Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

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marduk
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Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

Post by marduk »

hate speech
noun
noun: hate speech

abusive or threatening speech or writing that expresses prejudice against a particular group, especially on the basis of race, religion, or sexual orientation.
Leviticus 20:13 New Living Translation (NLT)

13 “If a man practices homosexuality, having sex with another man as with a woman, both men have committed a detestable act. They must both be put to death, for they are guilty of a capital offense.
Clearly a textbook example of hate speech, could not be more blatant. Abraham's private god called gay sex "detestable", meaning hate-able, then he actually said that they must be put to death, not even optional, MUST. Would Leviticus actually inspire people to hate and kill gay men? I don't know, maybe ask one of the ones who got thrown off the top of buildings in Arabia. One would have to ask how putting them to death would help anything, because there's no explanation provided by Abe-god. Seems unlikely that gay men would reproduce, so how is it a danger to society or the species?

No, Abe-god is just a hateful bastard, that's all, a common bigot. He also incies hatred and violence against those who chose a different religion or are just a different race or ethnicity, anyone who isn't part of Abe's family in fact. It's really amazing that the Bible isn't universally condemned as gross bigotry. The weirded part is that a bunch of people who are NOT in Abe's family voluntarily decided to try worshiping the Bigot-god just in case there's a slight chance that it might make an exception and let a non Abe family member avoid eternal torture for the sin of not being born into Abe's family.

sum
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Re: Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

Post by sum »

Hello marduk

Are the teachings of Jesus hate speech?

sum

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marduk
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Re: Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

Post by marduk »

sum wrote:Hello marduk

Are the teachings of Jesus hate speech?

sum
I'm afraid so, yes, Jesus was a bigot. It's right there in Matthew 15, the story of the Canaanite woman. Jesus would rather help the devil than a Canaanite, that's how bigoted he was. He actually called non-Jews "dogs". He also mentioned that he "came only for the lost sheep of Israel", meaning descendants of Jacob/Israel. If you're not in that particular family then you would be wasting your time with Jesus.

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Re: Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

Post by sum »

Hello marduk

Are there any religions beyond criticism?

sum

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marduk
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Re: Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

Post by marduk »

No, if something is a "religion" then it means humans are doing something in hope of gaining benefit from a non-physical entity. That's selfish and selfishness leads to bad outcomes. Just accept the fact that you have no supernatural helpers in life, you have to just hope for good weather and bountiful crops, not pray for them or make sacrifices to entice some entity to influence the weather. I don't deny that there are non-physical entities in the universe, there's apparently at least one "being of light" which people encounter at death, I just don't think there's anything we can do to persuade it to influence the course of reality in our favor or that it wants to be worshiped like an ancient god, and certainly has no interest in sacrifices or offerings. No world religion ever described the light entity, just crude human-like beings subject to all kinds of human flaws, like YHVH being "jealous" of other gods and prone to hatred of gays, idolators and anyone who doesn't follow his never ending list of dictates, in addition to being a murderous psychopath who would kill numerous first-born Egyptians rather than one pharaoh, for no logical reason.

sum
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Re: Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

Post by sum »

Hello marduk

Your quote -
I don't deny that there are non-physical entities in the universe, there's apparently at least one "being of light" which people encounter at death,

The phenomenon of "light" at the point of death is more likely to be the release of endorphins than from "non-physical" entities. It would be difficult to explain the reason or purpose of a "non-physical" entity only appearing at the point of death and so seeming to have no obvious influence on the person during their lifetime. As far as I am aware no-one has had any proven contact with "non-physical" entities - light, yes but no animated entities..

sum

antineoETC
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Re: Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

Post by antineoETC »

Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

Hre's an idea for an experiment. Put these words on a placard and hold it up outside a major christian place of worship like St Paul's cathedral in London. You might get a few supportive or negative comments from passers by. Then change the word "Bible" to the name of another religious text (you know what I mean) and hold it up outside the same christian place of worship. See how long it takes for an irate church official to shoo you off or, if that doesn't happen, for the police to turn up and arrest you for "racism".
It is in the nature of wasp nests that some of their inhabitants are bound to sting someone. The closer you are to are to a wasp nest the more likely you are to get stung, sometimes fatally. Who would encourage wasps to establish a nest in their house?

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Re: Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

Post by Nosuperstition »

I have been told that the real reason or the deeper meaning behind being against h****,is that while the cleaning process through the vagina is natural in heterosexual women during their periods,that is not the case with these people.Hence they are more susceptible to diseases than the heterosexuals.Hence they are more burdensome for the society and this rule was devised to get rid of them by branding them as criminals.Is that true?
palli or halli in Dravidian languages means a village just like gaav in Aryan languages means a village.palli or halli in Aryan Mauryan Imperial era around 200 B.C designates a tribal hamlet.So many of those in South India are indeed descendants of tribals and are still keeping up that heritage.

