal?
Even someone like hitler after being roasted in the fire with his skin being healed up again so he can burn again. Doesnt seem sadistic to you Ghaith?? or even if you go in hellfire for 1 day that doesnt seem sadistic to you Ghaith.
I get to this later today.
Yeah
Well Kai, since your a fan of answering-islam. I showed you how someone answering-islam looks up to and calls an Arabic Scholar cant read 2 lines.
???? who can't read 2 lines- sam?
And still you keep attacking Osama. I challenge you to find me 1 LIE that Osama lied on purpose about in his website. I only want to be fair. And if Osama is "misleading" me like you claim when i sometimes copy contents from his website
i ALReady have Ghaith osama said that daha in lisan al arab means eggshaped- It does not - if SO SHOW ME ! Osama can not say he made a mistake his article on that has been up for years. this makes him A LIAR
Because the shamu whale himself admits he has problem.
Problem or not yos- it doesnt negate his research the least bit.
"I need to apologize to all of you, but more so to Nadir, for my very bad and un-Christ like behavior. I have come to the realization that my comments were very offensive and contrary to the Bible's teaching om how I am suppose to deal with others who do not share my religious beliefs and convictions.
It was wrong of me to insult and ridicule Nadir, his prophet and his religion. I need to debate and evangelize with a more respectful attitude towards those I disagree with. I know there is room for righteous anger, but my anger has been anything but rightoeus.
So I ask Nadir for forgiveness, and ask the Lord Jesus to forgive me. I will do my best to remain civil when addressing and dealing with Nadir's arguments.
To all my brothers and sisters in the Lord Jesus Christ please forgive me and pray that I can be more like Jesus when I deal with those who hold to different relgious convictions. And also pray for Nadir that God will do a work in his life by drawing him to the truth of his word. I know he feels that he has the truth and that we are the ones in need of gudiance. This where God needs to reveal himself to the individual. Arguments don't convert people, God's Spirit does it.
Again, I apologize to Nadir and wish him the best. "
I am looking into this to make sure it's legit- but if it is it just shows that sam is the bigger man then nadir and osama for that matter
Really? so nadir whom i am sure you know is osamas worst enemy becomes a notion of inspiration for you- that sounds cheesy Ghaith.
Whiny? Did you read what the topic of the Debate was?
It doesnt matter- he sounded like a big kid up there when refering to eze 23
I might have, i do like Jeremiah. 1 Prophet i have problems with in the bible is Job(Ayoub) and i will show you why later. As for Jere and isaiah the naked prophet i dont have much problems with.
Job another OT character brought into the quran!
No it isnt my dear Kai, if it is than the same role should be played in English.
Ghaith jesus is the english transliteration of of the greek iesous = yeshua The arabic isa is in reverse Ghaith it starts with an 'ayn in aramaic and hebrew is ENDS with an ayn
So don't give me that nonsense Ghaith
WHAT!?!? Its older than JESUS. Isa is Arabic Yasua is not. Just like Jesus is english
Wrong yasua is clearly the proper arabic transliteration of yeshua- jesus is the english transliteration
Might be, i dont really care as it has nothing to do with Islam as a religion unlike the Pagan cross in Christianity.
LOL it's only seen as a symbol of islam and on the majority of minarets in the world- you cant spin your way out on this.
Well 12 apostles + Jesus= 13 we might have something there.
No Ghaith you have fried your mind on conspiracy street
Anyways its really nothing wrong with it accept it was barrowed from Pagan cults. Just like the nr 666
For you and me it isnt, but what about some sick Christian individual?
Thats my point Ghaith - a sicko is going to be a sicko no matter what but in many muslim societies where the women wear tents and are taken by sheikhs and other upper class echelion with 4 sometimes more wives this leaves many muslim men with unnatural desires.
Female animals exist to Kai.
And its still an animal Ghaith
Very well Kai. Since you want the QURAN because hadiths are not good enough and neither is the Sunnah.
"O ye who believe! Obey God, and obey the Apostle, and those charged with authority among you. If ye differ in anything among yourselves, refer it to God and His Apostle, if ye do believe in God and the Last Day: That is best, and most suitable for final determination. 4:59
Obey muhammad ??? so where did he say that animal sex is forbidden? NOWHERE Ghaith and the fact that bukhar and muslim never mentioned it should raise eybrows.
So why do you have a problem with the Hadiths Kai? Is there a problem with the Chain?
First of all it is you that indicated you have problem with those hadees i showed you conflicting reports in abu dawud where both come from muhammad supposedly Going furher
This verse is more legit than 1 timothy 1:10 and cannot be abused like 1 timothy 1:10
WTF LMAO what are you on about now/
7:33
Yusuf Ali Say: the things that my Lord hath indeed forbidden are: shameful deeds, whether open or secret; sins and trespasses against truth or reason; assigning of partners to Allah, for which He hath given no authority; and saying things about Allah of which ye have no knowledge.
That isnt talking about animal sex Ghaith
Also homosexuality gets ripped apart 7:81 "For ye practise your lusts on men in preference to women : ye are indeed a people transgressing beyond bounds."
30:21 Shakir And one of His signs is that He created mates for you from yourselves that you may find rest in them, and He put between you love and compassion; most surely there are signs in this for a people who reflect.
Really Ghaith does it? lets see what faris malik has to say about those verses
The Qur'an generally scorns "approaching males in lust", as well as the castration of males, as the sin of the people of Lot (Qur'an 7:81, 26:165-166, 27:55, 29:28-29).
7:81 "Indeed you approach males in lust excluding women..." Arabic: اِنَّكُمْ لَتَاْتُوْنَ الرِّجَالَ شَهْوَةً مِّنْ دُوْنِ النِّسَآءِ
26:165-166 "What! Do you approach the males of the worlds and forsake those whom your Lord has created for you for your mates?" Arabic: آ تَاْتُوْنَ الذُّكْرانَ مِنَ الْعلَميْنَ \ وَتَذَرُوْنَ مَا خَلَقَ لَكُمْ رَبُّكُمْ مِّنَ اَزْوَاجِكُمْ
27:55 "Will you indeed approach males in lust excluding women?" Arabic: آ ئِنَّكُمْ لَتَاْتُوْنَ الرِّجَالَ شَهْوَةً مِّنْ دُوْنِ النِّسَآءِ
29:28-29 "Most surely you are guilty of an indecency which none of the nations has ever done before you; What! do you come unto the males and cut the passageways [i.e. vas deferens and/or urethra] and do so in your private clubs?" Arabic: اِنَّكُمْ لَتَاْتُوْنَ الْفَاحِشَةَ مَا سَبَقَكُمْ بِهَا مِنْ اَحَدٍ مِّنْ الْعلَمِيْنَ \ آ ئِنَّكُمْ لَتَاْتُوْنَ الرِّجَالَ وَتَقْطَعُوْنَ السَّبِيْلَ وَتَاْتُوْنَ فِي نَادِيْكُمْ
But the Qur'an does not prohibit using, as passive sex partners, the ancient category of men who by nature lacked desire for women, since such men were not considered "male" as a result of their lack of arousal for women. This kind of man is often known as "gay" in modern times, but in the ancient world he was identified as an anatomically whole "natural eunuch." Although the Qur'an never uses the word eunuch [خَصِي], the hadith and the books of the legal scholars do. Furthermore, the Qur'an recognizes that some men are "without the defining skill of males" (24:31: غَيْرِ اُولىِ الاِرْبَةِ مِنَ الرِّجَالِ) and so, as domestic servants, are allowed to see women naked. This is a reference to natural eunuchs, i.e. innately and exclusively gay (if not totally asexual) men.
A person had to be indifferent to women's bodies in order to assume the role as a servant in women's private space. In the following case from the hadith, a household servant who had been falsely assumed to be indifferent to women due to his being an "effeminate man" [mukhannathمُخَنَّث ] was evicted by the Prophet because he unexpectedly exhibited a lascivious attitude toward women:
Bukhari, Authentic Traditions, Book LXII (Marriage), Chapter 114: What is forbidden concerning the entering upon the wife by those imitating women. (162) Umm Salama reported that the Prophet, peace be upon him, was at her house, and in the house there was an effeminate man [مُخَنَّث], and the effeminate man said to the brother of Umm Salama, Abdullah bin Abi Umayya: "If God makes you all conquer Ta'if tomorrow, I will point out to you the daughter of Ghailan, for surely she has four when coming towards you and eight when she turns her back." Then the Prophet, peace be upon him, said: "This one shall not call upon you (pl.)."
Muslim, Collection of Authentic Traditions, Book XXVI (Greetings), Chapter 12: (5415) Umm Salama reported that she had an effeminate man [مُخَنَّث] in her house. The Messenger of God, peace be upon him, was once at the house when he (the effeminate man) said to the brother of Umm Salama, 'Abdullah b. Abu Umayya: "If God makes you all conquer Ta'if tomorrow, I will point out to you the daughter of Ghailan, for surely she has four when coming towards you and eight when she turns her back." The Messenger of God, peace be upon him, heard this and he said: "These ones shall not call upon you."
(5416) 'A'isha reported that an effeminate man [مُخَنَّث] used to call upon the wives of the Prophet, peace be upon him, and they considered him to be "without the defining skill" (of males) [فكانوا يعدونه من غيْر أولى الارة]. The Prophet, peace be upon him, came by one day as he (the effeminate man) was sitting with some of his wives and he was describing a woman, saying: "When she comes towards you, she has four, and when she turns her back, she has eight." Then the Prophet, peace be upon him, said: "I see this one knows these things! He shall not call upon you (pl.)." She ('A'isha) said then they began to observe veil from him
Now bring me forth 1 verse from the Bible that says Gay sex isnt allowed.
I already gave them to you but you refuse to listen- in any case if you play the game of well its not homosexuality then it can be equally shown that the quran is also not prohibiting gay sex
That why i posted that link to all those hadith Kai.
Yeah and they didnt post confliting hadees Ghaith
You must ask your self kai what was it doing there in the first place.
In any sizable institution you will find a few psyhcos
I was talking about Muslims Kai. Nailing Saudi Girls will only cause you 100 lashes. While Animals will cause you your head.
Are you sure about that Ghaith?
Yup i showed you its Haram.
No you didnt at ALL
[
No problem Kai.
LOL
I also said i am open minded to an extend that i even are open minded to Kitab al Kafi.
That is different then only bukhari and muslim!
No Kai it said naked, he even removed his shoes kai.
It didnt say he was fully naked
Give me 1 passages that says any of the laws are not to be used on non Israelies.
Only if they are living amongst the israelites Ghaith per exodus 12:45-48 but the entire penteteuch is referring to israel Ghaith. there arte many passages were GOD tells moses and israel to bypass the moabites amalekites because they are brethren- despite the fact they worshipped idols etc..
The Quran is far far far superior than the Bible Kai.
Its too vague to be superior to any book .
Ants do talk Kai, even the buterfly has stolen their language for its own use.
ERMMM
Ok Kai the verse says
and the hare, because he cheweth the cud but divideth not the hoof, he is unclean unto you;
WHERE DOES IT SAY THAT IT EATS IT OWN FECES KAI? The verse is very clear saying that hare/rabbit (only 1 world exists for both in hebrews) are rumiants
.
The fact that the rabbit eats its own soft pellets would alert a hunter to think its chewing its cud so therefore is not kosher to eat.
No Kai it has been changed alongisde the Midrash and ive showen you that Jews barrowed stories from the Quran in other Books.
Some jewish folklore in 12th century could have been but much of the concepts like 7 heavens 5:32 etc...etc... clearly came from the talmud. Ghaith no matter how you spin it that is the way it is Ghaith.
Ok Kai before i do that can you tell me who is the other guy its debated on? Is there another guy who had the same/similair. name is Jesus and did magic?
Yes there is.
Out of all the clowns who do you find to be the best debater?
Shabir i would say is the least clowniest of them all.
Anyways Kai i am sick and tired and just got home and dont feel like adressing the issuei promised you above. I will response to it in the next rebutal if i am feeling better
Stay away from the falafels and eat plenty of chicken soup. take care.
Theres people in college like that here in the U.S Ghaith many of them dont see how its relevant in their day to day lives, but they dont realize how it makes them look so stupid- but i can guarantee you im not like that
Ok kai.
If i believed half of the freemasonry illuminati crap that you did- i wouldnt even go out of my house.
Ok Kai.
Likewise- i am a hugh fan of arab people- i just dont like islam- You like wallmart huh? they practically have those in every town with at least 10,000 people in the U.S . don't they have wall-mart's in spain and norway?
Sadly no Kai. The wallmart of europe is called Carrefour.
If the jews do it then it's ok for muslims to do it?
Well yeah kai, it has nothing to do with the religion.
Matthew was using the third person vocative for himself-
Or Matthew didnt write that gospel
you only say this for the purpose of polemics- if the quran said jesus was not born of a virgin- you would say christians are stupid for believing it- see how that works Ghaith.
No Kai. Point out something about Jesus that Muslims disagree with that Jews agree with
did i say i was a FAN of jay smith?
No but you said he grilled Shabir.
??? You really are misguided.
Oh?
Like i told you yos- islamic apologetics is the most dishonest profession in the world.
No kai its not
I am still waiting for you to quote Ibn Kathir Kai.
I dont really care what Ibn Ishaq says.
Even someone like hitler after being roasted in the fire with his skin being healed up again so he can burn again. Doesnt seem sadistic to you Ghaith?? or even if you go in hellfire for 1 day that doesnt seem sadistic to you Ghaith.
Hitler wasnt all that bad Kai as the media make him seem to be. Roosevelt and Churchill where justas bad.
i ALReady have Ghaith osama said that daha in lisan al arab means eggshaped- It does not - if SO SHOW ME ! Osama can not say he made a mistake his article on that has been up for years. this makes him A LIAR
Well you have to show otherwise kai
Really? so nadir whom i am sure you know is osamas worst enemy becomes a notion of inspiration for you- that sounds cheesy Ghaith.
Ofcourse i do Kai, but they are not worst enemy. Id say CP or Silas or Shamoun are way higher on that list. That why i earilier said i have problems with him, what i enjoy about Nadir is his insults
I am looking into this to make sure it's legit- but if it is it just shows that sam is the bigger man then nadir and osama for that matter
Bigger man? Osama has never disrespected Sam.
So don't give me that nonsense Ghaith
Its arabic kai, and ive already stated its older than JESUS.
Wrong yasua is clearly the proper arabic transliteration of yeshua- jesus is the english transliteration
No that retarded Christian claims Kai.
LOL it's only seen as a symbol of islam and on the majority of minarets in the world- you cant spin your way out on this.
Obey muhammad ??? so where did he say that animal sex is forbidden? NOWHERE Ghaith and the fact that bukhar and muslim never mentioned it should raise eybrows.
The hadith is mentioned several places making it likly Sahih.
That isnt talking about animal sex Ghaith
Ohh arent sex with animals shameful?
Really Ghaith does it? lets see what faris malik has to say about those verses
Why would i care what faris malik says Kai? Ive already debunked you on that matter The Quran is way more clear on forbiding sex with animals than the bible is.
In any sizable institution you will find a few psyhcos
Ok kai.
That is different then only bukhari and muslim!
Well kai i am open minded to alot of thing kind of like you where.
It didnt say he was fully naked
Did they use that term back then Kai?
Only if they are living amongst the israelites Ghaith per exodus 12:45-48 but the entire penteteuch is referring to israel Ghaith. there arte many passages were GOD tells moses and israel to bypass the moabites amalekites because they are brethren- despite the fact they worshipped idols etc..
That doesnt adress the fact that a Non-Israel should not be punished if breaking any of Gods law Kai.
The fact that the rabbit eats its own soft pellets would alert a hunter to think its chewing its cud so therefore is not kosher to eat.
