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Bismillah

PostPosted: Thu Dec 31, 2015 11:31 pm
by Fernando
I'm slowly working through a pdf about the Umayyads and Mohammed provided by Ibn Rushd*. I'm puzzled by this:
A papyrus that is identified as PERF 558, bears another instance of the Arab timescale only a few years after its appearance on a coin." The document was signed off with the year 22 AH, which is 644 AD, double dated with the Christian timescale, and made out both in Arab and in Greek. It also contains the Bismillah (in the name of God) which is commonly believed to be evidence of Islam but constitutes a paradox by itself: the credo was not part of the original suras in the Koran. As the saying also leaves out the prophet, it only confirms that an unspecified group believed in one God.
(my emphasis.) Is this generally accepted? Surely if correct it represents tampering with the immutability of the Koran.
*see Resource Centre recently, for link leading to
http://ajdeus.org/Muhammad_and_the_Umayyads/489

Re: Bismillah

PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 12:16 am
by SAM
Bismillah hir-Rahman nir-Rahim already existed before the days of Pharaoh, Moses is not yet born.

That the entire Qur'an is contained in Surat Al-Fatiha ", while Al-Fatiha itself is contained in the Bismillah hir-Rahman nir-Rahim.

Re: Bismillah

PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 12:34 am
by Hombre
SAM wrote:Bismillah hir-Rahman nir-Rahim already existed before the days of Pharaoh, Moses is not yet born.

Before pharoe? That's some 1800 BCE. Every evidence they left, show that, they worshiped idols or the Sun. one of them was akhenaten.

Islam and practice of mentioning Bismillah (god will) was uttered only with Muhammad some 2400 years later.

Care to show some references where ancient Egypt were worshiping Allah?

Re: Bismillah

PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2016 7:24 pm
by Ibn Rushd
I haven't read those articles yet. :oops:

In my researches of the 19er sect, Rashad Khalifa, too, said that not all suras had them, and that sura 9 does not start with one, but has it in the middle (which funks up the numbers!).