I declare Islam to be false

Prove Islam is from God, why it is the 'One True Religion'.
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Eagle
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by Eagle »

skynightblaze wrote:If you look at the history then you will find that Allah send 1000 odd angels to help Muhammad in the battle but yet in the end 1000 super natural beings + 313 human beings could kill only 70 odd pagans
From there viewtopic.php?f=22&t=10956&p=168080#p168080" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Eagle wrote:The Muslims set to meet the polytheists with 313 fighters, 2 horses and 70 camels. In a vision to the prophet, Allah made the future adversaries of the Muslims look few in numbers because had He shown them as they truly were 8:43"you would certainly have become weak-hearted and you would have disputed about the matter". In that prophetic vision, the prophet saw what would occur at the battlefield, namely the fact that the ill-equiped and outnumbered Muslims will be assisted by angels whose number will be proportionate to the believers' degree of patience and God-consciousness, "pouring down" from Heaven, thousand after thousand in succession/murdifin exactly like an orderly army being sent section after section in waves 3:123-5,8:9. The number of angels was meant, not to answer a logistical necessity, but as a means of uplifting them psychologically and motivate them in the face of the overwhelming power they were about to face, and victory is ultimately from Allah alone Who could have exacted divine retribution on a nation of rejecters through other means as He amply did in the past, instead of having recourse to the angels or the believers as has been decreed with Muhammad and Moses 47:4,8:9"When you sought aid from your Lord, so He answered you: I will assist you with a thousand of the angels following one another. And Allah only gave it as a good news and that your hearts might be at ease thereby; and victory is only from Allah; surely Allah is Mighty, Wise". As the vision was communicated to the believers 3:123-4,8:10 it impacted them greatly by making them 8:12"firm" in their resolve which in turn had the effect of casting "terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve". Such terror was due to their instant psychological defeat at seeing those whom they knew were helpless and weak engage them with such ferocity and resolve, consequently seeing the believers 3:13"twice as many". When the parties firstly met, the Muslims who were convinced that the heavenly hosts were on their side saw the coalition of disbelievers as few despite clearly outnumbering them in manpower and equipment, and the disbelievers' first impression upon seeing the Muslims was their little number due to their physical appearance 8:44. This emboldenned both parties to engage in battle; the few Muslims and the angels on their sides against the large coalition of disbelievers with evil forces on their side whispering their suggestions to incite them further 8:48. It was so 8:44"in order that Allah might bring about a matter which was to be done" which was to make that battle a 8:41"day of distinction", making it a landmark and a criterion for the believers as well as the disbelievers and a concrete proof of the truthfulness of Muhammad's years of prophetic warnings.
The Muslim warriors and the unseen angels on their sides began to slay and capture the rejecters of faith, while the shaitan 8:48"turned upon his heels, and said: Surely I am clear of you, surely I see what you do not see, surely I fear Allah; and Allah is severe in requiting (evil)". 70 disbelievers were killed and 70 made prisoners. 8:54"In the manner of the people of Firon and those before them; they rejected the communications of their Lord, therefore We destroyed them on account of their faults and We drowned Firon's people, and they were all unjust".
Last edited by Eagle on Thu Nov 24, 2011 11:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Eagle
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by Eagle »

enceladus wrote:Another question - consider this verse -
“And of everything We have created pairs.” [Al-Qur’aan 51:49]
And old tune already properly explained to your predecessors and enemies of Faith
Eagle wrote:Verses such as 43:12,36:36,51:49 speaking of things being made "azwaj", often translated as "in pairs" may include but not always the meaning of the sexual pairs, as opposed to verses such as 30:21,16:72 speaking specifically of the opposite sexes where the Quran draws attention to the availability of mates (azwaj) males/females from among ourselves as a source of security, love and compassion.

In the context of creation, there are verses such as 92:3 that mention the creation of the sexual pairs by specifying both genders created; male (dhakar) and female (untha) and such verses do not make an absolute assertion that all things have been created that way -in opposite genders- or that all living things reproduce sexually. The Original Creator may create whatever He wills then modify His original creation as He pleases and deems fit 24:45,35:1. He may create without the mating of sexual pairs as with Jesus' case.