Thats ok Kai. But the bible is inspired by the holy spirit where it litlary says that the Rabbit/Hare chews the cud not its own soft pellets but CHEWS THE CUD but divideth not the hoof.Who ever wrote this made the same mistake as the hunter you described did and is sign of corruption.
Some jewish folklore in 12th century could have been but much of the concepts like 7 heavens 5:32 etc...etc... clearly came from the talmud. Ghaith no matter how you spin it that is the way it is Ghaith.
Clearly? Todays talmud is nothing like the talmud back then. Also can you provide proof that the talmud was in Arabia at the time of Muhammad. Its no secret that both the talmuds have been reconstructed and thats was the Quran pre-dates them. This includes the Killing verse 7heavens Adams sons and so on.
Yes there is.
Ok give some evidence of this guy?
Shabir i would say is the least clowniest of them all.
Thats a good choice Kai.
Stay away from the falafels and eat plenty of chicken soup. take care.
Thank you Kai.
If you could be so nice and give all the ayas you used to show that Christians are followers of Christ include the one you where to "nice" to not use.
Sadly no Kai. The wallmart of europe is called Carrefour.
Really? those carrefour stores are not the same as walmart in U.S?
Well yeah kai, it has nothing to do with the religion.
Of course it has to do with the religion Ghaith the symbol is there on the majority of minarets.
Or Matthew didnt write that gospel
Well - the same can be said of the quran
No Kai. Point out something about Jesus that Muslims disagree with that Jews agree with
That notion is silly yos- You could say the same about bahias etc..
No but you said he grilled Shabir.
That is true
Oh?
Unfortunately yes.
No kai its not
Yes it is- it will sink inside of you one day- i am confident of that.
I am still waiting for you to quote Ibn Kathir Kai.
Sure thing i will quote the OUTDATED IBN KATHIR LMAO
Ibn Kathir's tafsir - Surah Yaseen 36:13: "When We sent to them two Messengers, they denied them both;) means, they hastened to disbelieve in them. (so We reinforced them with a third,) means, `We supported and strengthened them with a third Messenger. ' Ibn Jurayj narrated from Wahb bin Sulayman, from Shu`ayb Al-Jaba'i, "The names of the first two Messengers were Sham`un and Yuhanna, and the name of the third was Bulus, and the city was Antioch"
Now my dear Ghaith i know you will say that this wasnt ibn kathirs opinion- he was showing a narration from Shu`ayb Al-Jaba'i -actually that is true- but ibn kathir never rejected paul of being a follower of christ- ibn kathir rejected the city being antioch because he knew the city was never destroyed like the quran claims it was. So he realized that he couldnt agree with the city antioch being destroyed
See Ghaith that is how the muslim mind works- when dealing with covering muhammads blunders- its very clear from the surah yaseen that mo was trying to scare the quraysh into islam and he would say anything to counter this.
I dont really care what Ibn Ishaq says.
Of course you dont
Hitler wasnt all that bad Kai as the media make him seem to be. Roosevelt and Churchill where justas bad.
My dear Ghaith hitler was a narcisist of the first order- you only like hitler because of what he did to jews and gypsies etc...
In anycase my point was WHY WOULD THE MOST MERCIFUL OF THE MERCIFUL be willing or capable of roasting any of his creation over and over as punishment that is a sadistic god no matter how you look at it.
Well you have to show otherwise kai
الأُدْحِيُّ و الإدْحِيُّ و الأُدْحِيَّة و الإدْحِيَّة و الأُدْحُوّة مَبِيض النعام في الرمل , وزنه أُفْعُول من ذلك , لأَن النعامة تَدْحُوه برِجْلها ثم تَبِيض فيه وليس للنعام عُشٌّ . و مَدْحَى النعام : موضع بيضها , و أُدْحِيُّها موضعها الذي تُفَرِّخ فيه .ِ That is from lisan al arab yos- now considering that osama said it meant eggshaped in that very same dictionary then show me where.
Ofcourse i do Kai, but they are not worst enemy. Id say CP or Silas or Shamoun are way higher on that list. That why i earilier said i have problems with him, what i enjoy about Nadir is his insults
I found out that letter is a farce- nadir has no integrity he is even worse then osama.
Bigger man? Osama has never disrespected Sam.
Sure about that?
Its arabic kai, and ive already stated its older than JESUS.
Yasu would be proper arabic transliteration because the ayn is in right place Ghaith. That is because english wasnt developed yet- Ghaith
No that retarded Christian claims Kai.
How is it retarded?
Ok kai show me some hadiths about it
That is irrelevant Ghaith the fact that the moon and venus is on so many mosques and seen as a symbol of your religion is enough proof.
That not what our friend Paul said.
Show me
The hadith is mentioned several places making it likly Sahih.
Isnt it strange that bukhari and muslim or even the fuqaha malik ibn anas never mentioned them?
Ohh arent sex with animals shameful?
Thats a good question yos- did muhammad think so perhaps he forgot?
Why would i care what faris malik says Kai? Ive already debunked you on that matter
I refuted your so-called debunking Ghaith of course you dont care what faris has to say.
The Quran is way more clear on forbiding sex with animals than the bible is.
You havent showed any verse saying so Ghaith.
Leviticus 18:23, NIV. "Do not have sexual relations with an animal and defile yourself with it. A woman must not present herself to an animal to have sexual relations with it; that is a perversion."
Remember what paul said in 1 timothy 3:16 this is what he was talking about only you wont be stoned or killed you sill simply cease to exist when you die- doing things like animal sex.
Well kai i am open minded to alot of thing kind of like you where.
Elaborate please?
Did they use that term back then Kai?
Yes they did-
That doesnt adress the fact that a Non-Israel should not be punished if breaking any of Gods law Kai.
If they are living in israel at time yes
Thats ok Kai. But the bible is inspired by the holy spirit where it litlary says that the Rabbit/Hare chews the cud not its own soft pellets but CHEWS THE CUD but divideth not the hoof.Who ever wrote this made the same mistake as the hunter you described did and is sign of corruption.
Not exactly Ghaith The rabbit was unclean because it ate its fecal matter it was similar to chewing cud- that was the purpose Ghaith the hunter would see the rabbit chew on its feces and would know its unclean.
Clearly? Todays talmud is nothing like the talmud back then. Also can you provide proof that the talmud was in Arabia at the time of Muhammad. Its no secret that both the talmuds have been reconstructed and thats was the Quran pre-dates them. This includes the Killing verse 7heavens Adams sons and so on.
Prove that yos- there were plenty of jews in arabia at time of muhammad Ghaith so it only makes common sense that they would recite babylon talmud alongside torah
Ok give some evidence of this guy?
Thank you Kai.
You are welcome
If you could be so nice and give all the ayas you used to show that Christians are followers of Christ include the one you where to "nice" to not use
They are classified as ahlekitab Ghaith they are people of the injil- the quran calls them nasara -even though christian arabs call themselves masihi
Really? those carrefour stores are not the same as walmart in U.S?
Not the same owner, but the biggest shopping mart in Europe for goods is Carrefour.
Of course it has to do with the religion Ghaith the symbol is there on the majority of minarets.
No it doesnt kai, just like the hexagram has nothing to do with Judaism.
Well - the same can be said of the quran
What do you mean my dear Kai?
That notion is silly yos- You could say the same about bahias etc..
See how you couldnt answer me there Kai
That is true
Well after saying trinty is a mystery i think Jay just grilled him self along with his polytheistic religion.
OUTDATED IBN KATHIR LMAO
Ibn Kathir is outdated on cases like Quran Miracles and Christianity. Which muslims have more knowledge about today. Im sure me and you both agree that Ibn Kathir was not a biblical scholar.
bn Kathir's tafsir - Surah Yaseen 36:13: "When We sent to them two Messengers, they denied them both;) means, they hastened to disbelieve in them. (so We reinforced them with a third,) means, `We supported and strengthened them with a third Messenger. ' Ibn Jurayj narrated from Wahb bin Sulayman, from Shu`ayb Al-Jaba'i, "The names of the first two Messengers were Sham`un and Yuhanna, and the name of the third was Bulus, and the city was Antioch"
So Kai? Ibn Ishaq said they where Sadiq Saduq Shalum. This is not Ibn Kathirs view and that why i asked you to quote it in context.
bn kathir rejected the city being antioch because he knew the city was never destroyed like the quran claims it was.
Why do you lie Kai? The Quran no where claim the city is Antioch. Some Scholars has agreed that it might be. Dont lie about my scripture Kai
you only like hitler because of what he did to jews and gypsies etc...
No Kai, i like Hitler because of what he did to Muslims.
n anycase my point was WHY WOULD THE MOST MERCIFUL OF THE MERCIFUL be willing or capable of roasting any of his creation over and over as punishment that is a sadistic god no matter how you look at it.
Because they worshiped other Gods besides him and rejected him? Im not God kai i cant answer that neither can you or any one else.
That is from lisan al arab yos- now considering that osama said it meant eggshaped in that very same dictionary then show me where.
Hmm. I will look at this egg business later.
I found out that letter is a farce- nadir has no integrity he is even worse then osama.
Proof please. I only want to be fair Kai.
Sure about that?
Yes. Sam calls Osama a f*g. Osama takes prnt and posts it in his websites. Who is the bigger man?
Yasu would be proper arabic transliteration because the ayn is in right place Ghaith.
Yasu might not even be his nameit might be fabricated. After all the OT said it would be Immanuel. Christians like to use the excuse that its metaphorical and it means God is with us and Jesus was god en many ridicules excuses. That is why the Jews laugh at time and Rabbis have way higher status than Priests.
That is irrelevant Ghaith the fact that the moon and venus is on so many mosques and seen as a symbol of your religion is enough proof.
No kai. The hexagram is in many churches as well matter inf act in the Cathedral of Valencia.
Isnt it strange that bukhari and muslim or even the fuqaha malik ibn anas never mentioned them?
No it isnt Kai. its not like Bukhari collected every single hadith that existed. If the hadith only existed in ABU DAWOOD than it would have been strange but the fact its in several other books make it quiet Sahih.
Thats a good question yos- did muhammad think so perhaps he forgot?
He didnt kai He told them to kill who ever was caught doing so and kill the animal. Your Paul how ever forgot. Now i ask you again Kai, is it a shamful or not in your mind?
You havent showed any verse saying so Ghaith.
Leviticus 18:23, NIV. "Do not have sexual relations with an animal and defile yourself with it. A woman must not present herself to an animal to have sexual relations with it; that is a perversion."
Remember what paul said in 1 timothy 3:16 this is what he was talking about only you wont be stoned or killed you sill simply cease to exist when you die- doing things like animal sex.
Paul cancled the laws Kai remember Rom 6:14 Also i think you meant to say 2 Tim 3:16 : - P And that verse is not really effective on me because ive already stated before that Paul is either a liar or he was under the control of Satan. Because Paul already said that Jesus is Satan in Rev 22:16 and Satan is reffered to as God many times in the bible Kai. 1 Chro and 2 Sam might be a contradiction but maybe it is a contradistinction And Christians like to attack us because Tabari said Satan once tricked Muhammad which is a very weak source.
Elaborate please?
Well with Abu Dawods Animal sex hadith its mentioned in several other places, such hadiths i have no problem with.
If they are living in israel at time yes
Imigrants should also be punished than?
Not exactly Ghaith The rabbit was unclean because it ate its fecal matter it was similar to chewing cud
Still an error Kai.
Prove that yos- there were plenty of jews in arabia at time of muhammad Ghaith so it only makes common sense that they would recite babylon talmud alongside torah
first of Kai dont you think the jews would come out and say that their stories in the talmud are not Sahih and fairytales when muhammad revealed them? Ive also showen you that Jews stole from the Quran.
Exampel the midrash Genesis Rabbah
Genesis Rabbah is a Palestinian work,... its editing took place sometime after the redaction of the Jerusalem Talmud. Zunz holds that it was collected and edited in the 6th century CE. But even then the text was subject to accretions, and from Vayyishlach we find extensive passages bearing marks of the later day Haggadah. In Vayyigash the commentary is no longer verse by verse, while much of Vayechi was probably drawn from the Tanhuma homilies
Rabbi Dr. H. Freedman & M. Simon, Midrash Rabbah, 1961, Volume I (Genesis), The Soncino Press: London (UK), p. xxix.
Also i challenge you to find me The story of Abraham and the Idols older than Vat. 30 that predates Quran Kai. You wont be able to.
Seems like the jews keep stealing stories from us Kai. Ohh well they regard Muhammad as the greatest prophet to the gentiles.
They are classified as ahlekitab Ghaith they are people of the injil- the quran calls them nasara -even though christian arabs call themselves masihi
My parents call them Masihi even to i pointed out we muslims are the masihi. But as for the ahlekitab that doesn mean they are followers of Christ kai. Since Jews are also ahlekitab who reject Isa al Masih.
First of all Ghaith i wanted to show this passage from deuteronomy chapter 5;1 Moses summoned all Israel and said:
Hear, Israel, the decrees and laws I declare in your hearing today. Learn them and be sure to follow them. 2 The Lord our God made a covenant with us at Horeb. 3 It was not with our ancestors[a] that the Lord made this covenant, but with us, with all of us who are alive here today. 4 The Lord spoke to you face to face out of the fire on the mountain.
That passage clearly shows the law was for israel.
Not the same owner, but the biggest shopping mart in Europe for goods is Carrefour.
Ok
No it doesnt kai, just like the hexagram has nothing to do with Judaism.
See how you couldnt answer me there Kai
You were evading my original point yos- of course the jews dont believe jesus was the messiah- if a jew believes jesus is the messiah then he is a messianic jew (christian)
Muhammd adopted the injil as a book from god and the people of the injil nasara- of course with a twist
Well after saying trinty is a mystery i think Jay just grilled him self along with his polytheistic religion.
Ok Ghaith
Ibn Kathir is outdated on cases like Quran Miracles and Christianity. Which muslims have more knowledge about today.
You say that Ghaith because you dont agree with him- but muslims have no more knowledge regarding what ibn kathir believed in fact i would say they even have LESS.
Im sure me and you both agree that Ibn Kathir was not a biblical scholar.
I would also agree that muhammad and allah were no biblical scholars either.
So Kai? Ibn Ishaq said they where Sadiq Saduq Shalum. This is not Ibn Kathirs view and that why i asked you to quote it in context.
Ibn ishaq narrated several different stories about the surah Ghaith , that was another narration from ibn ishaq that ibn kathir used- he ended it with "allah knows best"
Why do you lie Kai? The Quran no where claim the city is Antioch
Before you accuse me of lying- Show me where i said the quran said its antioch??? Of course the clear quran doesnt say the name of city but the way the parable reads is very similar to an account in acts- .
Some Scholars has agreed that it might be. Dont lie about my scripture Kai
The narrations about it being antioch and the three apostles being simon peter john and paul fits what muhammad was talking about best. then again it brings more problems- something few muslims today would care to accept.
No Kai, i like Hitler because of what he did to Muslims.
OHHH I see!
Because they worshiped other Gods besides him and rejected him? Im not God kai i cant answer that neither can you or any one else.
So that is a reasonable reason in your mind Ghaith?? HONESTLY?? So ALLAH is going to fry people over and over again even though he knew from before they were born they would worship other gods besides him?
Hmm. I will look at this egg business later.
Yes i am surprised you havent already!!!
Proof please. I only want to be fair Kai.
Well, nadir is a compulsive liar- look at his site Ghaith? did you know even ali sina debated him on the old ffi forum? back in 2004 i believe.
he proved to be a liar then.
Yes. Sam calls Osama a f*g. Osama takes prnt and posts it in his websites. Who is the bigger man?
Ok Ghaith but osama never posts the parts showing why sam calls him that does he Ghaith? I disagree with sam calling him that- but there are two sides to the story.
Yasu might not even be his nameit might be fabricated.