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marduk
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Re: Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

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sum wrote:Hello marduk

Your quote -
I don't deny that there are non-physical entities in the universe, there's apparently at least one "being of light" which people encounter at death,

The phenomenon of "light" at the point of death is more likely to be the release of endorphins than from "non-physical" entities. It would be difficult to explain the reason or purpose of a "non-physical" entity only appearing at the point of death and so seeming to have no obvious influence on the person during their lifetime. As far as I am aware no-one has had any proven contact with "non-physical" entities - light, yes but no animated entities..

sum
It's too realistic to be from endorphins, and it has the same things being said to completely different people all over the world. How could different peoples' brains think of saying the exact same phrase "it's not your time, you must go back"? You have to be good at judging cases based on available evidence. Just go to nderf.org and read some of the accounts. You'll see that it's very unlikely that it could be the brain producing it. Apparently it will make itself look like well know religious figures sometimes, just to go along with the person's beliefs so they'll feel more comfortable. Sometimes they'll look like a typical depiction of Jesus, which proves that it's an artificial form, because Jesus was just some random guy who started a religious cult, a very bigoted one apparently, judging from Matthew 15.

peterpin

Re: Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

Post by peterpin »

You have not even read Matthew 15. Go on, have a look at it. What do you find there?

1) Jesus having debates with various religious authority figures. Each time he condemns them for lack of understanding, lack of faith and for being hypocrites.
2) after that, there is this non-Jewish woman asking Jesus for help with what we would call the mental illness of her daughter. He points out her non-Jewishness, mimicking the rude response she would get from the people he just debated with. This is not the main point of the text, the actual point is what comes next:
3) The woman persists and shows faith in Jesus, determination and humility. She is the opposite of all the characters Jesus talked to before in the chapter. Then Jesus GRANT what she asked for. in the whole chapter this one woman is the ONLY ONE who got anything from Jesus.
4) Why the initial rude response from Jesus? Without it, how could the main point become clear?

The message is non "non-Jews are dogs" as you say, the message is "Faith opens doors."

Take that message or not, but don't twist the text to suit your wishes. Leave that to the Muslims. There is no general command in ANY biblical text that non-Jews or non-Christians should be killed or harmed. There quite a few descriptions of violence. though.

sum
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Re: Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

Post by sum »

Hello marduk

There is no proof either way and so we are back to belief which is often linked to what we want to believe.

sum

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Re: Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

Post by marduk »

peterpin wrote:You have not even read Matthew 15. Go on, have a look at it. What do you find there?

1) Jesus having debates with various religious authority figures. Each time he condemns them for lack of understanding, lack of faith and for being hypocrites.
2) after that, there is this non-Jewish woman asking Jesus for help with what we would call the mental illness of her daughter. He points out her non-Jewishness, mimicking the rude response she would get from the people he just debated with. This is not the main point of the text, the actual point is what comes next:
3) The woman persists and shows faith in Jesus, determination and humility. She is the opposite of all the characters Jesus talked to before in the chapter. Then Jesus GRANT what she asked for. in the whole chapter this one woman is the ONLY ONE who got anything from Jesus.
4) Why the initial rude response from Jesus? Without it, how could the main point become clear?

The message is non "non-Jews are dogs" as you say, the message is "Faith opens doors."

Take that message or not, but don't twist the text to suit your wishes. Leave that to the Muslims. There is no general command in ANY biblical text that non-Jews or non-Christians should be killed or harmed. There quite a few descriptions of violence. though.
Okay but what about "I came only for the lost sheep of Israel"? There's not really any alternative meaning for that, is there? We know who Israel was, the person Jacob, his lost sheep would presumably be Jews gone off the path of YHVH. So how does that apply to white Europeans, for example, or let's say Asians? Asians are definitely not related to Jacob/Israel or anyone who ever lived in the place called Israel, so apparently they would be wasting their time with Christianity.

About whether the Bible ever commands killing, how about this right here? Sure looks like YHVH ordering killings. Maybe I'm misinterpreting it though. Please explain the hidden meaning within this, because on the face of it, you would think YHVH was a gay hater and also would have people killed for marrying the wrong people or having sex with animals. Weird thing is, he wants humans to do the killing instead of him just killing them with his God powers. Why does he always order humans to do the actual killing? It's almost like it's not even a real entity but just some evil priests pretending to speak for a god and using that pretext to get the gullible to do some killing of people THEY don't personally like, because they're very hateful and judgmental people. Obviously the real Creator would not order people to kill other people, it's stupid. Then those people who did his bidding were guilty of murder themselves, so it's a vicious circle of sin.
Leviticus 20:

13 “‘If a man has sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They are to be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.