The primary meaning of zawj (plur.azwaaj) in the Quran, is completely alien to the sexual pairs 13:3,15:88,20:53,131,26:7,38:58,56:7-10 and denotes the kinds or types -some of them unkown to us 36:36- having common points, linked in a way or the other when used in the plural form. The use of azwaj in those verses emphasize several or all of the following realities; the concept of interconnection between all kinds created, the complementarity between all creation, as well as the polarities and opposites. The context of 43:12 for example has God saying how He made the earth a "resting place" for us, water coming down from the sky to allow life, ships (as evidence of man's own ingenuity utilizing the material put at his disposal by Allah) and cattle in order to allow us to move around. In 15:88 and others, the Quran tells the believers no to grieve or pay much attention to some kind (azwaj) of people -having in common their unbelief and hatred for Islam-. In 13:3 Allah says He made from all fruits Zawjayn Ithnayn ie 2 types from every kind of fruits and these types are described in the following verse as some of them excelling others because of the constitution of their respective tree (concept of opposites).

The more profound message of the verses speaking of the "azwaj" in creation is understood by their context, which is always that of divine justice and providing proof for the resurrection of the dead and judgement in the next life. The Quran is essentially saying that everything in this varied nature has a complement, without which it is incomplete. If such a thing is the case and that all things have a complement, then how can one deny that this world has its complement in the next life. In this world, the believers may suffer harm and hardship for adhering to the call of their morality, while the disbelievers profit. Such a reality can not always last, otherwise this world would be incomplete. Such verses also make the believers heed to their dependency and vulnerability and how Allah alone is independent, self-sufficient 35:15,6:14. Everything is in need of Allah, the Qayyum (Self-subsisting) standing by Himself, the Hayy (Everliving) and all the universe stands because of His eternal endurance, maintainance of life in each instant 2:255,3:2. The divine unity, self-sufficiency and uniqueness 112:4,42:11 in the midst of diversity, complementarity, and polarity amongst the various kinds in the universe that work in interconnection is a sign man asked to ponder upon 51:49"And of everything We have created azwaj (different kinds) that you may be mindful" 2:164,89:3"Consider the multiple and the One"
These verses speaking of things being made "azwaj" are accompanied by phrases as "there are signs in this for a people who understand" because only the most ungrateful and wicked are blind to the fact that we are creatures purposely interconnected, with constant needs, and that each of these needs are answered by One full of mercy to His creatures. The Quran repeatedly affirms the unavoidable appointment with the Creator as a consequence of His mercy to mankind 78:6-17,50:6-11.

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pr126
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by pr126 »

"enemies of Faith", Eagle?

How can faith have enemies? Faith is a state of mind, I am sure that if you have strong enough faith, it should be unshakable, it should be able to withstand any criticism or scrutiny, and shrug of any "enemies" perceived.

Another expression Muslims use is "enemies of Allah".
Isn't Allah strong enough to defend himself without the need of mere humans (Muslims) to do it for him by murder and destruction??
Is Allah so weak?

Muslims take any criticism or scrutiny against Islam as a personal insult.
That is because Islam is their identity, their whole self, and without it they are nothing. Islam is all they have.
They simply cannot exist without Islam. An attack on Islam is an attack on the self.

Not to mention if Muhammad is questioned, criticized, or disrespected.
Muslim get into a fit of rage and blood must flow to defend him.
(cult of personality)

The Quran is treated as an idol. Must not be desecrated or again, death and destruction is to follow.

A very insecure religion if only extreme violence and murder can defend it.
The only things Islam ever contributed to humanity is death, destruction, mayhem, plunder and slavery.
What a psychotic lot of primitives. Shame on you all.
.
Islam: an idea to kill and die for.

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SAM
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by SAM »

skynightblaze wrote:
Sam wrote:A force of 313 persons was raised, and they marched to Badr some eighty miles from Madina.
This story is not fake Movie MARCH 313..
If you look at the history then you will find that Allah send 1000 odd angels to help Muhammad in the battle but yet in the end 1000 super natural beings + 313 human beings could kill only 70 odd pagans :lol: Surely Allah is all powerful and he really send those angels :D and that is why even super natural beings could not defeat the pagans.
Bro Eagle have already briefly explained it to you. ... especially

"And Allah only gave it as a good news and that your hearts might be at ease thereby; and victory is only from Allah; surely Allah is Mighty, Wise".