No yos- yshua is his name in arabic it's yasua and it certainly does not excuse the fact that isa is BACKWARDS from Yeshua
After all the OT said it would be Immanuel. Christians like to use the excuse that its metaphorical and it means God is with us and Jesus was god en many ridicules excuses
So does matthew yos- of course all christians believe this jws and other unitarians say that immanuel (god with us) is saying that Jesus having the name Emmanuel is that, at that time, God had turned his attention to his chosen people the Israelites and was giving them the chance to turn around and come back to worshiping him. All so Jesus being the King of Gods Kingdom was now in their midst as Gods representative, his Word (spokes person) so yes the prophetic title of “God with us” fitted the roll that Jesus was fulfilling.
And trinitarians take it literally that god is with us
.
That is why the Jews laugh at time and Rabbis have way higher status than Priests.
Hmmm Sure Ghaith where do you get rabbis have higher status than preists Ghaith?
In judaism they do?
No kai. The hexagram is in many churches as well matter inf act in the Cathedral of Valencia.
Okay Ghaith i wanted to let this sink in with you really good- which is why i scattered this topic over several posts- Nowhere in the bible ot or nt does it instruct believers to use cross as symbol or hexagran or wailing walls as symbols of worship these developed hundreds of years later yos- My point all along was to show you that islam HAS THE SAME PROBLEM- If i came out and said that directly before it wouldnt sink in to you- and it still might not- but at least i got you to admit that the jews dont use the star of david as a symbol of worship.
No it isnt Kai. its not like Bukhari collected every single hadith that existed. If the hadith only existed in ABU DAWOOD than it would have been strange but the fact its in several other books make it quiet Sahih.
What about bukharis miracle Ghaith ? Did you forget the hadees that contradict that hadee about death penalty for animal sex in ahmeds musnad as well as abu dawud?
He didnt kai He told them to kill who ever was caught doing so and kill the animal. Your Paul how ever forgot. Now i ask you again Kai, is it a shamful or not in your mind?
So i guess that muhammad forgot that revelation? perhaps gabriel or allah did? Of course it is Not sound to have sex with animals.
Paul cancled the laws Kai remember Rom 6:14
Paul was showing (like he does in all of his letters) that jesus made a new covenant- paul more than anything emphasized the fact that those under the law all fell short and many were prone to boast-
1 corinthians 6:9-11 Then paul says adulterers effiminate, murderers, slavers, idolaters, drunkards will not inherit the kingdom of god but that is what SOME OF YOU WERE.
Ghaith do you not know that jesus is considered one of the 5 rasool according to islam do you know what that means Ghaith? it means he came with different law or covenant.
So it's really silly for a muslim to go this route in condemnation of paul
Also i think you meant to say 2 Tim 3:16
Yes-Thank you my dear yos-
And that verse is not really effective on me because ive already stated before that Paul is either a liar or he was under the control of Satan
And muhammad wasnt?
. Because Paul already said that Jesus is Satan in Rev 22:16 and Satan is reffered to as God many times in the bible
First of all Ghaith paul didnt write revelation- second of all rev 22:16 says that jesus is the bright morning star of course you take that from the kjv of Isaiah 14:12-15 (NIV) How you have fallen from heaven, O morning star, son of the dawn! You have been cast down to the earth, you who once laid low the nations! You said in your heart, "I will ascend to heaven; I will raise my throne above the stars of God; I will sit enthroned on the mount of assembly, on the utmost heights of the sacred mountain. I will ascend above the tops of the clouds; I will make myself like the Most High." But you are brought down to the grave, to the depths of the pit.
This should be understood as a sardonic title for the "anti-christ" or beast. He claims to be "christ", right Ghaith? He claims to be Messiah, and has his moment under the sun, but comes to be brought low ultimately. Contrast the real Bright Morning Star: He lives humbly, does not boast, is not arrogant, is submissive to the Father... even unto death. Then the Father raises Him to the highest place; in the morning so to speak.
So No the REAL bright morning star is the opposite of satan
Kai. 1 Chro and 2 Sam might be a contradiction but maybe it is a contradistinction And Christians like to attack us because Tabari said Satan once tricked Muhammad which is a very weak source.
HMM well not only tabari Ghaith but al waqidi through ibn sa'd- like for example his tabaqat
Well with Abu Dawods Animal sex hadith its mentioned in several other places, such hadiths i have no problem with.
Which ones Ghaith the ones that say animal sex is NOT to be punished hence ok or the ones that have the israeliyah isnads as posted in A/C link you provided??????????
Imigrants should also be punished than?
Usually an immigrant would go to ancient israel to serve their GOD - and considering that israel was a theocracy- then huh YES.
Still an error Kai.
No Ghaith
first of Kai dont you think the jews would come out and say that their stories in the talmud are not Sahih and fairytales when muhammad revealed them? Ive also showen you that Jews stole from the Quran.
Well- first of all the jews in arabia no doubt believed them and didnt think they were fairytales- and no you didnt- all you have done was show me some of dr saifullahs mental masturbation here let's read the quote here you posted.
Exampel the midrash Genesis Rabbah Genesis Rabbah is a Palestinian work,... its editing took place sometime after the redaction of the Jerusalem Talmud. Zunz holds that it was collected and edited in the 6th century CE. But even then the text was subject to accretions, and from Vayyishlach we find extensive passages bearing marks of the later day Haggadah. In Vayyigash the commentary is no longer verse by verse, while much of Vayechi was probably drawn from the Tanhuma homilies Rabbi Dr. H. Freedman & M. Simon, Midrash Rabbah, 1961, Volume I (Genesis), The Soncino Press: London (UK), p. xxix.
Now Ghaith you know these rabbis believe the tanhumma date from before the fourth century?
Also i challenge you to find me The story of Abraham and the Idols older than Vat. 30 that predates Quran Kai. You wont be able to.
I will look- but just because there is nothing available now that survives or isnt found doesnt mean it was older than muhammads time.
Seems like the jews keep stealing stories from us Kai. Ohh well they regard Muhammad as the greatest prophet to the gentiles.
That is a twist of facts
My parents call them Masihi even to i pointed out we muslims are the masihi. But as for the ahlekitab that doesn mean they are followers of Christ kai. Since Jews are also ahlekitab who reject Isa al Masih
Show me one piece of islamic literature that calls muslims masihi????? iYes both the jews and christians are ahlekitab yos- because they use same book except jews dont use injil.
That passage clearly shows the law was for israel.
It doesnt say its exclusive for Israelis.
of course the jews dont believe jesus was the messiah
I was talking about the Messiah, does the jews have a problem that he will come from a virgin. How ever they do have a problem with him being the begoten son. Same as Islam.
Muhammd adopted the injil as a book from god and the people of the injil nasara- of course with a twist
No Kai, Injeel is the gospel of Jesus.
, that was another narration from ibn ishaq that ibn kathir used- he ended it with "allah knows best"
Thats what i pointed out Kai.
Before you accuse me of lying- Show me where i said the quran said its antioch???.
like the quran claims it was.
The narrations about it being antioch and the three apostles being simon peter john and paul fits what muhammad was talking about best. then again it brings more problems- something few muslims today would care to accept.
No it does not kai
Ok Ghaith but osama never posts the parts showing why sam calls him that does he Ghaith? I disagree with sam calling him that- but there are two sides to the story.
Well if there was im sure Sam would have exposed him.
Well, nadir is a compulsive liar- look at his site Ghaith? did you know even ali sina debated him on the old ffi forum? back in 2004 i believe.
Thats not good enough proof as Ali Sina is even a bigger liar.
So does matthew yos- of course all christians believe this jws and other unitarians say that immanuel (god with us) is saying that Jesus having the name Emmanuel is that, at that time, God had turned his attention to his chosen people the Israelites and was giving them the chance to turn around and come back to worshiping him. All so Jesus being the King of Gods Kingdom was now in their midst as Gods representative, his Word (spokes person) so yes the prophetic title of “God with us” fitted the roll that Jesus was fulfilling.
No not really. Jesus never became any king and according to the gospels he didnt even want to die.
Okay Ghaith i wanted to let this sink in with you really good- which is why i scattered this topic over several posts- Nowhere in the bible ot or nt does it instruct believers to use cross as symbol or hexagran or wailing walls as symbols of worship these developed hundreds of years later yos- My point all along was to show you that islam HAS THE SAME PROBLEM- If i came out and said that directly before it wouldnt sink in to you- and it still might not- but at least i got you to admit that the jews dont use the star of david as a symbol of worship.
Well Kai, JW rejects the cross, how ever i dont se any other Christians do. I am sort of a sunni to i dont like to claim to since i dont like to divide Islam because its a bidha i find it unfair that because some uneducate Sunnis use the crecent that i have to deal with this pagan garbage. How ever you forget the fact that they use the cross in exorcism and against vampires kai
What about bukharis miracle Ghaith ?
What about it?
Did you forget the hadees that contradict that hadee about death penalty for animal sex in ahmeds musnad as well as abu dawud?
2 vs how many kai?
Of course it is Not sound to have sex with animals.
There we go the quran forbids it.
Ghaith do you not know that jesus is considered one of the 5 rasool according to islam do you know what that means Ghaith? it means he came with different law or covenant.
Yes i do Kai, but seeing as the law after Jesus(Quran) still forbids Pig meat we have a problem with Pauls law.
Yes-Thank you my dear yos-
Np Kai.
And muhammad wasnt?
Nope.
So No the REAL bright morning star is the opposite of satan
No Kai, Lucifer is refered to as morning star long long before revelation. We still have Rev saying jesus is lucifer.
No Ghaith
Yes Kai, something that chews the cud is a rumiant who ever wrote this tought that the rabbit or hare or both where rummiants therfor using your hunter excuse would still include this to be an error.
Now Ghaith you know these rabbis believe the tanhumma date from before the fourth century?
It doesn Kai.
Show me one piece of islamic literature that calls muslims masihi?????
Kai i said I I call muslim masihi because Muslims follow the real Jesus and not the morning star lucifer
Yes both the jews and christians are ahlekitab yos- because they use same book except jews dont use injil.
Ok Kai now show me where ahlekitab is followers of Isa al Masih
what part of "Hear, Israel, the decrees and laws I declare in your hearing today. Learn them and be sure to follow them. 2 The Lord our God made a covenant with us at Horeb. 3 It was not with our ancestors[a] that the Lord made this covenant, but with us, with all of us who are alive here today. 4 The Lord spoke to you face to face out of the fire on the mountain. do you NOT understand?
I was talking about the Messiah, does the jews have a problem that he will come from a virgin
Yes
. How ever they do have a problem with him being the begoten son. Same as Islam.
All that shows Ghaith is that muhammad was trying to compromise jewish beliefs- mo was mostly around jews! Begotten son should read unique son- or as jws take it as jesus being a DIRECT CREATION OF GOD
No Kai, Injeel is the gospel of Jesus.
Ive explained this so many times yo you yos- but you refuse to understand that jesus was the gospel and the injil al kitab is indeed the account of jesus teachings and ministry
Thats what i pointed out Kai.
Ghaith, your point didnt prove that ibn kathir seen paul as a false prophet- does it?
Before you accuse me of lying- Show me where i said the quran said its antioch???.
like the quran claims it was.
The quran IMPLIES that it is antioch no doubt- but of course the quran being the vague book that it is doesnt say the name of the city because mo was trying to scare some gullible quraysh into his religion.
No it does not kai
You can't disprove me?
Well if there was im sure Sam would have exposed him.
Heres a chronology of sam shamouns history with nadirahmed
Summarized Chronology
Early June 2003 Nadir Ahmed agrees to debate with Sam Shamoun on whether Muhammad is a prophet. The date is set for 28 June 2003. Afterwards NA retracts, asks to see Sam Shamoun's debate material before the debate, and then refuses to do this debate at all. Then NA challenges Sam Shamoun to do a debate on what the Quran says about the Bible. Sam Shamoun agrees to NA's topic. 16 July 2003 The above debate takes place on Paltalk. The debate was recorded and is available online. Afterwards Sam Shamoun challenges Nadir Ahmed to get back to the originally agreed topic: Is Muhammad a true Prophet of the true God? Ever since Nadir Ahmed has been desperately trying to avoid this particular debate. At the same time, he made every attempt to save face both for his avoidance of this debate and for his poor performance in the debate that did take place. 3 November 2003 Step one of operation "damage control": NA published the above discussed article "Answering Islam on the run!" in order to make people believe that it is actually Sam Shamoun who seeks to make this debate impossible and who is running away from this debate. Furthermore, he claims that in his first debate he humiliated Sam Shamoun because he did not answer properly to couple of points. All this is answered in the above. 26 April 2004 Still desperately trying to sell his smokescreen, Nadir Ahmed published "Challenge To Debate". His proposed subtopics for the "Is Muhammad a Prophet" debate series do not even mention the name of Muhammad. It is obvious that NA does not want to debate any aspect directly related to the person of Muhammad. 1 May 2004 Sam Shamoun and Nadir Ahmed agree to debate the topic "Quran and Science" on Paltalk. 2 May 2004 Nadir Ahmed retracts again. Contradicting his earlier statements, NA now claims science is actually not even relevant for Muhammad's prophethood. Instead he demands a debate on the preservation of the Quran.
The preceding facts should allow the readers to judge for themselves that NA’s smokescreen and excuses have been exposed once and for all.
Would it make any sense for sam to write that letter
Thats not good enough proof as Ali Sina is even a bigger liar.
Well, what i posted above is far more proof- ali sina is a bigger liar now? maybe to a muslim who keeps trying to hammer a circle peg into a square hole perhaps.
No not really. Jesus never became any king and according to the gospels he didnt even want to die
Yos- jesus purpose wasnt to be the king of judea- and you ignore the fact that he rose from the dead- Besides, the quran exclusively calls jesus the messiah-
Well Kai, JW rejects the cross, how ever i dont se any other Christians do
Muslims rejecting the crescent and star as a symbol of islam is about as rare as finding jws amongst christians.
.
I am sort of a sunni to i dont like to claim to since i dont like to divide Islam because its a bidha
You use innovation in many of your premises yos- like injil was never written down- even though the quran is quite clear on that issue.
i find it unfair that because some uneducate Sunnis use the crecent that i have to deal with this pagan garbage.
Some uneducated sunnis????? Ghaith what am i going to do with you??
How ever you forget the fact that they use the cross in exorcism and against vampires kai
Hmmm LMAO @ vampires
What about it?
What do you mean "what about it"? stop ignoring the issue Ghaith.
2 vs how many kai?
You have to remember Ghaith -many of those hadees come from the same source and are written in different hadee collections. except maliks muwatta and bukharis sahih and ibn muslims sahih
There we go the quran forbids it.
No it doesnt you have failed to show me the verse unless you believe the quran is referring to a corrupt source like 10:94 says.
Yes i do Kai, but seeing as the law after Jesus(Quran) still forbids Pig meat we have a problem with Pauls law.
HMMM could it be that mo was trying to make islam attractive to local jews?? Jews forbid camel meat, lobster clams catfish etc....etc...
So why not muslims?
Nope.
HA haaa
No Kai, Lucifer is refered to as morning star long long before revelation. We still have Rev saying jesus is lucifer.
Ghaith LUCIFER is a bad translation
No yosLux (=light) + ferous (=to bear or carry). Therefore the name "Lucifer" means:Light-bearer or Light-bringer. But this is not what the Hebrew word "heylel" means! Infact heres a link
debunking this issue for good it resulted in a bad translation from jerome in 400 ce.
http://www.israelofgod.org/lucifer.htm Light bearer Ghaith jesus is considered light bearer to christians - secondly, the passage in isaiah is not even referring to satan-
In addition to the written scriptures we have an "Oral Torah," a tradition explaining what the above scriptures mean and how to interpret them and apply the Laws. Orthodox Jews believe G-d taught the Oral Torah to Moses, and he taught it to others, down to the present day. This tradition was maintained only in oral form until about the 2d century C.E., when the oral law was compiled and written down in a document called the Mishnah.