14 “‘If a man marries both a woman and her mother, it is wicked. Both he and they must be burned in the fire, so that no wickedness will be among you.

15 “‘If a man has sexual relations with an animal, he is to be put to death, and you must kill the animal.

16 “‘If a woman approaches an animal to have sexual relations with it, kill both the woman and the animal. They are to be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.
YHVH also ordered every man, woman, child and even animal in Jericho murdered. Explain how that's reasonable.

peterpin

Re: Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

Post by peterpin »

All you say has been discussed before.

I will pick up up your points though.
So how does that apply to white Europeans, for example, or let's say Asians? Asians are definitely not related to Jacob/Israel or anyone who ever lived in the place called Israel, so apparently they would be wasting their time with Christianity.
Like that woman, in the story you mention? It is not you blood or your ancestry that makes all the difference, but the way you act, the way you approach things. That is what it means. Despite of NOT being a Jew, she received what she asked for, and all the others only received reproaches.

About whether the Bible ever commands killing, how about this right here? Sure looks like YHVH ordering killings
This also came up dozens of times. YHVH ordered this? Did he write this? The clue is in the title: "LEVITICUS". These are words by a LEVITE, a temple priest. He had a thing about ritual purity and about not doing anything "heathen". Do you know some of the the other things he also condemns in the the same way? Eating prawns, wearing you heard in certain ways, wearing clothing from more than one fabric.
Does the state of Israel implement all these rules? In fact, you will have trouble finding
ANY
legal convictions based on these writings in the last 3000 years. He wrote not a "law" but more a religious text, telling people what to stay away from. The "penalty" is theoretical, he means these acts in his view "deserve" it, because, as he repeatedly says, these act freak out God. Christians mostly ignore this stuff, except for the bible bashing homophobes who like this passage.

Hate speech is trying to get others to harm people on your behalf. Is that what you think he is doing? Purposefully? He tried to herd people towards the standards of purity as he saw it, a very long time ago. So give the guy a break, he is long dead. BTW, he also said some quite good stuff.

YHVH also ordered every man, woman, child and even animal in Jericho murdered. Explain how that's reasonable.
No he did not. I doubt God ever ordered any acts of war. What we read is an INTERPRETATION of a writer of events that may or may not have happened as he told them. The God involvement was his belief, and you can agree with his on that as you want.

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Re: Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

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peterpin wrote:All you say has been discussed before.

YHVH also ordered every man, woman, child and even animal in Jericho murdered. Explain how that's reasonable.
No he did not. I doubt God ever ordered any acts of war. What we read is an INTERPRETATION of a writer of events that may or may not have happened as he told them. The God involvement was his belief, and you can agree with his on that as you want.
So I can't discuss anything that has ever been discussed before? But about God ordering death or not, what makes you equate YHVH with God? He was just one deity of one people in the Middle East, why would you choose to believe that particular one of all of them is the real God? Wouldn't a more logical choice be Brahman, a much earlier and therefore more legitimate deity? Seems unlikely that God would wait around until Abraham's time and then just talk to that one guy and make an agreement to be his family deity. In fact, it would be insane. Why would the real God contract himself exclusively like that? But you actually hit on the explanation yourself when you blamed the priests for the death orders. Why stop there? Why not just admit that the priests could have, and almost certainly did, make it ALL up for personal motives? See, once you use the priest excuse to explain away the death orders, how do you tell which parts are from God and which are from the priests just making it up? With no way to know, you can't rely on ANYTHING in the Bible.

peterpin

Re: Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

Post by peterpin »

AAh.... So religion to you is ALL about conspiracies and deception?

I don't buy that. Religious authors are people like you and me. Maybe they feel they have a mission, something important to tell everybody. Sometimes, they do. Sometimes they got it wrong and write unhelpful stuff. We should not blame God for their shortcomings.

What it means that religious texts require WORK. They need to be studied, not merely "accepted as the word of God". You can find amazing things in the bible, but also quite a bit of stuff that is not worth our time. Not even Einstein said genius things all day every day. So why should the people writing long ago be different from you and me?