This verse has special meaning to 1000 angels accompanying the Muslims during the Battle of Badr... :whistling:
Never will the Jews or the Christians be satisfied with thee unless thou follow their form of religion.
Say: "The Guidance of Allah,-that is the (only) Guidance."
(2:120)

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SAM
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by SAM »

iffo wrote:@SAM
Robbery is robbery SAM no matter how you put it. Is a criminal act in which both Muhammad and Allah were involved.
Prophets are suppose to set good examples not horrible examples. And yes there is always economics behind theft and robbery my friend. :)
See the affect of muhammad on you SAM you are justifying robbery next you will justify murder and rape.
If your mind is already clouded all these "robbery is robbery, murder is murder, bandit is bandit, murder is muderer, rape is rape etc ..there's nothing much left to say...it's up to you.

Don't you understand what I mean when I say right can make a wrong and wrong can make a right or in other words what's right will be wrong and what's wrong will be right..

You still can't clarify the confused, certainly the pinnacle of literary achievement in your mind..

I'd like to wish you a happy new life, new life in :?: :clueless:
Never will the Jews or the Christians be satisfied with thee unless thou follow their form of religion.
Say: "The Guidance of Allah,-that is the (only) Guidance."
(2:120)

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SAM
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by SAM »

sum wrote:Hello SAM

Your quote -
When the Muslims reached Badr they found that the caravan of the Quraish had already crossed the danger point, and could no longer be ambushed.

Muhammad`s intention was to ambush the caravan but in the event he could not. The fact that he could not now ambush the caravan is not the point, is it? The point is that he intended to ambush the caravan.

Muhammad was nothing more than a psychopathic warlord.

Do you support all that Muhammad did?

sum
Yup!..Why not...If I were among those 313 companions took part in the Battle of Badr.
Muslims will always cherish (me) The Battle of Badr history till the Day of Judgment... :D

Image

Hello sum...you ask a stupid question and you'll get a stupid answer.. :roflmao:
Never will the Jews or the Christians be satisfied with thee unless thou follow their form of religion.
Say: "The Guidance of Allah,-that is the (only) Guidance."
(2:120)

Ram
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by Ram »

SAM wrote:
iffo wrote:@SAM
Robbery is robbery SAM no matter how you put it. Is a criminal act in which both Muhammad and Allah were involved.
Prophets are suppose to set good examples not horrible examples. And yes there is always economics behind theft and robbery my friend. :)
See the affect of muhammad on you SAM you are justifying robbery next you will justify murder and rape.
If your mind is already clouded all these "robbery is robbery, murder is murder, bandit is bandit, murder is muderer, rape is rape etc ..there's nothing much left to say...it's up to you.

Don't you understand what I mean when I say right can make a wrong and wrong can make a right or in other words what's right will be wrong and what's wrong will be right..

You still can't clarify the confused, certainly the pinnacle of literary achievement in your mind..

I'd like to wish you a happy new life, new life in :?: :clueless:
For Muslims, everything done in the name of Islam is right. For Muslims pedophila is right because Muhammad had sex with a 9 year old little Ayesha. For Muslims murder is right if it is done to defend the honour of Muhammad. For a Muslim, it is alright to kill girls to save the family "honour". This is how wrong becomes right in the mind of Mr. SAM.

Right becomes wrong if a non-Muslim wants the right to practice his religion freely or a woman wants the freedom to asset her rights.
वासुदैव कुटुम्बकम्।
سارا سنسار ایک پریوار ہے۔
The Whole World is a Family.