Over the next few centuries, additional commentaries elaborating on the Mishnah were written down in Jerusalem and Babylon. These additional commentaries are known as the Gemara. The Gemara and the Mishnah together are known as the Talmud. This was completed in the 5th century C.E.
There are actually two Talmuds: the Jerusalem Talmud and the Babylonian Talmud. The Babylonian Talmud is more comprehensive, and is the one most people mean if they just say "the Talmud" without specifying which one.
There have been additional commentaries on the Talmud by such noted Jewish scholars as Rashi and Rambam. Adin Steinsaltz recently completed a new edition of the Talmud, with his own commentary supplementing the Mishnah, Gemara, and Rashi commentaries.
The Talmud is not easy to read. It reminds me of someone else's class notes for a college lecture you never attended. There are often gaps in the reasoning where it is assumed that you already know what they are talking about, and concepts are often expressed in a sort of shorthand. Biblical verses that support a teaching are often referenced by only two or three words. The Talmud preserves a variety of views on every issue, and does not always clearly identify which view is the accepted one.
The Mishnah is divided into six sections called sedarim (in English, orders). Each seder contains one or more divisions called masekhtot (in English, tractates). There are 63 masekhtot in the Mishnah. Approximately half of these masekhtot have been addressed in the Talmud. Although these divisions seem to indicate subject matter, it is important to note that the Mishnah and the Talmud engage in quite a bit of free-association, thus widely diverse subjects may be discussed in a seder or masekhtah. Below is the division of the Mishnah into sedarim and masekhtot
You see Ghaith again i tell you this is how the muslim mind works- if the quran said the sky is pink you would have muslims either changing the word pink to blue- or their would be saudi financed cropdusters as we speak trying to paint the sky PINK. to prove the quran right.
Kai i said I I call muslim masihi because Muslims follow the real Jesus and not the morning star lucifer
Muslims cant even spell jesus correctly in arabic yos- And the last part of your comment here is based on ignorance it means light bearer
Ok Kai now show me where ahlekitab is followers of Isa al Masih
First Ghaith You must realize that in Arabic bible is is Al-Kitab (الكتاب) or Al-Kitab Al-Muqaddas (الكتاب المقدس), which is what the Bible has always been called in the Arabic language, even before muhammad and during muhammad. Arabic Christians before and after Muhammad have always used the same term for the Bible which the Qur'ān does. The Qur'ān calls Christians and Jews Ahle-Kitab (أَهْلَ الْكِتَابِ) meaning "People of the Bible" and it says that they read the Bible (الكتاب):
"The Jews say, `The Christians are not (founded) upon anything.' And the Christians say, `The Jews are not (founded) upon anything.' And yet they read the Book (Al-Kitab)." - The cow 2:113 "Be true teachers, since you teach the Book (Al-Kitab) and you study it earnestly." - jesus grandfather (Ha hAA)Al-Imran 3:79
So yes the nasara followers of yasua are considered ahlekitab
Oh GOD Ghaith you had to get yourself banned again- why do you find it necessary to call ygalg a "stupid jew" or marie " retarded" do you believe that makes you right Ghaith?
You cry to ygalg because he is an israeli that refutes your sillyness regarding jewish beliefs- he doesnt fit your false criteria that jews say muhammad is a prophet to gentiles
This is false by the way about the only jews that say that are those rabbis in tehran with five armed basijis behind them.
I have dialogued with muslim friendly jews- and even they acknowledge that muhammad fails the criteria of prophethood- otherwise they would have referred to him as AL MASIH.
I promise you Ghaith one day you will become one of these murtadds that you laugh at on other thread- or you will become more delusional and more extremist to fit your interpretations- hopefully the former will happen.
Hello Kai how have you been, the wife and kids are ok? I am expecting from you since its Ramadan that you will not insult Islam in our debaes as you respect me to that much.
what part of "Hear, Israel, the decrees and laws I declare in your hearing today. Learn them and be sure to follow them. 2 The Lord our God made a covenant with us at Horeb. 3 It was not with our ancestors[a] that the Lord made this covenant, but with us, with all of us who are alive here today. 4 The Lord spoke to you face to face out of the fire on the mountain. do you NOT understand?
I tought every Jew was a spiritual Israeli same with Christians?
Nah that not true there is no such garbage as spiritual Israeli.
But let me ask you, the Israelis when they got Land (Israel, Judah, Jerusalem and such) Didnt the law matter on non Israeli Jews? Or Gentiles?
Yes
Yes this is right Kai, but you are forgeting that Jesus failed every single prophecy that was supposed to be fullfield by the Messiah. More over there where no prophecies about crucifixion, second comming, or ressuraction and Jesus(the biblical one) pretty much failed the test and is a false messiah (the biblical one i belive Isa Ibn Maria is the messiah dont get confused). Christians like to twist verses. Like they mistranslated Isaiah 53 or they say that Psalm 22 is a prohecy about Jesus. A Prophecy is a claim that is suppose to be known and clear to everybody before it happens. Psalm 22 is Davids prayer not a prophecy. Christians start getting confused why the 3 major things jesus did (Die on a Tree which according to the OT is a cursed death, resurrect, the messiah is god in human flesh, virgin birth). How ever i belive the OT is confused and NT is a non inspired Book written by that homosexual Paul. I mean what kind of Man insist on circumcising a grown man? And Jesus never really made any prophecies as John was written after 70ad(after the temle was destroyed).
ll that shows Ghaith is that muhammad was trying to compromise jewish beliefs
Ohh ok so the Quran was not written by Abbasid caliphate and Umayyad caliphate?
More over the Quran insults Jews, and Muhammad didnt speak Hewbrew and the OT wasnt translated into Arabic untill 900AD and the NT not untill 1600AD. So did Muhammad speak Hewbrew, Greek, Latin, Aramaic, and Pefect Arabic than kai. No your logic get droped there.
Ive explained this so many times yo you yos- but you refuse to understand that jesus was the gospel and the injil al kitab is indeed the account of jesus teachings and ministry
Hahaha you explained the Quran to me. The quran is clear that the Gospel was revealed into Jesus. The 4 gospels are just accounts on Jesus more over. Jesus went to hell and preached the gospel. Which Gospel was that. Thats the Injeel Kai.
Ghaith, your point didnt prove that ibn kathir seen paul as a false prophet- does it?
Paul was never meant to be a Prophet Kai. More over Ibn Kathir just quoted another scholar. Who prob had the idea that Pauls scriptures where also corrupted, more ever Muhammad said many times that between him and Jesus there where no Prophets so why are we to take Ibn Kathir over Prophet Muhammad SAW.
The quran IMPLIES that it is antioch no doubt
It doesn implie it Kai, more over it doesnt imply its after Jesus either.
You can't disprove me?
I jut did, you want me to post the hadith with its Isnad?
Would it make any sense for sam to write that letter
How is Sams word anymore trust wordy than Nadir Ahmed Now Kai i just want to say that i agree that Nadir Ahmed is a clown but i dont want to lie about a muslim. Sam is a monkey who lies about 9:5 and 9:25 and ignores the context of it. Sam is a monkey who uses mistranslation for his own benefits. This 40year oldnon married kid still uses the word Fag. A word 12 year old use. Sam thinks that any one who doesnt agree with him is a homosexual. Those this man sound sane to you my dear Kai.
More over Sam didnt want to debate the topic "Terrorism and the Bible".
In the debate Is Islam a religion of peace? We witnessed Sam Shamoun refused to answer the 3 deadly questions of Christianity which proved that the Bible approves of genocide and terrorism as legitimate tactics of war. Shamoun was repeatedly challenged through out the debate, but he ran away from this issue and falsely claimed it was off topic. He then confidently made the promise that he would debate the topic at a later time.
I have recently contacted him by email to proceed, but now he has refused to debate. Therefore, when he confidently claimed that he would debate this issue, it was nothing more than the old “coward’s bluff” to escape from being cornered on the genocide in the Bible. Unfortunately, the much anticipated debate on the Bible will not take place.
However this should come as no big surprise, and this is not the first time. If Sam “The Sham” Shamoun really thought he could explain away the passages in the Bible which promotes genocide and terrorism, then he would NEVER have let me get away with my allegations in the debate, when I stated the following:
”Islam is a religion of peace, because… it came to confront and condemn the terrorism and genocide of Biblical Christianity”
If Shamoun really had a refutation of this argument, he would have taken 2-3 minutes to present it and shut me up. But he knows very well that the evidence for my statement is CLEAR and can not be challenged. Therefore he ran like a coward from this issue.
And finally, keep in mind that Sam Shamoun is a professional liar, therefore he not going to simply say:
“YEA… lol… when I agreed to debate the Genocide of the Bible that was a big lie.. and you fell for it!”
As a professional liar, he is a bit more sophisticated and knows how to employ smoke screen tactics, which will cloak his deception. However, I was able to predict before hand his exact tactic and called him out on it when I sent him the email. Here is what I mean - when I sent the email asking Shamoun to proceed for this debate on the Bible, I specifically stated the following in my email:
More over the holy spirit seems to be malfunctioning on Sam Shamoun because he seems to be a faithfull Christian but still he has such a foul mouth.
Now, I don’t pretend to be an angel here, God knows that I talk a lot of trash sometimes, especially insulting people’s stupidity.
But, there are limits to joking, and once you go past those limits, then you have a serious problem. For example, one thing I don’t go around doing, is personally asking if I can have sex with people’s sister, even if it is joke! That, is just plain sleazy and reveals that person is sexually perverted. But This is the unfortunate case with Answering Islam’s Sam Shamoun. From out of no where, this clown started talking about "SCREWING" Muslim woman in a private chat on paltalk.com. Hey, let me tell you something, in my book, that is very uncool, I don’t care if the women are Hindu, Buddist, Christian… that is simply NOT cool.(yo mama jokes don’t count). I think after reading from the excerpts of our discussion, no decent, respectful Christian will even give this cheap, perverted man a second glance. Because of this, I am no longer going to pursue debating Sam Shamoun, as he has been running like a coward from my challenge after the terrible humiliation he suffered in our first debate (download from my website).
Answering Islam: Sam Shamoun
Monkypox: Nadir Ahmed
MonkyPox: WHAT ROOM R U IN
MonkyPox: INVIT ME
Answering Islam: tro do mutah
Answering Islam: to mutah
MonkyPox: HUH?
Answering Islam: not in here
Answering Islam: these guys
Answering Islam: are busy worshiping
Answering Islam: yeah
Answering Islam: jbirl inspried muhammad
Answering Islam: to prostitute women
MonkyPox: WHAT IS THIS..?
Answering Islam: can I pay to sleep with ur sister?
MonkyPox: KEEP IT UP, TEL ME MORE..
Answering Islam: we can call it mutah
Answering Islam: LOL
Answering Islam: OH
MonkyPox: YES,?
Answering Islam: HERE IS WUTH UR SHIA BROTHERS SAY ABOTU PAYING TO SCREW Muslim girls
MonkyPox: WHO CARES
MonkyPox: DO I LOOK SHIA TO U
MonkyPox: IDIOT
MonkyPox: LOL
Answering Islam: no dummy
MonkyPox: SICKO
Answering Islam: but ur prophet did allow prostitution
Answering Islam: whihc u snnis claim he then
Answering Islam: prohibited
Answering Islam: shias have exposed u liars
Answering Islam: LOL
Answering Islam: so can I pay to sleep with ur sister?
(comments: You know, Just picturing Sam Shamoun’s fat fingers around any young girl's waist is enough to make me puke )
MonkyPox: LOOK, DONT BEHAVE LIKE CHRISTIAN PRINCE,
Answering Islam: i am not moron
MonkyPox: YOU ARE A NO BODY NOW
Answering Islam: YES THEY ARE
Answering Islam: THEY SW THAT U ARE A CLOWN
MonkyPox: CANT EVEN DEFEND YOUR OWN ARTICLE
MonkyPox: S
Answering Islam: AND THAT I SPANKED U
MonkyPox: YOUR OWN PEOPLE HAVE BEEN WRITTING
Answering Islam: AND I WILL DO IT AGAIN
Answering Islam: AH HUH SURE THEY HAVE
MonkyPox: EXPRESSING THEIR "CONCERN" ABOUT U
Answering Islam: LIKE SAAH WHICH I EXPOSED U
Answering Islam: LISTEN I KNOW LYING
MonkyPox: YOURE JUST LOOSER
Answering Islam: IS ACCEPTED B UR GOD
Answering Islam: BUT IT DOESN'T MEAN EVERYONE ELSE DOES
MonkyPox: YOU ARE A SCARED LITTLE BITCH
Answering Islam: H HUH
Answering Islam: SURE I AM
Answering Islam: AM I?
MonkyPox: IM THE MAN HERE
MonkyPox:
Answering Islam: NOW WUT DID UR PROPHET SAY ABOTU BITCHES?
Answering Islam: OH, YES
Answering Islam: HE SAID TO PAY THEM
Answering Islam: AND THEN SCREW THEM
MonkyPox: EEEEW
MonkyPox: YURE NASTY
Answering Islam: SO IS THAT WUT U CONSIDER UR WIFE TO ME?
(comments: Dear God, now this pervert is after my wife…)
Answering Islam: A MUSLIM BITCH?
Answering Islam: REALLY
Answering Islam: DO U PAY HER?
Answering Islam: AFTER ALL
Answering Islam: U CAN DO MUTAH ON HER AND DUMP HER
Answering Islam: ENJOY
MonkyPox: look, the only hooker here is your mother...
Nadir Ahmed and Sam Shamoun are children Kai, they are not well researched. And Sam Shamoun is the second best debater On Christianity and Islam. The only better and more experianced is Christian Prince. And he also have a foul mouth. Dont you ever wonder why every one that Debates and insults Islam ends up being a sicko Kai? Anis Shorrosh is now in prison for trying to commit a massacre. Jimmy swaggart spent the churces money on hookers and got caught twice. Sam Shamoun is a sicko, a 40 year old child who sitll lives with his mom. Christian Prince cant even read arabic and is to scared to reavele his true identity. Answering-Christianity did a good job adding photos of him on ther website Walid Shoebat was a liar. His son brought a unknown hadith.
You se Kai this are the Christian evangelists they are all clowns.
Now bring me someone from Answering-Christians who have as many known problem as this freaks.
Well, what i posted above is far more proof- ali sina is a bigger liar now? maybe to a muslim who keeps trying to hammer a circle peg into a square hole perhaps.
Ali Sina is a coward. He puts up a open challenges and refuses to show up. He claims its for his own safty. He plays games kai. He is a Christian who lies about being a Christians and Christians are clowns (Accept for Eastern Orthodox i havent gotten to know them yet.).
Yos- jesus purpose wasnt to be the king of judea- and you ignore the fact that he rose from the dead- Besides, the quran exclusively calls jesus the messiah-
No Kai Jesus didnt rise up from the death.
Muslims rejecting the crescent and star as a symbol of islam is about as rare as finding jws amongst christians.
Kai honest answer and i am not bragging or anything. How many muslims have you debated that even have knowledge on anything? Most muslim debaters online use the argument because the Quran said so. They are not aware of Pagan symbolism. Most muslims think that the crecent represents the lunar callend, and what makes you think it doesnt Kai? How do you know the Jews didnt use it and it was later barrowed from Pagans? This things cannot be dated like the Pagan Cross Christians uses that was barrowed from Cross of Tau and the key of life and other pagan crosses because Constantine had a "vision".
You use innovation in many of your premises yos- like injil was never written down- even though the quran is quite clear on that issue.
Let me ask you a question kai do not involve Quran i will later confront this Quran claim. Do Christians belive the gospel was written down?
Some uneducated sunnis????? Ghaith what am i going to do with you??
Yes uneducated sunnis on Pagan orgins.
Hmmm LMAO @ vampires
Vampires was just joke there Kai How ever it is used in real Exorcism who Christians fail horrible at. I belive the pope even failed a exorcism.
