What was the Criterion/Furkan? -Sura 25

Shari'a, errancies, miracles and science
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The Cat
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What was the Criterion/Furkan? -Sura 25

Post by The Cat »

The Criterion/Furkan
The whole sura 25 is named Criterion (Furkan) and many more ayats (2.53; 21.48; 37.117) use this name.
It it said that this was once considered to be Quran's initial name, along with Mushaf, which is Ethiopian.
Now, Furkan is Aramaic (Furkuan) for Redemption. The Quran suggests it was given to Moses (2.53) and
adds that is was a compilation of rights and wrongs (25.1; 21.48). Now, hasn't the Torah enough laws?

http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/quran/25/index.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
The Tafsir of Ibn Kathir tell us that in the opening verse: ''Allah praises Himself for the Koran'' !!! Deafening...
He goes on stating that: ''The verb Nazzala is a form which implies something done a great deal and often.''

So, what was this Criterion? The Talmud, Mishna, Tosefta, which aren't prescriptive for the Jews? In 21:48 the book is said
to be “light and a guide separating right and wrong.” In 37:117 it is described as “a Book giving clear information.” :ermm:

As a proper name in Arabic, Furkan means 'evidence'. Well, there's nothing that 'evident' to me about such a book...

The wording 'Mesaniy'
More so, it seems that the Koran wasn't the only book given to Muhammad, as the ayats 15.87 & 39.23 refer to a book
called 'Mesaniy', which is translated: ''We have given thee seven of the oft-repeated (verses) and the great Qur'an'' -15.87.
And in 39.23: ''Allah hath (now) revealed the fairest of statements, a Scripture consistent...'' Some Muslim scholars in their
translations of Koran substituted their interpretations for ‘mesaniy’ with the following description: “We have given you
seven of the pairs
”. At first impression, it might be referring to the seven Noachide commandments...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_Laws_of_Noah" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
The seven laws listed by the Tosefta and the Talmud are:
1. Prohibition of Idolatry: You shall not have any idols before God.
2. Prohibition of Murder: You shall not murder.
3. Prohibition of Theft: You shall not steal.
4. Prohibition of Sexual Promiscuity, including: adultery, incest, bestiality and homosexual acts.
5. Prohibition of Blasphemy: You shall not blaspheme God's name.
6. Dietary Law: Do not eat flesh taken from an animal while it is still alive. (Genesis 9:4)
7. Requirement to have just Laws: Set up a governing body of law (eg Courts)

The Noahide Laws comprise the six laws given to Adam in the Garden of Eden, and a seventh
(eating flesh from a living animal), which was added after the Flood of Noah.
Again, the tafsir of Ibn Khatir says about 39.23 that: ''Allah praised Himself for the Noble Quran''. :bow:

I stand confounded by such... 'wisdom'!
Authority has the same etymological root as authenticity.

Q
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Re: What was the Criterion/Furkan? -Sura 25

Post by Q »

FYI.

[Pooya/Ali Commentary ]

Furqan is that by which we can judge clearly between right and wrong and distinguish between the true and the false. The Quran (furqan) is the standing criterion for distinguishing between right and wrong.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[Pooya/Ali Commentary ]

The seven oft-repeated verses of al Fatihah sum up the whole teaching of the glorious Quran, and constitute the most precious gift to a Muslim.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

al Fatihah
Qur'an 1:1-7

بِسْمِ اللهِ الرَّحْمنِ الرَّحِيمِِ {1}
[Shakir 1:1] In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful.
[Yusufali 1:1] In the name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.
[Pickthal 1:1] In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful.

الْحَمْدُ للّهِ رَبِّ الْعَالَمِينَ {2}
[Shakir 1:2] All praise is due to Allah, the Lord of the Worlds.
[Yusufali 1:2] Praise be to Allah, the Cherisher and Sustainer of the worlds;
[Pickthal 1:2] Praise be to Allah, Lord of the Worlds,

الرَّحْمـنِ الرَّحِيمِ {3}
[Shakir 1:3] The Beneficent, the Merciful.
[Yusufali 1:3] Most Gracious, Most Merciful;
[Pickthal 1:3] The Beneficent, the Merciful.

مَالِكِ يَوْمِ الدِّينِ {4}
[Shakir 1:4] Master of the Day of Judgment.
[Yusufali 1:4] Master of the Day of Judgment.
[Pickthal 1:4] Master of the Day of Judgment,

إِيَّاكَ نَعْبُدُ وإِيَّاكَ نَسْتَعِينُ {5}
[Shakir 1:5] Thee do we serve and Thee do we beseech for help.
[Yusufali 1:5] Thee do we worship, and Thine aid we seek.
[Pickthal 1:5] Thee (alone) we worship; Thee (alone) we ask for help.

اهدِنَــــا الصِّرَاطَ المُستَقِيمَ {6}
[Shakir 1:6] Keep us on the right path.
[Yusufali 1:6] Show us the straight way,
[Pickthal 1:6] Show us the straight path,

صِرَاطَ الَّذِينَ أَنعَمتَ عَلَيهِمْ غَيرِ المَغضُوبِ عَلَيهِمْ وَلاَ الضَّالِّينَ {7}
[Shakir 1:7] The path of those upon whom Thou hast bestowed favors. Not (the path) of those upon whom Thy wrath is brought down, nor of those who go astray.
[Yusufali 1:7] The way of those on whom Thou hast bestowed Thy Grace, those whose (portion) is not wrath, and who go not astray.
[Pickthal 1:7] The path of those whom Thou hast favoured; Not the (path) of those who earn Thine anger nor of those who go astray.