Ram
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by Ram »

sam wrote:ello sum...you ask a stupid question and you'll get a stupid answer...
Why do we always get stupid answers from Mr. SAM?
Last edited by Ram on Thu Nov 24, 2011 10:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
वासुदैव कुटुम्बकम्।
سارا سنسار ایک پریوار ہے۔
The Whole World is a Family.

sum
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by sum »

Hello SAM

You said that you supported what Muhammad did at Badr. Are you really telling us that you agree that it was morally correct and acceptable for Muhammad to attempt an ambush on a merchant caravan with the intention of fighting and probably killing those who resisted while he looted the goods? Is this your sense of morality? If it is, then you are one disturbed person.

sum

iffo
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by iffo »

SAM wrote:
iffo wrote:@SAM
Robbery is robbery SAM no matter how you put it. Is a criminal act in which both Muhammad and Allah were involved.
Prophets are suppose to set good examples not horrible examples. And yes there is always economics behind theft and robbery my friend. :)
See the affect of muhammad on you SAM you are justifying robbery next you will justify murder and rape.
If your mind is already clouded all these "robbery is robbery, murder is murder, bandit is bandit, murder is muderer, rape is rape etc ..there's nothing much left to say...it's up to you.

Don't you understand what I mean when I say right can make a wrong and wrong can make a right or in other words what's right will be wrong and what's wrong will be right..

You still can't clarify the confused, certainly the pinnacle of literary achievement in your mind..

I'd like to wish you a happy new life, new life in :?: :clueless:
.... Edited
Last edited by iffo on Fri Nov 25, 2011 12:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

iffo
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by iffo »

SAM wrote:
iffo wrote:@SAM
Robbery is robbery SAM no matter how you put it. Is a criminal act in which both Muhammad and Allah were involved.
Prophets are suppose to set good examples not horrible examples. And yes there is always economics behind theft and robbery my friend. :)
See the affect of muhammad on you SAM you are justifying robbery next you will justify murder and rape.
If your mind is already clouded all these "robbery is robbery, murder is murder, bandit is bandit, murder is muderer, rape is rape etc ..there's nothing much left to say...it's up to you.

Don't you understand what I mean when I say right can make a wrong and wrong can make a right or in other words what's right will be wrong and what's wrong will be right..

You still can't clarify the confused, certainly the pinnacle of literary achievement in your mind..

I'd like to wish you a happy new life, new life in :?: :clueless:
If SAM can justify ambush on trade caravans he can justify even terrorism.
People driving those caravans are innocent. If they die in the ambush who is responsible for their death. Why should they and their families suffer.

There is not a single bad thing out there which people like Sam will not defend as long as Muhammad did it .

Ambush, assassination , attacking other tribes, forced sex, sex with child they are ok with everything, and they don't even feel shame. No wonder Muslims have no future and no present

Yohan
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by Yohan »

iffo wrote: No wonder Muslims have no future and no present
iffo, When did you start turning against Islam? You were a big defender of Islam, just recently. What made you to make this about face change?

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marduk
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by marduk »

The body count was so low because the Meccans just ran away when the Muslims charged them. That's what it says in the Wiki Battle of Badr page. They hadn't even started fighting and the Meccans just chickened out and ran. That's why the Muslims won, not because of angelic intervention. Then the Muslims made it out to be a glorious battle, like the Alamo or something. The Muslims had camels and the Meccans didn't. The camels were charged at them and they took off, simple as that. So you might say that the Battle of Badr was won by camels.

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enceladus
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by enceladus »

SAM wrote: Don't you understand what I mean when I say right can make a wrong and wrong can make a right or in other words what's right will be wrong and what's wrong will be right..


Ahh. "Right can make a wrong, and wrong can make a right."
And also - I suppose - black can be white, and 2 + 2 can be 7.

Sheesh. What a mishmash of stuff! I feel sorry for you, SAM, I really do.

Caught up in the belief that "if Mohammad did it, it must be "right". Never mind about any objective measure of right or wrong - the killing of completely innocent people, for example, just because they weren't Muslim.

It seems that if you're Muslim, you can justify absolutely ANYTHING - no matter how evil, no matter how much pain or suffering it causes.

"Oh, it was done by Muslims, so it must be "right"..... "

A question for you - do you believe that there can be a completely universal definition of "right" and wrong"? Let me give an example for "wrong" (it's easier).