What do you mean "what about it"? stop ignoring the issue Ghaith.
Bukhari was cured from blindness after his madder recited a dua Prophet Ibrahim gave her in a dream what about it. God didnt make Bukhari perfect just because he cured him?
You have to remember Ghaith -many of those hadees come from the same source and are written in different hadee collections. except maliks muwatta and bukharis sahih and ibn muslims sahih
Where do you find chains for hadith kai? I cant seem to find a suitable website and most i get from forums who prob translate them from arabic.
No it doesnt you have failed to show me the verse unless you believe the quran is referring to a corrupt source like 10:94 says.
I can give you loads of verses that forbids it Kai How ever you cant from the Bible. Because using the argument sound is just as me using the argument shamful.
How ever here another 1
23:5-7 And they who guard their private parts Except from their wives or those their right hands possess, for indeed, they will not be blamed But whoever seeks beyond that, then those are the transgressors -
Now i predict that you will make the claim that right hand posses can be animals to kai : - p ? Because its exclusive to female slaves.
HMMM could it be that mo was trying to make islam attractive to local jews?? Jews forbid camel meat, lobster clams catfish etc....etc...
So why not muslims?
Muslims can eat lobster catfish clams camel?
Its divine Kai, pig is unhealty. But i dont like to approach you like this because i like debating Islam with you from a neutral point of view and not from a pro-biased muslim point of view.
Ghaith LUCIFER is a bad translation
You could have used the argument that morning star is a bad translation.
Matter infact ive just debated a christian who was pro-KJV and made the claim Lucifer was a transliteration.
(الكتاب المقدس المقدس)
Can you showme where الكتاب المقدس is written in the Quran. More ever can you show me evidence the Bible was called الكتاب المقدس in Prophet Muhammad (saw) time?
You see Ghaith again i tell you this is how the muslim mind works- if the quran said the sky is pink you would have muslims either changing the word pink to blue- or their would be saudi financed cropdusters as we speak trying to paint the sky PINK. to prove the quran right.
Kai let me try this from another angle. Do you accept that Jews barrowed the story of Iblis not bowing down from the Quran?
Muslims cant even spell jesus correctly in arabic yos- And the last part of your comment here is based on ignorance it means light bearer
Isa is the right spelling Kai. Coptsuse a translitarion and not the arabic word for it. And most important you cant trace Jesus real name because you dont have a Aramaic book from the new testament my dear Kai. So Jesus might just be a corrupted name. Paul might have even changed it as Paul might outdated any of the 4 gospels.
The Qur'ān calls Christians and Jews Ahle-Kitab (أَهْلَ الْكِتَابِ) meaning "People of the Bible" and it says that they read the Bible (الكتاب):
Ahh Kai you try to twist the veres. Yes they where called People of the Book because they had a Book. But where does it say that
So yes the nasara followers of yasua are considered ahlekitab
Now quote to me where the Quran says Nasara are followers of Christ.
Oh GOD Ghaith you had to get yourself banned again
Yup. Onlypart i really use of this forum is my debate with you. Since you had a project you where working on it was goodtaking a break. But was i really gone for 2 weaks kai?
why do you find it necessary to call ygalg a "stupid jew" or marie " retarded"
I have problems kai, i snapp when people lie. Ygalg lied about Imam Mehdi, and Marie lied about Mary in the Quran saying that the Quran only honour Aisha when the Quran mentions Mary more time than the bible. I called her a retard since she cant count. And Ygalg a stupid jew because he doesnt know the difference between Imam and Messiah.
do you believe that makes you right Ghaith?
Im sure you agree with me on the points i make before i insult people.
he doesnt fit your false criteria that jews say muhammad is a prophet to gentiles
First of Ygalg isnt really a Jew. He is an atheist i think. Second of Israeli Askhenasi Khazars are not Jews they are Zionists. A Zionist is not a Jew. Jews are good people.
rabbis in tehran with five armed basijis behind them.
No kai. Most non Zionist Rabbi doesnt have a problem with Muhammad. The Talmud says god sends prophets to gentiles.
Here are some Rabbis.
In my book After Muslims comes the Jews than the Ahmadiyyans than the Deists than the polytheist pagan Christians(The catholic and the retarded fallowers of Marthin Luther).
So you se kai im not antisemetic and Jews and Muslims worship the same God. And there are many Jews who accept Muhammad as a prophet to the gentiles. More over the friendly muslims jews you talked about where they Akhenasi Israeli Jews or Zionists? Where they well read?
More over there was a waited Prophet Kai there where 3 awaited people. A messiah a prophet and the prophet. The Messiah was Jesus the Prophet was John the baptist and then we had The Prophet kai.
More over before i get more into this i want to ask you. What is your definition of a Prophet?
More over you are very illogical on the claim that Muhammad wanted to win over Jews. Why would he want to win over the Jews and not Christians who at that time where a Super Power? While the Jews had very few Clans like Khayber who Ali ibn abu talib (Ra) destroyed. Or the backstaber also known as Banu Qurayza?
Here an Catholic Priest on Islam.
promise you Ghaith one day you will become one of these murtadds that you laugh at on other thread-
I am not really a devout Muslim Kai, i am still 18 after all i just say things as they really are. You how ever say things as other people want you to say like when you falsly accused Awlaki of playing with american prostitues.
Yes kai to bad the acctual number was 616. Also 666 was the number of the sun Kai, and Solomon recived 666 talents of gold yearly according to the bible 1 Kings 10:14 i guess that was an imperfect number Kai. No Kai 666 now 616 represents Nero Kai as the Beast. Not the devil.Ive seen many stupid Christians on the internet making the claim that 666 represents Bisimillah and that the Greek letters looked like allah that the distance between Mecca and The dome is 666 neutical miles. Christians are the ones with the whacko teori not the muslims.
No Ghaith
Ok Kai let me ask you a question. Do Rabbits chew the cud?
ERMMM
Solomon undestood the language of the ants Kai. Its an exception just like the talking donkey in the bible. Moreover you want to talk about stupidness the Bible wins by a long long long shot kai
I dont belive that John was acctualy on Crack but i dont even think this John existed. Revelation was probebly just a book where jewish sorries and fairy tales where added along with other events that happend that the Catholic Churche complied and added into one book and made the fairty tale story that John was boiled and didnt die so he was sent to an Island. That explain the entire Nero case.
I will look- but just because there is nothing available now that survives or isnt found doesnt mean it was older than muhammads time.
Just because something is in the talmud doesnt mean it wasnt in the Tanakh and than later removed.We do know that the bible is corrupt according to the Death Sea Scrolls.
Jeremiah himself admit the bible was corrupt Jeremiah 8:8.
And scholars like james white has admit that the bible is corrupt
HMM well not only tabari Ghaith but al waqidi through ibn sa'd- like for example his tabaqat
There are pro Ibn Ishaq muslims as you said kai have you ever seen pro tabari muslims?
Since you are good at doing research Kai and also you respect that filthy Shamoun who is 40 years old without a wife or kids and still lives with his mother why dont you do enough research debunking this? http://www.answering-christianity.com/dumpster_section.htm If you cant than you accept the fact that Shamoun is trash and he belongs in the trash can.
More over you have so much hate from Dr Zakir Naik Kai? Didnt you watch this debate?
Where he burried answering-islam? And Dr Jamal Badawi was just their at the Christians. Sam Shamoun was there also witnessing his master(William not to be confused with his other master Paul and Constantine) being destroyed.
Hello Kai how have you been, the wife and kids are ok? I am expecting from you since its Ramadan that you will not insult Islam in our debaes as you respect me to that much.
Hey yos- it's great to see you back- the family is good... how are you? I will try my best yos- it just depends how sensitive you get
I tought every Jew was a spiritual Israeli same with Christians?
those that followed the new covenant from jesus are regarded as spiritual israelites- you know the ones that the quran says were superior to those that disbelieved in jesus.
But let me ask you, the Israelis when they got Land (Israel, Judah, Jerusalem and such) Didnt the law matter on non Israeli Jews? Or Gentiles?
It mattered only to any body within the physical boundaries of israel- not outside-
Yes this is right Kai, but you are forgeting that Jesus failed every single prophecy that was supposed to be fullfield by the Messiah
If you twist verses then sure Ghaith a
.
More over there where no prophecies about crucifixion, second comming, or ressuraction and Jesus(the biblical one) pretty much failed the test and is a false messiah
According to whom Ghaith? not to muhammad because the entire concept of the virgin birth of jesus jesus being the messiah, jesus healing the lame and ressurecting the dead comes from those who were superior (christians) to the disbelievers
(the biblical one i belive Isa Ibn Maria is the messiah dont get confused).
No my dear Ghaith you are the one that is confused
Christians like to twist verses
Muslims don't?? .
Like they mistranslated Isaiah 53 or they say that Psalm 22 is a prohecy about Jesus
So you are trying to prove that jesus was NOT the messiah again? are you really muslim Ghaith?
.
A Prophecy is a claim that is suppose to be known and clear to everybody before it happens
. Jesus prophecies and the prophecies about him were clear to his disciples Ghaith.
Psalm 22 is Davids prayer not a prophecy.
Jesus uttered from psalm 22 before he died- fulfilling that prophecy- remember Ghaith jesus came not to abolish but to fulfill the law and the prophets Ghaith
Let me reword the rest of this what you wrote Ghaith
Muslims start getting confused why the 3 major things jesus did (Die on a Tree which according to the OT is a cursed death, resurrect, the messiah is god in human flesh, virgin birth). How ever i belive the Quran is confused and sunnah is non inspired Books written by that homosexual bukhari. I mean what kind of Man insist on circumcising a grown man? And muhammad never really made any prophecies as the quran was written after 70aH(after the rashidun died).
Now if you wrote that Ghaith i would agree with that ;-) you forgot about matthew mark and luke yos- and let me ask you- (of course you are alluding to paul cutting timothys foreskin ) what would happen if a uncircumcized hindu or other non muslim believed naiks lies and converted to islam- wwould you consider zakir naik a homosexual for cutting off this ex hindus foreskin??
What about abraham the hadith like the bible says that abe was circumcized at 99 (unlike the biblical 89but thats not my point) are the servants of abraham homosexual for cutting off his foreskin??
Ohh ok so the Quran was not written by Abbasid caliphate and Umayyad caliphate?
No i tend to believe the quran was developed during the ummayad period maybe uthman himself modified it.
More over the Quran insults Jews
Yes it does especially in the medinah surahs after mo got pissed off at them.
, and Muhammad didnt speak Hewbrew
I never said that he did- because that is obvious how he confused ibnoo with hebrew banoo like in 9:30
and the OT wasnt translated into Arabic untill 900AD and the NT not untill 1600AD
How do you know that Ghaith?? Just because the OLDEST mss of arabic bible we have today from 867 ce doesnt mean it is the first one.
>>>Khadija then took him to Waraqa bin Naufil, the son of Khadija's paternal uncle. Waraqa had been converted to Christianity in the Pre-Islamic Period and used to write Arabic and write of the Gospel in Arabic as much as Allah wished him to write.
. So did Muhammad speak Hewbrew, Greek, Latin, Aramaic, and Pefect Arabic than kai
No, yos- but some of the ahlukitab knew hebrew and aramaic- it's rather obvious that muhammad or allah for that matter did not know perfect arabic ha haa
. No your logic get droped there.
Yours just got drop kicked
.
The quran is clear that the Gospel was revealed into Jesus
. The quran was confused or muhammad portrayed all revelation coming down as he was claiming to recieve it in order to legitimize his own prophethood Ghaith.
more over. Jesus went to hell and preached the gospel
Are you referring to the parable where jesus went into the grave? .
Which Gospel was that. Thats the Injeel Kai.
you are confused Ghaith
Paul was never meant to be a Prophet Kai. More over Ibn Kathir just quoted another scholar.
That is why they considered paul a follower and not an apostle of jesus Ghaith
Who prob had the idea that Pauls scriptures where also corrupted
Hmmm no indication of that Ghaith
,
more ever Muhammad said many times that between him and Jesus there where no Prophets so why are we to take Ibn Kathir over Prophet Muhammad SAW
.
That is why the salaf considered paul a follower but in any case this shows how mo was confused over prophetical issues.
It doesn implie it Kai, more over it doesnt imply its after Jesus either.
Another example of the quran not being clear it looks like Ghaith.
I jut did, you want me to post the hadith with its Isnad?
Hmm no you didnt- and yes please post the hadith and i will verify its authenticity. by way of ibn hajar directly
How is Sams word anymore trust wordy than Nadir Ahmed Now Kai i just want to say that i agree that Nadir Ahmed is a clown but i dont want to lie about a muslim
. Well do you think osama and sami zataari are liars Ghaith?? Im goi
Sam is a monkey who lies about 9:5 and 9:25 and ignores the context of it. Sam is a monkey who uses mistranslation for his own benefits
.
You mean 9:5 and 9:28-29 sam doesnt lie about the context of those verses Ghaith he is using the two jalils ibn kathir etc.... as a source for their context And you must also concede that osama and sami etc are liars for taking bible passages out of context.
This 40year oldnon married kid still uses the word Fag
How do you know sam is non married??
.
A word 12 year old use. Sam thinks that any one who doesnt agree with him is a homosexual. Those this man sound sane to you my dear Kai.
How do you come up with that yos- you dont even know the context of those snapshots from paltalk on osamas site
More over Sam didnt want to debate the topic "Terrorism and the Bible".
I will make a post after i answer all your other points refuting that once and for all.
In the debate Is Islam a religion of peace? We witnessed Sam Shamoun refused to answer the 3 deadly questions of Christianity which proved that the Bible approves of genocide and terrorism as legitimate tactics of war. Shamoun was repeatedly challenged through out the debate, but he ran away from this issue and falsely claimed it was off topic. He then confidently made the promise that he would debate the topic at a later time.
I have recently contacted him by email to proceed, but now he has refused to debate. Therefore, when he confidently claimed that he would debate this issue, it was nothing more than the old “coward’s bluff” to escape from being cornered on the genocide in the Bible. Unfortunately, the much anticipated debate on the Bible will not take place.
However this should come as no big surprise, and this is not the first time. If Sam “The Sham” Shamoun really thought he could explain away the passages in the Bible which promotes genocide and terrorism, then he would NEVER have let me get away with my allegations in the debate, when I stated the following:
”Islam is a religion of peace, because… it came to confront and condemn the terrorism and genocide of Biblical Christianity”
If Shamoun really had a refutation of this argument, he would have taken 2-3 minutes to present it and shut me up. But he knows very well that the evidence for my statement is CLEAR and can not be challenged. Therefore he ran like a coward from this issue.
And finally, keep in mind that Sam Shamoun is a professional liar, therefore he not going to simply say:
“YEA… lol… when I agreed to debate the Genocide of the Bible that was a big lie.. and you fell for it!”
As a professional liar, he is a bit more sophisticated and knows how to employ smoke screen tactics, which will cloak his deception. However, I was able to predict before hand his exact tactic and called him out on it when I sent him the email. Here is what I mean - when I sent the email asking Shamoun to proceed for this debate on the Bible, I specifically stated the following in my email:
] I will address this later in next post or the one after it
Nadir Ahmed and Sam Shamoun are children Kai, they are not well researched. And Sam Shamoun is the second best debater On Christianity and Islam. The only better and more experianced is Christian Prince. And he also have a foul mouth.
Spare me this nonsense Ghaith
Dont you ever wonder why every one that Debates and insults Islam ends up being a sicko Kai?
Im not a sicko yos- and if you mean christian evengelists etc... i dont see james white or john gilchrist, david wood etc... on your list of sickos
Anis Shorrosh is now in prison for trying to commit a massacre.
Proove that he is in prison now?? he wasnt trying to commit a massacre he ill advisely went to his apt trash dumpster bin and used it as a furnace to burn old taxpapers -you do know that the charges were dropped dont you?