*****

http://www.al-islam.org/quran/default.a ... ry=checked" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Ibn Rushd
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Re: What was the Criterion/Furkan? -Sura 25

Post by Ibn Rushd »

This sort of confirms what Mohnder Sfar was doing: the Qur'an says that there is a book in heaven, and the Qur'an is a suitable reading for churches that has a similar message to "the book". Each sura is to be viewed as its own book with laws and such, and there are more than one sura that made it into today's suras.

This is yet more internal evidence to prove it.
There is no Master but the Master, and QT-1 is his Prophet.

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The Cat
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Re: What was the Criterion/Furkan? -Sura 25

Post by The Cat »

Q wrote:FYI.[Pooya/Ali Commentary ]
Furqan is that by which we can judge clearly between right and wrong and distinguish between the true and the false. The Quran (furqan) is the standing criterion for distinguishing between right and wrong.
This rendition turns out flat by the 624 battle of Badr which was nicknamed: ''The Day of the Furkan'' (Redemption).
In 3.123-126: Is it not sufficient for you that your Lord should support you with three thousand angels sent down
(to your help)? ...Allah ordained this only as a message of good cheer for you
... Thus implying Allah's Salvation!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Badr" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
The idea of Badr as a furqan, an Islamic miracle, is mentioned again in the same surah, Qur'an: Al-i-Imran 3:13
The Aramaic original meaning of 'Redemption' (as a miracle) is underlined. Badr was certainly not over the book given to Moses!
Q wrote:[Pooya/Ali Commentary ]
The seven oft-repeated verses of al Fatihah sum up the whole teaching of the glorious Quran, and constitute the most precious gift to a Muslim.
Another circumvented conclusion since Fatihah is an Arabic borrowing from the Samaritan word Fatah (Gate, opening):
Amadti kamekha al fatah rahmeka, "I stand before Thee at the gate of Thy mercy." Fatah is the Fatiha, opening or gate."

I found more evidences that the term 'mesani' referred originally from the seven Noachide commandments:
http://www.wikinoah.org/index.php/Noahi ... the_Qur'an" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Islam inherited the tradition of 7 Mathaani from the Sabians. The word Mesani is translated as meaning "repetition"
Two verses in Qur'an refer to Al mesani / Al mesaniy: 15:87 and 39.23. Qur'an 39:23 makes it clear that there is a mesani /
mesaniy and Qur'an, and they are separate: ''Allah has revealed (from time to time) the most beautiful Message in the form
of a Book, consistent with itself, (yet) repeating (its teaching in various aspects): the skins of those who fear their Lord
tremble thereat; then their skins and their hearts do soften to the celebration of Allah's praises.
''

The main text makes it clear that something, a book or a text called mesaniy / mesani were given to Mohamed (pbuh).
15.87 And We have bestowed upon thee the Seven Oft-repeated (verses) and the Grand Qur'an.

Which implies that there were seven laws before the giving of the Qur'an. It is generally accepted that saban minel masani
(Seven Oft-repeated verses) and quranel azim (Grand Reading/Qur'an) must be two different things because they are separated
with conjunction waw. However many Islamic scholars are at a loss to defined what the Mesani is. The proposal that they are the
seven laws of Noah has been found acceptable by certain muslims who have studied the issue and not found to be theologically
problematic. In the Qur'an Noah is portrayed as prophet teaching against idolatry even before the flood.

The Qur'anic word "mesani" is the same word as the Hebrew word "mishna" (repetition), and probably derived from the hebrew.
Thus following the root MSN. Those seven Noachide commandments (in Koranic understanding) are given in 17.22-23 and 17.33-36!

Going further, the Criterions of 'Right and Wrong' (when a book) would be the (selective?) Commandments given to Moses.
Furkan would thus mean those written Commandments by which one obtains Redemption (from ignorance of Right & Wrong).

Both Furkan and Mesani can't possibly refer to the Quran, portraying Allah as worshiping Himself (according to Ibn Khatir)!
Authority has the same etymological root as authenticity.

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The Cat
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Re: What was the Criterion/Furkan? -Sura 25

Post by The Cat »

Ibn Rushd wrote:This sort of confirms what Mohnder Sfar was doing: the Qur'an says that there is a book in heaven, and the Qur'an is a suitable reading for churches that has a similar message to "the book". Each sura is to be viewed as its own book with laws and such, and there are more than one sura that made it into today's suras.

This is yet more internal evidence to prove it.
Would you please expand this view...
Authority has the same etymological root as authenticity.

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Ibn Rushd
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Re: What was the Criterion/Furkan? -Sura 25

Post by Ibn Rushd »

I am currently reading the book and will post a book review on the main site when finished, and hopefully our discussion can take off from there with some knowledge than "that's what I'm reading about".
There is no Master but the Master, and QT-1 is his Prophet.

Asimov's robot story "Reason"

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