"Wrong" - The killing of innocent people who are not harming anyone else and are going about their daily business.

Do you believe in that definition of "wrong"?
- enceladus

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StrongLove
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by StrongLove »

What kind of god has inferior morality to the average person? Once again this is willful ignorance on the part of muslims.
" The fact that in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property - either as a child, a wife, or a concubine - must delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among men."

Winston Churchill

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marduk
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by marduk »

I think Muslims all know very well how evil Islam is, they just want to be part of something which is blatantly evil because they think it makes them cool. Oh look at me, I'm with the Muslims, I'm a badass now, I keel you. It's just one of the things that pathetic people who don't fit in with normal society do.

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skynightblaze
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by skynightblaze »

deleted
Last edited by skynightblaze on Fri Nov 25, 2011 5:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
Look around yourself and you'll find people with virtues are never required to demand respect since they automatically earn it. It is only those that are devoid of any virtues need to threaten and bully to gain respect. Needless to say that quran cannot be from God.

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SAM
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by SAM »

I see ....Why can't some of you understand something so simple?

Right can make a Wrong and Wrong can make a Right...or

What's Right will be Wrong and What's Wrong will be Right..

:roflmao:
Never will the Jews or the Christians be satisfied with thee unless thou follow their form of religion.
Say: "The Guidance of Allah,-that is the (only) Guidance."
(2:120)

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SAM
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by SAM »

skynightblaze wrote: ?????
deleted
Last edited by SAM on Fri Nov 25, 2011 5:25 am, edited 2 times in total.
Never will the Jews or the Christians be satisfied with thee unless thou follow their form of religion.
Say: "The Guidance of Allah,-that is the (only) Guidance."
(2:120)

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SAM
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Re: I declare Islam to be false

Post by SAM »

Ram wrote:
SAM wrote:
iffo wrote:@SAM
Robbery is robbery SAM no matter how you put it. Is a criminal act in which both Muhammad and Allah were involved.
Prophets are suppose to set good examples not horrible examples. And yes there is always economics behind theft and robbery my friend. :)
See the affect of muhammad on you SAM you are justifying robbery next you will justify murder and rape.
If your mind is already clouded all these "robbery is robbery, murder is murder, bandit is bandit, murder is muderer, rape is rape etc ..there's nothing much left to say...it's up to you.

Don't you understand what I mean when I say right can make a wrong and wrong can make a right or in other words what's right will be wrong and what's wrong will be right..

You still can't clarify the confused, certainly the pinnacle of literary achievement in your mind..

I'd like to wish you a happy new life, new life in :?: :clueless:
For Muslims, everything done in the name of Islam is right. For Muslims pedophila is right because Muhammad had sex with a 9 year old little Ayesha. For Muslims murder is right if it is done to defend the honour of Muhammad. For a Muslim, it is alright to kill girls to save the family "honour". This is how wrong becomes right in the mind of Mr. SAM.

Right becomes wrong if a non-Muslim wants the right to practice his religion freely or a woman wants the freedom to asset her rights.
Do you remember what you said …I want to make Islam disappear from the face of the earth...

All religions are myths, including Islam. It is myths which sustain a religion. Without myths Islam would have been long dead. Once the myths of Islam are busted, which is being achieved by FFI, Islam will be dead. Jesus Christ is the Son of God - one more myth. The stories of creation in the Quran and the Bible are myths.


You are Fundamentalist Hindu...

"Increasing intolerance among the Hindu fundamentalist organizations, which pose a grave threat to democracy, are an indication of the rise of fascist forces in India," said politics professor M. Mohanty of Delhi University.

India has a long history of violence between the Hindu majority and Muslims. Recently, Christians also have been targeted.

The New Delhi-based United Christian Forum for Human Rights has documented more than 120 attacks against Christian individuals, churches, and schools, allegedly by Hindu fundamentalists, in the past year. Half of the incidents have occurred in Gujarat.

http://indianterrorism.bravepages.com/h ... mismup.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Never will the Jews or the Christians be satisfied with thee unless thou follow their form of religion.
Say: "The Guidance of Allah,-that is the (only) Guidance."
(2:120)

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