Jimmy swaggart spent the churces money on hookers and got caught twice.
I agree with that- but jimmy was a clown before he had his debate with deedat- so that has nothing to do with his criticism of islam
Sam Shamoun is a sicko, a 40 year old child who sitll lives with his mom.
You have to prove that first dear Ghaith. i can prove that he is married and doesnt live with his mom
Christian Prince cant even read arabic and is to scared to reavele his true identity. Answering-Christianity did a good job adding photos of him on ther website
Osama is also a stalker too huh. LOL
Walid Shoebat was a liar. His son brought a unknown hadith.
I will continue our garbage can debate later
You se Kai this are the Christian evangelists they are all clowns.
Besides your misrepresentations of two of them you couldnt list any others so where do you get ALL
Now bring me someone from Answering-Christians who have as many known problem as this freaks.
Lets start with osama i will prove he is a compulsive liar right now from his own website
I voluntarily issue a public apology to brother Jalal Abualrub for lying on him:
Dear brothers and sisters in Islam,
I would like to first greet you all with our traditional Islamic Greeting: As'salamu Alaikum Wa Rahmatu Allah Wa Barakatuh (may Allah Almighty's Peace, Mercy and Blessings be upon you) and also be upon your families as well.
I first want you to know that I am not under any pressure of any sort to write this open and public apology to brother Jalal Abualrub. For those of you who have seen the hostile history between me and my Salafy brothers and sisters in Islam, they would've probably seen my hostile history with brother Jalal Abualrub.
Ever since I have established my web site back in 9/21/1998, I've been teaching myself from the absolute bottom and from scratch about both Islam and the Bible. I virtually had little-to-no knowledge about both Islam and the Bible, and I brought myself up by constantly reading and learning. The problem with this is that I found myself in bitter clashes on many occasions with different religious groups from all sides who thought that I was going after their theology, while in reality I was only learning and discovering the Truth.
Brother Jalal and I have crossed paths in the past, and like before, I have offended him with my lack of knowledge on some areas in Islam which caused for a bitter online clash to take place between us. I am sure both of us learned quite a lot from this. I myself have learned a lot and grew a lot from it. However, I did make a big moral-mistake towards brother Jalal. I have lied on him! I have accused him of threatening me when he never did. I also have fabricated the email about me deserving to get shot. I did it intentionally and knowingly. I sincerely apologize to brother Jalal for it. It's been bothering me a lot for the past several months to a point where it would come hard to me during my Prayers and Supplications to Allah Almighty, and also during the times of when I be honest and tell the Truth. It bothered me so much and too much that I had to finally step up to brother Jalal and tell him directly of it. The more I grow and mature, the more I realize how foolish and ridiculous I many was in the past. Brother Jalal is an honorable and peaceful man, and doesn't deserve the harshness and ugliness that I gave him. Please rest assured that I would never do this foolish act again. I hope that the proof is in this open letter, brothers and sisters in Islam. I honestly voluntarily came to brother Jalal and told him. I had no worldly pressure to do so other than my consciousness that was stinging me every time I tried to face Allah Almighty with a true face! I could not face Allah Almighty while continuing sleep with this lie. I had to come clean and face my evil actions. I ask Allah Almighty to forgive me. And I also ask brother Jalal to forgive me as well, and I am sorry for him and I am ready to take full responsibility for it.
Now you might say that he was big by apologizing etc... but that was because jalal is a muslim osama would never do that to a christian or NON muslim
He already proved how capable he was of lying about his own
So why would any kufr trust osama? or any muslim for that matter.
Ali Sina is a coward. He puts up a open challenges and refuses to show up. He claims its for his own safty. He plays games kai. He is a Christian who lies about being a Christians and Christians are clowns (Accept for Eastern Orthodox i havent gotten to know them yet.).
Prove the silly assertion that ali is a christian- its very clear that he isnt if you read HIS articles.
No Kai Jesus didnt rise up from the death.
It depends how you take the word mutawafeeka in 3:55 Ghaith muslims are in conjecture regarding that issue.
Kai honest answer and i am not bragging or anything. How many muslims have you debated that even have knowledge on anything? Most muslim debaters online use the argument because the Quran said so. They are not aware of Pagan symbolism.
Some more than others- and many come up with all sorts of theories etc..
Most muslims think that the crecent represents the lunar callend, and what makes you think it doesnt Kai?
Jews never used any symbol like that yos- the jews used a lunar solar hybrid calendar
How do you know the Jews didnt use it and it was later barrowed from Pagans?
There is not a single shred of evidence of that Ghaith.
This things cannot be dated like the Pagan Cross Christians uses that was barrowed from Cross of Tau and the key of life and other pagan crosses because Constantine had a "vision".
No Ghaith the romans did crucify who they regarded as criminals- like for example somone claiming to be a king. that is why the cross is used by most christians- jws say it was a stake because there wasnt enough wood in judea- but i dont buy that in any case the point of christians using cross is to symbolize jesus death and ressurection.
Let me ask you a question kai do not involve Quran i will later confront this Quran claim. Do Christians belive the gospel was written down?
They do
Yes uneducated sunnis on Pagan orgins.
Hmmm were the mamliks uneducated Ghaith?
Vampires was just joke there Kai How ever it is used in real Exorcism who Christians fail horrible at. I belive the pope even failed a exorcism.
I know it was a joke- that is why i laughed
Bukhari was cured from blindness after his madder recited a dua Prophet Ibrahim gave her in a dream what about it. God didnt make Bukhari perfect just because he cured him?
Hmm that is one version are you aware of who wrote that story? theres another version of it- that is amazing how allah wouldnt heal mos own sons but healed bukhari who went on to compile all those ahadith that muslims fight over.
Where do you find chains for hadith kai? I cant seem to find a suitable website and most i get from forums who prob translate them from arabic.
I can give you loads of verses that forbids it Kai How ever you cant from the Bible. Because using the argument sound is just as me using the argument shamful.
Until now you havent given one Ghaith
How ever here another 1
23:5-7 And they who guard their private parts Except from their wives or those their right hands possess, for indeed, they will not be blamed But whoever seeks beyond that, then those are the transgressors -
Now i predict that you will make the claim that right hand posses can be animals to kai : - p ? Because its exclusive to female slaves.
Ghaith the verses you posted can easily be taken for a man to guard his private parts regarding other mens wives- especially mos we all know how jealous he was- 33:53 comes to mind Sorry but you predicted wrong
Muslims can eat lobster catfish clams camel?
Those are just as unhealthy as pork and why do your fuqaha except hanbali prohibit certain birds eand other predatorial animals when quran never says so- but torah does. HMMM
Its divine Kai, pig is unhealty. But i dont like to approach you like this because i like debating Islam with you from a neutral point of view and not from a pro-biased muslim point of view.
In reality pig is no more unhealthy then eating red meat or shrimp lobster crab etc...
You could have used the argument that morning star is a bad translation.
Lucifer was a bad transliteration
Matter infact ive just debated a christian who was pro-KJV and made the claim Lucifer was a transliteration.
Those guys believe that king james was inspired- i think for the most part the kjv was a decent translation considering the sources they had at the time- but it is no better then many other translations
Can you showme where الكتاب المقدس is written in the Quran. More ever can you show me evidence the Bible was called الكتاب المقدس in Prophet Muhammad (saw) time?
2:113 Ghaith maqaddasالمقدس isnt there- just like it isnt there for quran either الكتاب is there for book or scripture or book and christian arabs call it book especially when you realize that bible itself comes from greek word for books and into book
Kai let me try this from another angle. Do you accept that Jews barrowed the story of Iblis not bowing down from the Quran?
I dont know about that the life of adam and eve hails from the 9th century- but i know 5:32 comes from the 4th century talmud and we see parrelelism about the raven scratching the earth as told in 5:31
Also the concept of 7 heavens comes from jewish foklore not torah
Isa is the right spelling Kai. Coptsuse a translitarion and not the arabic word for it.
Not just copts Ghaith syrian christians lebanese palestinian and jordanian iraqi christians all use yasua or yasu
And most important you cant trace Jesus real name because you dont have a Aramaic book from the new testament my dear Kai
Have you heard of the syriac peshitta? .
So Jesus might just be a corrupted name. Paul might have even changed it as Paul might outdated any of the 4 gospels.
It was yeshua Ghaith as jews would name there own usually hebrew and aramaic is the same principle [
Ahh Kai you try to twist the veres. Yes they where called People of the Book because they had a Book. But where does it say that
Im not twisting anything Ghaith And what was that book that they had with them Ghaith THE TORAH (GOSPEL christians only) PROPHETS AND PSALMS
Now quote to me where the Quran says Nasara are followers of Christ.
3:55 and 61 :14
Yup. Onlypart i really use of this forum is my debate with you. Since you had a project you where working on it was goodtaking a break. But was i really gone for 2 weaks kai?
I have been busy unexpectedly for the last week or so i need to start working on that- its just going to be links to sources debunking these silly 9/11 conspiracies
I have problems kai, i snapp when people lie. Ygalg lied about Imam Mehdi, and Marie lied about Mary in the Quran saying that the Quran only honour Aisha when the Quran mentions Mary more time than the bible. I called her a retard since she cant count
Yes mo was infatuated with mary she is the only woman named in quran- but why do you say ygalg lied you know Ghaith there is not solid concensus from your ulema about the imam and messiah
Some like some shia believe the imam only while other shia believe it will be imam and jesus the messiah
Sunnis believe jesus will come to break the crosses kill the swine and slay the dajjal live to 40 and die????????
.
And Ygalg a stupid jew because he doesnt know the difference between Imam and Messiah.
replied to this above
First of Ygalg isnt really a Jew. He is an atheist i think. Second of Israeli Askhenasi Khazars are not Jews they are Zionists. A Zionist is not a Jew. Jews are good people.
Two of those videos you displayed are ashkenazi mongoloid khazars by your own definition Ghaith
No kai. Most non Zionist Rabbi doesnt have a problem with Muhammad. The Talmud says god sends prophets to gentiles.
Non sense Ghaith
Here are some Rabbis.
Including two or three ashkenazis ?
In my book After Muslims comes the Jews than the Ahmadiyyans than the Deists than the polytheist pagan Christians(The catholic and the retarded fallowers of Marthin Luther).
In muhammads book quran it was muslims, christians, magi, zoroastrians THEN THE JEWS
So you se kai im not antisemetic and Jews and Muslims worship the same God.
Only to jews who know there dhimmitude status
And there are many Jews who accept Muhammad as a prophet to the gentiles
but not to them??? How so Ghaith
. More over the friendly muslims jews you talked about where they Akhenasi Israeli Jews or Zionists? Where they well read?
Well what difference does that make you showed clips of at least two ashkenazi israeli jews- yes they were well read Ghaith
More over there was a waited Prophet Kai there where 3 awaited people. A messiah a prophet and the prophet. The Messiah was Jesus the Prophet was John the baptist and then we had The Prophet kai.
Source this please -you know jews dont believe this .
More over before i get more into this i want to ask you. What is your definition of a Prophet?
One who proclaims yos- as well as one that proclaims gods wrath or predictions
More over you are very illogical on the claim that Muhammad wanted to win over Jews. Why would he want to win over the Jews and not Christians who at that time where a Super Power?
This is very LOGICAL Ghaith he wanted to win over jews AND christians that is why he used there prophets and the christian jesus - but in medinah there were few if any christians and many jews
While the Jews had very few Clans like Khayber who Ali ibn abu talib (Ra) destroyed. Or the backstaber also known as Banu Qurayza?
They had three large tribes Ghaith the banu qurayza banu nadir and banu qanakha- he took them down one at a time after they rejected him- remmeber mo ordering hid followers to prostate towards jerusalem for five years then changing it a year or two after the hegira-
Here an Catholic Priest on Islam.
I am not really a devout Muslim Kai, i am still 18 after all i just say things as they really are
Why do you consider yourself not devout? f i may ask- and you mean as you want them to be? .
You how ever say things as other people want you to say like when you falsly accused Awlaki of playing with american prostitues
Now since i got time im going to confront some points that i didnt get to earlier.
We will see about that
Yes kai to bad the acctual number was 616. Also 666 was the number of the sun Kai
, Ghaith im confident that mss is a mistranslation it makes no sense for it to be 616, 666 In rev means and symbolized the antichrists imperfection. throughout revelation the number 7 represents gods judgement etc.... so this makes sense- it doesnt mean vesppasian or nero or domitian it isnt refering to one man.
and Solomon recived 666 talents of gold yearly according to the bible 1 Kings 10:14 i guess that was an imperfect number Kai
No more imperfect then if i have 666 bucks in my wallet or 777 bucks - the verses arent talking about a transaction Ghaith
.
No Kai 666 now 616 represents Nero Kai as the Beast.
Refuted above
Not the devil.Ive seen many stupid Christians on the internet making the claim that 666 represents Bisimillah and that the Greek letters looked like allah that the distance between Mecca and The dome is 666 neutical miles.
I dont know about the bismilillah but is 666 neatical miles the difference between the dome and mecca?? J/K LOL You have plenty of muslims with similar wacko theories
Christians are the ones with the whacko teori not the muslims.
Ok Kai let me ask you a question. Do Rabbits chew the cud?
Why yes they do according to the hebrew of the time. First of all Take two issues at hand: the definition of "cud" and that of "chewing." Let's take a closer look at the Hebrew version of both. Here is the word for "cud" according to Strong's:
gerah, the cud (as scraping the throat): cud. . First, this word is used nowhere in the Old Testament besides these verses in Leviticus and Deuteronomy. We have only this context to help us decide what it means in terms of the Mosaic law.
Second, refection is a process whereby these animals pass pellets of partially digested food, which they chew on (along with the waste material) in order to give their stomachs another go at getting the nutrients out. It is not just "dung" that the hares are eating- which is probably why the Hebrew word for dung was not used here.
Contrast this with what cows and some other animals do, rumination, which is what we moderns call "chewing the cud." They regurgitate partially digested food in little clumps called cuds, and chew it a little more while mixing it with saliva.
So then- partially digested food is a common element here. We therefore suggest that the Hebrew word simply refers to any partially digested food -the process is not the issue, just the object.
Or you might say "verse says 'bring up' the cud- sounds like regurgitation to me."
Ghaith the Hebrew word in question is not specific to the process of regurgitation but is instead merely a phrase of general movement. And related to the specific issue at hand, the rabbit is an animal that does "maketh" the previously digested material to "come" out of the body (though in a different way than a ruminant does) and does thereafter chew "predigested material." The mistake is in our applying of the scientific terms of rumination to something that does not require it
Solomon undestood the language of the ants Kai. Its an exception just like the talking donkey in the bible. Moreover you want to talk about stupidness the Bible wins by a long long long shot kai
Difference is Ghaith is that the angel made balaams donkey APPEAR to talk like a ventriliquist- besides the ant business is silly anyways because they dont percieve human politics or kings etc...
I dont belive that John was acctualy on Crack but i dont even think this John existed. Revelation was probebly just a book where jewish sorries and fairy tales where added
Its a prophecy of the apocalypse Ghaith with the 7 headed beast representing world govt- theres different interpretations with babylon the great representing false religion according to jws
along with other events that happend that the Catholic Churche complied and added into one book and made the fairty tale story that John was boiled and didnt die so he was sent to an Island
Iraneus spoke of the book of revelation in late 2nd century Ghaith - that theory goes down the tube .
That explain the entire Nero case.
Nero died 30 years before john wrote revelation.
Just because something is in the talmud doesnt mean it wasnt in the Tanakh and than later removed.We do know that the bible is corrupt according to the Death Sea Scrolls.
LOL The talmud is based on rabbinic opinion Ghaith - and no the dead sea scrolls dont show that -you have apocryphal books in them but those claims seem to fall flat
Jeremiah himself admit the bible was corrupt Jeremiah 8:8.