Why do I use "God"? For the reason you criticise me for: "God" is not specific to any one religion, but YHVH is. All humanity had religious thought, beliefs and teachings since the dawn of time. Even the Neanderthals. In every religion you can find some of those gems, those little sparks of wonder, but also a lot of other, less useful stuff. Some religious have more gems, some have more garbage. One particular is mostly garbage, but even there you can find bits and pieces. No, they are not all equal, but none is all perfect or all evil.

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Re: Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

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Oh, I thought you were a Yahwist. The only reason YHVH is widely equated with "God" is that he had the best publicity campaign. Nobody ever handed out free books about Osiris or Shamash or any off the others. There are lots of Hindu books but only in India, you don't see people on streets handing them out in the West. And yes, there are people dumb enough to believe whatever somebody hands them on the street, clearly. I don't even think the Entity of Light could be correctly called "God", because a god is something to be worshiped in hope of personal gain of some kind, either in this life or the next. YHVH worship was originally intended to produce good weather for crops, it's right there in the Jewish twice daily prayer called the shema. YHVH lays out the deal, good weather in exchange for agreeing to "love and serve" it, whatever that means. The deal was obviously a local thing, so YHVH was never the god of the entire world, nor did it claim to be. It was very explicit about being a privately contracted weather deity.

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Re: Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

Post by Nosuperstition »

marduk wrote:YHVH also ordered every man, woman, child and even animal in Jericho murdered. Explain how that's reasonable.
Now why do wars take place?Just as you explained in your previous post,for anyone killing the other's baby is better than killing his own.Now when all other avenues are closed ,you are left with no other option than to fight with your own.

For example , when Muslims monopolised the trade on the Indian oceans after replacing Hindus and occupying North India,land is all that the Hindus of South were left with.Now when the land-owning Nair caste brothers amongst Hindus of the same family fought amongst themselves over land inheritance and killed themselves,Muslim writers of that period wrote about them contemptuously and were appalled that the same practice is creeping into their families.

So if the ways of the Gentiles/the heathen/the kafirs along with Gentiles/kafirs/the heathen are to be totally destroyed,their race including their animals with whom they have bonds are to be totally destroyed.Else who knows,might be the animal spirits/animal instincts will enter them and make them behave the same way,the struggle for existence and survival of the fittest theory of Darwin notwithstanding.

But then the blood feud land disputes between royals of the same family who owned one or two acres of land even in medieval Europe were quite common.And that exactly is the reason why they went out to colonise the whole world.Other's babies and our babies logic at play.
palli or halli in Dravidian languages means a village just like gaav in Aryan languages means a village.palli or halli in Aryan Mauryan Imperial era around 200 B.C designates a tribal hamlet.So many of those in South India are indeed descendants of tribals and are still keeping up that heritage.

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Re: Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

Post by Nosuperstition »

Muslim writers wrote only about how blood thirsty,the Nairs were but never mention that there are Hindu castes in Tamil Nadu who do not own any land and who only subsist by hunting down rats and eating them in the lands of farmers.As they say,history is written by the victors by distorting it.
palli or halli in Dravidian languages means a village just like gaav in Aryan languages means a village.palli or halli in Aryan Mauryan Imperial era around 200 B.C designates a tribal hamlet.So many of those in South India are indeed descendants of tribals and are still keeping up that heritage.

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Re: Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

Post by Centaur »

you are trying to appeal to mosaic law that no one else follows and was only applicable to Jews of the bornze age.(not to say homosexuality is appreciated by God).
I don't get the point of a hindu coming to islamo critic forum and posting this drivel.

whats next posting all the caste, untouchables crap from Hindu texts on this forum?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bu5lTfmoV50

https://philosophy.lander.edu/oriental/caste.html
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Re: Bible Qualifies as Hate Speech

Post by antineoETC »

The fact is the Jews, collectively, have (on the whole) managed, for the most part, managed to abandon adherence to Old Testament legalism and its associated barbarities. Unlike the Muslims they have managed to create a modern (more or less) democratic state. This is probably because "Jew", like Arab, is primarily an ethnic identity - so you can have Jewish Christians, Jewish atheists, Jewish agnostics as you can have Arab versions of these things. By contrast the identity "Muslim" is ENTIRELY predicated on religious PRACTICE and adherence to the legalistic requirements of the Quran. Put another way a "non-practicing Muslim" (unless the non-practice Is undertaken for an Islamically acceptable reason like Taqiyya) is a contradiction in terms.
It is in the nature of wasp nests that some of their inhabitants are bound to sting someone. The closer you are to are to a wasp nest the more likely you are to get stung, sometimes fatally. Who would encourage wasps to establish a nest in their house?

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