If you omit the rest of the book Ghaith sure! also if you omit quraanic verses that speak of some of ahlekitab reading the book with the right reading 2:121 and orders mo to consult with the previous scriptures when he is in doubt. sure thing Ghaith
And scholars like james white has admit that the bible is corrupt
I can only imagine that yt video where muslims slay the context of james white.... hey Ghaith did james white pronounce the shahada too?
There are pro Ibn Ishaq muslims as you said kai have you ever seen pro tabari muslims?
Tabaris tafsir is fairly accepted by learned orthodox muslims Ghaith and his history annals are used with caution by learned muslims.
Since you are good at doing research Kai and also you respect that filthy Shamoun who is 40 years old without a wife or kids and still lives with his mother why dont you do enough research debunking this?
I will refute this now that i already exposed osama
More over you have so much hate from Dr Zakir Naik Kai? Didnt you watch this debate?
Where he burried answering-islam? And Dr Jamal Badawi was just their at the Christians. Sam Shamoun was there also witnessing his master(William not to be confused with his other master Paul and Constantine) being destroyed
. Really zakir naik really never defended the quran in that debate and william was old and had the decency to lie so profusely like zakir did- Ali sina demolished most if not all of zakirs lies- read it Ghaith and you will see also that ali sina isnt a christian either [urlhttp://www.faithfreedom.org/debates/NaikCampbellintro.htm][/url] zakir naik has not only refused to debate ali sina but sam shamoun as well.
Since you are good at doing research Kai and also you respect that filthy Shamoun who is 40 years old without a wife or kids and still lives with his mother why dont you do enough research debunking this? http://www.answering-christianity.com/dumpster_section.htm If you cant than you accept the fact that Shamoun is trash and he belongs in the trash can.
I want you to see these emails from sam zataari to sam shamoun- how he sami asks sam for help to go against omar bashari and nadir ahmed to expose nadir as a fraud and this was more than a year after those emails in that a/c site Lets go through some shall we.
hey there loser, you had any donuts today? did you feed some to your satanic holy spirit too? lol
anyways u loser, i havent stopped thinking of smashing ur backside in a debate, so here i am again challening you for a debate. infact 2 debates:
Is Muhammad a true Prophet
Terrorism in the Bible or the Quran
plz just say yes so i can give you a nice beat down, we can set the time sometime next month, i already have 2 debates planned for the next 2 months, making u the 3rd would be very nice.
so what do you say you silly demon possed loser? do you want to a good beating by me? dont be a chicken like the apostles in the bible. Plz
hey fat boy dont go crying to brother anas about me, if you wanna cry come cry to me, i sent you the email, why do you go crying to him you stupid obease cross worshiper?
he will smash you in a debate when you guys get it on, which is all good, and i also want to debate you too, to make it a double sized beating, you like that too dont you? double sized? double size holy spirit burger right?
so next time you and ur drunk spirit email me, instead of emailing the brother who has nothing to do with it, stupid boy you are stop acting tough and a bully cause ill smack you over the net and in real life got it? you dont scare anyone you stupid cross worshiping ASSyrian, infact some of my muslim friends once gave a good beat down to stupid ASSyrian christians who were messing with them and pushing them around, so better know your place fat boy.
so again, do you accept to debate me you fat drunk missionary style loser?
______________________________________________________________________________ Sam writes: What makes this truly astonishing is that this young lad had turned to me for assistance in dealing with Jalal Abualrub and Nadir Ahmed:
hey man, i am just here to ask you if you are willing to debate one of jalal's writers, omar al habeshi, you already wrote an article refuting him. just want to know if you would have a debate with him on paltalk, i know you will say yes but just want confirmation.
the reason im asking this, is because omar- al habeshi is claiming osama is terrible in debating and so on, and since he seems to be big headed and so on, i told him since hes so qualified to come and debate you, and i told him i would be telling you about it, and asking you if want to debate him.
the guy will most likely back down, but i just need a yes from you, and i will make sure all our readers know you are willing to debate the guy, and if he backs out all will see jalals men running as cowards.
look, i know we had and will still have alot of problems, both of us commit blasphemies against each other from our prespective.
plus, this gives you a good opportunity for a good easy debate. i told him to debate your topic, is Muhammad a prophet, 4 minutes each like we did so he doesnt make an excuse of saying its to broad.
and this is me alone, i came out with the idea of you debating the guy since he is saying osama did terrible, then maybe he is qualifiedto debate you, plus the guy uses paltalk. but he WONT debate, i just want you to say yes, and when he backs down, i will expose him for it for backing down against you.
we have made lots of problems for each other, but i do think we have some respect for each other, which is why i specifically said to debate you, not some other christian, but you specifically.
This was in reply to sam shamouns letter
From: "sam shamoun" <sam_shmn40@hotmail.com> >To: sami-zaatari@hotmail.com >Subject: RE: i come in peace >Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2006 18:01:10 +0000 > >Sami, > >After all the insults, blasphemies against the God of the Bible, along with >the false accusations against me, and you still ask me to help you guys >expose Jalal? >
on a side note, what is so funny about this, is that nadir came to me saying he wants to work with us, answering-christianity.com. now when all of a sudden he sees something he doesnt like, he immidietly says he is ignoring me and denying all contact with me. whats up with that? osama, plz dont delay your articles on nadir, he is such a hypocrite and these actions prove it, all he wanted to do is use us, since we are a popular site, but the second we do something he doesnt like (which i have no idea) he immidietly breaks all contacts.
for 15 days we have been waiting for nadir to give his debate topic, and he has stalled. he is running away from this debate, enough with the nonsense talk that shamoun always runs away, thats BS. shamoun has accepted the debate since day one, and has given his debate topic, nadir is stalling and its obvious he is running from the debate since he sees that sam is very serious to go through with it.
infact, nadir is also trying to make this debate NOT HAPPEN. how does nadir expect to set a debate up with shamoun when he is sending insultive emails to shamoun? does that make sense? would you debate someone who comes to you calling you a barking dog etc etc as nadir has done to sam? no you wouldnt, this is a smoke screen by nadir, because he knows when you bring insults and slurs to a debate set up the debate will not happen. when ppl set a debate up, you make sure both parties are respectable and kind to each other, which is what i made sure with sam and nadir, and it all went good. then NADIR WAS THE FIRST ONE TO BREAK this by sending an insulting email to sam. its obvious nadir is doing all this to avoid a debate, how sad.
plz nadir, dont waste our time ever again, just to show how lame you are, it took me and shamoun just 10 mins to set our debate up! we set it up in 10 mins, and met 2 hours later and did the debate. so the fact its taking you this long to just make a debate topic shows your stalling and you never were serious, you just wanted to try and make up a lie that sam ran from you and say hurrayyyyyy, but everyone who sees this will know that YOU HAVE STALLED AND RAN FROM THE DEBATE.
to shamoun, plz dont ever waste your time on nadir.
to osama, just write the debate reviews and ignore nadir, dont give him the attention he does not deserve.
][/quote] Sami zaatari is explaining how nadir RAN from debate with SAM SHAMOUN
From: <nadir@examinethetruth.com> >Reply-To: nadir@examinethetruth.com >To: sam_shmn40@hotmail.com, quransearch_com@yahoo.com, faruuk19@yahoo.com, > ahsen@amalik.com, b_zawadi@hotmail.com, orthodox786@hotmail.com, > islamlife@gmail.com, sami z <sami-zaatari@hotmail.com> >Subject: RE: silencing the barking dog >Date: Thu, 24 Aug 2006 13:23:18 -0400 > > >Sami, > Your request to help organize this debate has been denied. I do not want >anything >to do with you. Sorry. I have ajusted my settings to send all your emails >to my >spam folder, therefore, it is pointless to respond to this email. > >PLEASE REMOVE ME FROM YOUR EMAIL LIST AT ONCE, AS WELL AS PALTALK. I WILL >ALSO >REMOVE YOU FROM MY EMAIL LIST AS WELL. > > >Thanks, >Nadir Ahmed >www.ExamineTheTruth.com > > > > > > >On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 15:40 , sami z <sami-zaatari@hotmail.com> sent: > > >ok, this is getting silly now nadir. you dont know who or what i am? >excuse > >me, all this is taking place because I BROUGHT YOU AND SAM TOGETHOR IN >ONE > >ROOM, and got it under way. > > > >shamoun has AGREED TO DEBATE, and has given his topic. we are now waiting > >for your topic, which you have not given so far. > > > >shamoun will only open up my emails now, not yours, so quitr frankly, if >you > >want this debate to happen then i am going to arrange it, if not, then > >debate is over. the reason i say that is because shamoun does not trust >you, > >and thats how it is. the fact is he does trust me to a degree, so >therefore > >you cant just exclude me now from arranging this thing between you two. > > > >since i am arranging this thing, i am going to have to be neutral, and > >objective, and as a neutral and objective person in this, you are >STALLING > >nadir. it isnt so hard, just make a debate topic, and make your date, and > >debate is on. that is not asking for much, i dont understand how much >more > >you want? > > > >i think everyone on the list will even agree with me, shamoun has made >his > >debate topic: muta, he is free after september 7th, now make your debate > >topic, and set 2 dates up after september 7th to debate yours and his > >debate. and since you like to narrow topics down so you can deal with >each > >issue, you will have 5 minutes of back and forth, like me and shamoun did >in > >our debate. so nadir make your debate topic, and your date. > >
just to remind you all, that nadir ahmed was supposed to be debating sam shamoun, im suprised how people forgot about this, as you can all see, nadir has been running all this time. nadir did you think we would forget?
Notice how sami taunts nadir for running from sam shamoun?
Ohhh kai im so happy you responded. I almost got the idea that you quit.
My last post was horrible containing huge grammatical errors. And mistakes which i will adress. Im on a Smart phone now so i give you a response later.
Ghaith wrote:Ohhh kai im so happy you responded. I almost got the idea that you quit.
My last post was horrible containing huge grammatical errors. And mistakes which i will adress. Im on a Smart phone now so i give you a response later.
My dearest yos- No i havent quit and dont worry about any grammatical mistakes- as long as i understand you- is all i care about
>From: omer moh <faruuk19@yahoo.com> >To: sami z <sami-zaatari@hotmail.com> >CC: b_zawadi@hotmail.com, nadir@examinethetruth.com, >quransearch_com@yahoo.com, orthodox786@hotmail.com, faruuk19@yahoo.com, >ahsen@amalik.com, islam_defender@hotmail.com, just_flow11@hotmail.com, >Munir0728@yahoo.com, mrdebatethehate@earthlink.net, >Islam_the_true_Deen786@hotmail.com, islamlife@gmail.com >Subject: RE: warning shots fire! round two about to begin! >Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 08:10:58 -0700 (PDT) > >To talk honestly..here are list of loses > -Nadir lost his debate with shamoun...and the debate should be removed >from his site. > -Nadir's debate with christin prince should be removed not cos Nadir >addmitted animal sex but since he can't refute cp's claim. > -Osama lost badly his debate with shamoun and he did well for not >posting it in his site. > -Sami..although he had certain good points(in the debate with shamoun) >he was just dancing around "where in the bible jesus said 'i am a god'''. > -Nadir although he won the debate with wood,we can't understand the link >b/n tawhid and ebla tablets.I doubt if Nadir is concerned in narrow and >specific debate topics. > The only commen character you all(whose debates are reviewed here) share >is ARROGANCE and SELF PRAISING. > ..the best debate(although its quite short) i must recommend is Jalal Vs >winn. > Best Regards > Omar > >sami z <sami-zaatari@hotmail.com> wrote: > lol he is very stupid indeed. he claims christian prince humiliated me, >thats why all the muslims in the room were laughing at cp for running away >from the debate, which was recorded. > >secondly, for the sake of argument, just say i did lose the debate to sam, >at least as you admit, i did go all the way, but what about your debate >with >sam? you looked like a complete idiot and you did not refute one single >solid argument! > >thirdly, we all know your jelous, but thats okay, bassam said it all, and >bassam is not bias btw, he has made his difference with osama known, so he >is neutral in this. but again, nadir seems to be ignoring one solid fact, >that his site HARDLY gets any viewers, so at the end of the day he doesnt >have the main weapon in this war, which is the readers, we have ALL the >muslim readers, so they will all read what we have to say on you monkey >boy, >put that on top of answering-islam's pages on you. you are getting kicked >like a ball. >
most amazing part about all of this is that Sami Zaatari and Bassam Zawadi have turned against their former employer Osama Abdallah and have now joined the opposing side, siding with Jalal Abualrub and Nadir Ahmed! In fact, Zawadi prays that his false god brings judgment on Osama:
http://www.authenticsunnah.org/ (This website contains the greatest number of articles on the web that refute false allegations against Islam. However, I do not agree or share the same views as the webmaster of authentic sunnah when it comes to basic Islamic doctrine. For example, the author's stance on the issue of hadith and how he puts them on the same level as the Law found in today's Old Testament, his approval of the september 11 attacks, his wrongful understanding of the rules behind polygamy marraige, and his wrongful understanding of the concept of execution of apostates) and other Islamic issues. Therefore, I only recommend the articles that deal with comparitive religion issues and refutations and not to learn about basic Islamic rulings and doctrine from this website. I also want to state that I previously used to write articles for this website. However, many of my old articles on the site contain errors and need much editing. I asked the author of the site, Osama Abdullah to remove my articles but he has constantly been stubborn and refused. May Allah forgive him. He knows that my articles on his site contain some errors and still continues to keep them on the site only so his site can receive higher rankings. Therefore, I declare my self innocent in the sight of Allah from the mistakes of my old articles AND ONLY ASK GOD TO JUDGE OSAMA ABDULLAH FOR HIS STUBBORNNESS in refusing to remove them. (http://call-to-monotheism.com/links; Capital emphasis ours)
Not only does Zawadi pray God’s judgment upon his former employer these same Muslims went so far as to threaten to harm each other physically
Osama, you most excellent kaffir.. how dare you insult our Prophet(P) by saying he has a mental disease wallahi, if I ever meet you on the street.... youre done.... and it WILL happen. watch your back. and as for your gay lover Saami, the fact that you support this piece of sh!t osama.. the same holds true for you. I have ways and means... I promise u. I have made a screen shot of your defamation of our Prophet(P), so you dont try to hide your kuffar. Thanks, Nadir Ahmed www.ExamineTheTruth.com
you most excellent kaffir.. you think you can arm bar me? lol ill be the one breaking your elbow, then, I'll triangle choke you and force you to take back your insults against Prophet Muhammed(P) .... then I'll ground and pound your ugly face. It's going to be great.. Ill pass your guard in matter of minutes and mount you... and Ill slamm my fist right in your eye socket, and I'll say.. "what did you say about our Prophet(P)?" "who is old and stupid now Osama?" Let's do it this weekend. You can come down to my ju jitzu gym. Ill arrange it with the fellas down here. or did you want me to come up to your gym ? This is JIHAD. Thanks, Nadir Ahmed www.ExamineTheTruth.com
if you insist and are sure it is legal, really sure, then you should demand that the little khabeeth sign a paper promising not to take you to court when you beat him up, inshaallah, where he also promises not to bring quffah with him, the 'z' guy, because these two do not have any honor and they may ambush you from behind, also, why not video tape the legal match so that the khabeeth does not claim anything that did not happen.
You will love this one Ghaith. Court documents shows that Nadir was accused of beating his wife, divorcing her, marrying someone for a month and then divorcing her!
those that followed the new covenant from jesus are regarded as spiritual israelites- you know the ones that the quran says were superior to those that disbelieved in jesus.
When did Jesus crucifixion bcome the new covenant....?
More over the Quran said بني إسرائيل not spiritual israelites.
It mattered only to any body within the physical boundaries of israel- not outside-
So if Mahatma Ghandi lived in that time in Israel he would have been killed that my argument Kai.
Can you show me some passages from the OT about a second comming or rising from the dead?
According to whom Ghaith?
According to the Tanakh kai.
No my dear Ghaith you are the one that is confused
Isa ibn Mariam is the Messiah. Not the demon that came to Paul.
Muslims don't??
Not that i am aware of.
So you are trying to prove that jesus was NOT the messiah again?
Nope i am trying to prove the Biblical Jesus is not the Messiah not Isa ibn Mariam.
are you really muslim Ghaith?
Yup i belive the Tanakh is corrupted and NT is recycled Sun God myth so dont get confused if im attack the prophets in those books.
Jesus prophecies and the prophecies about him were clear to his disciples Ghaith.
According to the 4 fake gospels sure.
Jesus uttered from psalm 22 before he died- fulfilling that prophecy
Ohh so Jesus was a worm more over when did Psalm become a book of prophecies?
fulfill the law
How is psalm a law more over do Jews or Christians regard David as a Prophet?
Let me reword the rest of this what you wrote Ghaith
How is Bukhari a homosexual kai?
what would happen if a uncircumcized hindu or other non muslim believed naiks lies and converted to islam- wwould you consider zakir naik a homosexual for cutting off this ex hindus foreskin??
Im sure Naik wouldnt insist on cutting it kai. + He is a Dr.
No i tend to believe the quran was developed during the ummayad period maybe uthman himself modified it.
He would have been exposed easily if he did Kai.
Yes it does especially in the medinah surahs after mo got pissed off at them.
Muhammad had a good relation with Banu Qurayza Kai,the reason they backstabed him was because the Quran was insulting them.
I never said that he did- because that is obvious how he confused ibnoo with hebrew banoo like in 9:30
Can you show me where Banoo is in 9:30 Kai? Waqalati alyahoodu AAuzayrun ibnu Allahiwaqalati annasara almaseehuibnu Allahi thalika qawluhum bi-afwahihim yudahi-oonaqawla allatheena kafaroo min qablu qatalahumu Allahuanna yu/fakoon
How do you know that Ghaith?? Just because the OLDEST mss of arabic bible we have today from 867 ce doesnt mean it is the first one.
Can you show sources that the OT was translated into Arabic in Muhammads time. he only Bible they had back then was in Hebrew and i belive Assyrian.
Sahih Bukhari Volume 1, Book 1, Number 3: Khadija then accompanied him to her cousin Waraqa bin Naufal bin Asad bin 'Abdul 'Uzza, who, during the PreIslamic Period became a Christian and used to write the writing with Hebrew letters. He would write from the Gospel in Hebrew as much as Allah wished him to write.
As for Volume 6 Number 478
for he never had a dream but it turned out to be true and clear as the bright daylight.
Can you say if any of the biblical prophets had this abilty Kai?
By Allah, Allah will never disgrace you, for by Allah, you keep good relations with your kith and kin, speak the truth, help the poor and the destitute, entertain your guests generously and assist those who are stricken with calamities.
Are any of the biblical Prophets as nice as this? Last i read Elijah let bears eat children and Moses knocked out an angel and Jesus told his deciples to steal a donkey
There is a contradiction between Volume 1 Number 3 and Volume 6 Number 478 who are we to take most logical Kai? The Gospel was not translated to Arabic untill around 1600Ad thats 1000 years after that event.
No, yos- but some of the ahlukitab knew hebrew and aramaic
So how did they read the Greek Gospels?
Are you referring to the parable where jesus went into the grave?
"For Christ also suffered once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit, by whom also He went and preached to the spirits in prison. 1 Peter 3:18-19
you are confused Ghaith
No not really this is the Injeel. Mark 16:15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
Now this is where your going to sweat because the Gospel existed before the NT which you call the Gospels Kai and dont blame it on mistranslations.
That is why they considered paul a follower and not an apostle of jesus Ghaith
Where did Ibn Kathir consider him a follower?
Another example of the quran not being clear it looks like Ghaith.
The Quran is not a story book Kai. Unlike the bible who go the story, unlike the Bible who got the story about King Nebuchadnezzar or should i say "prophecy" Ezekiel 30:10-11 Christian try to say this prophecy did come true in the battle in Carchemish but he didnt conquere. In 568 BCE he tried again but the pharaoh Amasis II crushed him. If i remember my history correct Persia i belive conquered Egypt.
Hmm no you didnt- and yes please post the hadith and i will verify its authenticity. by way of ibn hajar directly
Which hadith was i talking about again i forgot. 3 weeks ago so...
Well do you think osama and sami zataari are liars Ghaith??
This is why you are smart Kai you go to the weakest link of Answerin-Christians Sami Zataari.
Well i acctual like the way Osama build Answerin-Christianity from zero knowledge. And he did sayhe was sorry about the lie and you cant proof the accusation that he wouldnt do the same for the Christians.
As to Sami i think he did a bad thing and he didnt follow surah 5:51. More over i dont se why Sam wanted Nadir to debate him so bad. Besides Nadirs foul mouth and childish behaviour he is well read.
You mean 9:5 and 9:28-29
Thank you Kai i am not a hafiz
sam doesnt lie about the context of those verses Ghaith he is using the two jalils ibn kathir etc.... as a source for their context And you must also concede that osama and sami etc are liars for taking bible passages out of context.
He is lying about it Kai you know dam well each of those ayas where for specific wars.
More over Kai i posted Audios the best you can do is Email to defend Sam Shamoun?
How do you know sam is non married??
He is according to Nadir.
I made fun of Sam’s morbid obesity by calling him Sam "Shamu" Shamoun, and ridiculed the fact that he is a bald, middle aged, total loser with no girlfriend, wife, or significant other and lives with his mother. Not to mention, his filthy shabby appearance, as I mentioned one time:
I also remember reading this in Answering-Christianity but could find it now. Can you prove other wise Kai?
you dont even know the context of those snapshots from paltalk on osamas site
Is there really a context where a man in his 30-40s using the word Fag?
I will make a post after i answer all your other points refuting that once and for all.
We will see about that.
Im not a sicko Ghaith
Ofcourse not Kai maybe i should have added the word Christian before.
i dont see james white
James White admited the bible is corrupt Kai.
If you dont agree that the Bible is corrupt Kai than Christians must be able to Drink deadly drinks and play with snakes. Mark 16:18 They shall take up serpents, and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them. They shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.”
john gilchrist, david wood
Really Kai David Wood? Who will you mention next Nabeel Qureshi? Ergun Caner? Robert Spencer? Since i had the Idea that Sam Shamoun was rock buttom here but we can go under that Kai no problem.
David Wood lying.
More lies from both clowns.
Id like to se you try defend this one from the filthy Sam Shamoun Kai.
Dr James White sinks to an level where he wants to debate on ABN Sat against Dr Zakir Naik.
Audio records of Sam running from Nadir.
Proove that he is in prison now?? he wasnt trying to commit a massacre he ill advisely went to his apt trash dumpster bin and used it as a furnace to burn old taxpapers -you do know that the charges were dropped dont you?
There are some good Christians to Kai, like Dr William Craig. Did you watch this debate?
It was sad he used the talmud to defend his claims but atleast he put up a Good show.
Proove that he is in prison now?? he wasnt trying to commit a massacre he ill advisely went to his apt trash dumpster bin and used it as a furnace to burn old taxpapers -you do know that the charges were dropped dont you?
If the entire building went on fire and lives was lost wouldnt that be a massacre Kai. Arson is still a crime. No i didnt source for the charges being dropped?
but jimmy was a clown before he had his debate with deedat
Yes any one saying the bible is word of god is a clown Kai.
You have to prove that first dear Ghaith. i can prove that he is married and doesnt live with his mom
Please do Kai
Osama is also a stalker too huh. LOL
lol idk about that maybe he just obtained a picture and used tineye.com to get the rest.
I will continue our garbage can debate later
Ok my dear Kai.
Besides your misrepresentations of two of them you couldnt list any others so where do you get ALL
Typo, Christians Internet Evangelists who attack Islam.
Lets start with osama i will prove he is a compulsive liar right now from his own website
Dont we all make mistakes Kai?
public apology to brother Jalal Abualrub for lying on him
Ever since I have established my web site back in 9/21/1998, I've been teaching myself from the absolute bottom and from scratch about both Islam and the Bible. I virtually had little-to-no knowledge about both Islam and the Bible, and I brought myself up by constantly reading and learning
Is that not impressive Kai?
osama would never do that to a christian or NON muslim
How do you know that Kai?
Prove the silly assertion that ali is a christian- its very clear that he isnt if you read HIS articles.
Because the filth coming from his mouth is very Christian alike.
It depends how you take the word mutawafeeka in 3:55 Ghaith muslims are in conjecture regarding that issue.
and raise you to Myself and purify you from those who disbelieve and make those who follow you [in submission to Allah alone] superior to those who disbelieve until the Day of Resurrection.
The belivers here are muslims Kai not Nasara.
Jews never used any symbol like that yos-
Ohh how do you know that Kai?
There is not a single shred of evidence of that Ghaith.
There is not a single shred of evidence that Jesus was crucified either Kai,
"In the nineteenth century an eminent scholar, Rabbi Wise, searched the records of Pilate’s court, still extant, for evidence of this trial. He found nothing."
Deceptions and Myths of the Bible, p. 343
No Ghaith the romans did crucify who they regarded as criminals- like for example somone claiming to be a king. that is why the cross is used by most christians
Jesus was crucified on a Tree kai. The cross came 400 years later.
jws say it was a stake
They are more right than the filty Catholics. Jws are god people Kai, if they would drop the son god doctrine tey would be as good as the Jews.
Christianity was created in the Councile of Nicea not a religion of the followers of Christ.
Like Tom Harper states:
“The divine teacher is called, is tested by the “adversary”, gathers disciples, heals the sick, preaches the Good News about God’s kingdom, finally runs afoul of his bitter enemies, suffers, dies, and is resurrected after three days. This is the total pattern of the sun god in all the ancient dramas”. (The Pagan Christ, p. 145)
Orpheus
They do
Where can i find the Gospel of Jesus Christ?
Hmmm were the mamliks uneducated Ghaith?
At that time the knowledge of this wasnt as known as it is today.
mm that is one version are you aware of who wrote that story? theres another version of it-
I know Kai this one is more authentic.
that is amazing how allah wouldnt heal mos own sons
Maybe god was testing Muhammad when he took the life of his son. Even so God gave him Hasan and Hussein.
ahadith that muslims fight over.
Fighting over?
Ibn hajar book of narrators Ghaith
Thanks Kai. Is it in English?
Until now you havent given one Ghaith
23:5-7 is more than enough.
he verses you posted can easily be taken for a man to guard his private parts regarding other mens wives-
Did the verse says that?
Except from their wives or those their right hands possess
Ive debated Muslims on this who even included masterbating here.
Those are just as unhealthy as pork
No kai pork is more unhealty.
In reality pig is no more unhealthy then eating red meat or shrimp lobster crab etc...
Is read meat as filthy as a pig?
2:113 Ghaith maqaddasالمقدس isnt there- just like it isnt there for quran either
Unsure what you meant there Kai.
5:32 comes from the 4th century talmud and we see parrelelism about the raven scratching the earth as told in 5:31
Also the concept of 7 heavens comes from jewish foklore not torah
I will refute this later Kai. I just asked you a question you didnt give me an answer. I aska again.
I dont know about that the life of adam and eve hails from the 9th century
Btw its also from 10th 11th and 12th century.
Not just copts Ghaith syrian christians lebanese palestinian and jordanian iraqi christians all use yasua or yasu
Yup Kai that why their faith is dying.
Have you heard of the syriac peshitta?
Yup what about it? Did you also know it didnt contain Revelation?
It was yeshua Ghaith as jews would name there own usually hebrew and aramaic is the same principle
Might not be kai.
3:55 and 61 :14
3:55 is talking about muslims Kai.
61:14
O you who have believed, be supporters of Allah , as when Jesus, the son of Mary, said to the disciples, "Who are my supporters for Allah ?" The disciples said, "We are supporters of Allah ." And a faction of the Children of Israel believed and a faction disbelieved. So We supported those who believed against their enemy, and they became dominant.
1. It said Childrne of Israel not Rum. 2. Where the deciples Christians? Not according to 5:111they are
Sahih International And [remember] when I inspired to the disciples, "Believe in Me and in My messenger Jesus." They said, "We have believed, so bear witness that indeed we are Muslims [in submission to Allah ]."
Now thats a drop kick Kai, if we where playing Mortal Kombat i would have gotten the finish him option on you.
I have been busy unexpectedly for the last week or so i need to start working on that- its just going to be links to sources debunking these silly 9/11 conspiracies
Dont you think coming to the most Anti-Islamic forum in the world is a little bit unfair kai ?
Yes mo was infatuated with mary she is the only woman named in quran
Yup that why i called her a retard.
but why do you say ygalg lied you know Ghaith there is not solid concensus from your ulema about the imam and messiah
Imam Mehdi is not the Messiah. No muslim will say this. He might be a Messiah according to the Bible as according to the Dead Sea Scrolls there are 3 Messias but Ygalg knowledge is not that high that he meant to go that far. We tried mixing Dajjal with Mehdi which is why i got angry.
Some like some shia believe the imam only while other shia believe it will be imam and jesus the messiah
Ok lets talk about Rafida scum Kai. 12er garbage.
You know if Syrians heard your earlier claim when you asked me if i am a Nusayri or a 12er Bashar would be like.
Because Alawis count them self as twelver also.
But back to the Rafida.
Are their books really authentic enough Kai? Maybe i should start using Eastern Orthodox books also and claim its Christian?
No Kai Shias are clowns and Imam Mehdi will return with Jesus Inshallah.
Sunnis believe jesus will come to break the crosses kill the swine and slay the dajjal live to 40 and die????????
You know that hadith is a bit weak.
replied to this above
No you didnt kai try again.
Two of those videos you displayed are ashkenazi mongoloid khazars by your own definition Ghaith
Yup only of them is a Zionist to.
In muhammads book quran it was muslims, christians, magi, zoroastrians THEN THE JEWS
Can you show me this claim? Also didnt you watch the videos i posted?
So Russian Rabbis are Dhimmis?
but not to them??? How so Ghaith
They think the are some kind of choosen people Kai.
Source this please -you know jews dont believe this .
Im sorry 1 of the prophets was suppose to be Elijah. Source: John 1:21
One who proclaims yos- as well as one that proclaims gods wrath or predictions
Didnt Muhammad do this? His prophecies beats on of the biblical ones.
followers to prostate towards jerusalem for five years
I didnt expect something like this from you Kai. Muhammad did this to remove the attached love Muslims had for the Paganism, after 5 years they could then turn back to the Kaba that Prophet Ibrahim build and inshallah Archelogical evidenc ewill one day prove this Kai, what excuse will you have then?
Why do you consider yourself not devout? f i may ask-
Ofcourse you mak ask Kai, you may ask anything. To give you answer i want you to give me your definition of a devout muslim.
That is well documented Ghaith
No it not well documented Kai. A Fox News report is not well documented Kai.
Anwar Al Awlaki was a historian america didnt like him exposing them so they called him an Al Qaeda member announced his deaht 4 or 5 times than they killed him Illegaly in Yemen and 2 weeks later his 15 year old Son this is your goverment Kai this is why i dont like it.
Have you heard any of his lectures Kai? They are quiet good.
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest
Who is online
In total there is 1 user online :: 0 registered, 0 hidden and 1 guest (based on users active over the past 5 minutes) Most users ever online was 135 on Mon Dec 06, 2010 7:37 pm
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest
many of them dont see how its relevant in their day to day lives, but they dont realize how it makes them look so stupid- but i can guarantee you im not like that
hitler was a narcisist of the first order- you only like hitler because of what he did to jews and gypsies etc...
at the Christians. Sam Shamoun was there also witnessing his master(William not to be confused with his other master Paul and Constantine) being destroyed. 
