Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

His life, his examples and his psychology
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SAM
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

Post by SAM »

The Prophet Like Unto Moses

After Abraham departed, God's promise to send the long-awaited Messenger was repeated this time in Moses' words.

In Deuteronomy 18:18, Moses spoke of the prophet to be sent by God who is:

From among the Israelite's "brethren", a reference to their Ishmaelite cousins as Ishmael was the other son of Abraham who was explicitly promised to become a "great nation".

A prophet like unto Moses. There were hardly any two prophets ,who were so much alike as Moses and Muhammad. Both were given comprehensive law code of life, both encountered their enemies and were victors in miraculous ways, both were accepted as prophets/statesmen and both migrated following conspiracies to assassinate them.

Analogies between Moses and Jesus overlooks not only the above similarities but other crucial ones as well (e.g. the natural birth, family life and death of Moses and Muhammad but not of Jesus, who was regarded by His followers as the Son of God and not exclusively a Messenger of God, as Moses and Muhammad were and as Muslim belief Jesus was).
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

Post by crazymonkie_ »

SAM wrote:From among the Israelite's "brethren", a reference to their Ishmaelite cousins as Ishmael was the other son of Abraham who was explicitly promised to become a "great nation".
Or from among the Israelites, which makes more sense, because Jacob was the one who got the covenant with god.

.... Oh right, corrupted scriptures. :roflmao:
A prophet like unto Moses. There were hardly any two prophets ,who were so much alike as Moses and Muhammad.
I agree. Both were mass-murdering leaders of freaky, fanatical cults. Both claimed that their laws were god's laws. They were very much alike.
Both were given comprehensive law code of life, both encountered their enemies and were victors in miraculous ways, both were accepted as prophets/statesmen and both migrated following conspiracies to assassinate them.
Precisely.
Analogies between Moses and Jesus overlooks not only the above similarities but other crucial ones as well (e.g. the natural birth, family life and death of Moses and Muhammad but not of Jesus, who was regarded by His followers as the Son of God and not exclusively a Messenger of God, as Moses and Muhammad were and as Muslim belief Jesus was).
No, Moses and Jesus were pretty dissimilar.
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

Post by ygalg »

SAM wrote:The Prophet Like Unto Moses

After Abraham departed, God's promise to send the long-awaited Messenger was repeated this time in Moses' words.

In Deuteronomy 18:18, Moses spoke of the prophet to be sent by God who is:

From among the Israelite's "brethren", a reference to their Ishmaelite cousins as Ishmael was the other son of Abraham who was explicitly promised to become a "great nation".

A prophet like unto Moses. There were hardly any two prophets ,who were so much alike as Moses and Muhammad. Both were given comprehensive law code of life, both encountered their enemies and were victors in miraculous ways, both were accepted as prophets/statesmen and both migrated following conspiracies to assassinate them.
18:15 verifying it is referred to a prophet among Israelites. pretending it is other than Israelites themselves it would be Esau and not Ishmael. as Esau is the brother to israel where Ishmael is the uncle to israel.
“a true believer as a person so fanatically committed to a cause that no amount of reality can make him abandon it” Eric Hoffer
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

Post by manfred »

SAM, have you ever asked youself WHY anyone would want to make some sort of comparison between Mohammed and Moses?

In comparing them, who is improving his image? Does Moses gain respectibility by this comparison, or does Mohammed? Do you think Moses would be flattered by such a comparison?

Ask Ygaig that, I would love to read his response...

Also, when it comes to understanding the Torah, who do you think you should ask? A Muslim? (I am a Christian, but I studied what we call the "Old Testament" with a rabbi, who also taught me Hebrew. In fact he was the best teacher I ever had....)

Who did MOHAMMED ask about the Torah? So, if you know the answer to that, why on earth would you think even for a second that there is even a spec of a hint of Mohammed in Deuteronomy? Do you really believe YOU understand the text better than all the learned rabbis through the ages?
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

Post by Chief Chingachgook »

SAM wrote:Analogies between Moses and Jesus overlooks not only the above similarities but other crucial ones as well (e.g. the natural birth, family life and death of Moses and Muhammad but not of Jesus, who was regarded by His followers as the Son of God and not exclusively a Messenger of God, as Moses and Muhammad were and as Muslim belief Jesus was).
But then we would ALL be like Moses SAM !!! We have families, we marry (and some of us marry and marry and marry and marry), we die .. No forget ordinary man like us, how about Hitler, Pol Pot, David Koresh, Rev Jim Jones, Rev Moon, Joseph Smith, Calvin, Baha'ullah etc. ? They all have similarities with Moses in that sense.

Yes, a great nation was promised to Ishmael but read on yonder :D what else was promised and fulfilled now? It says, "you are against us and we are against you" but you and your Ummah are cursed because you curse the Jews, right Ygalg? :D We kuffars are better off than you because we don't curse Joooosss, see that SAM?
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

Post by manfred »

SAM wrote:Analogies between Moses and Jesus overlooks not only the above similarities but other crucial ones as well (e.g. the natural birth, family life and death of Moses and Muhammad but not of Jesus, who was regarded by His followers as the Son of God and not exclusively a Messenger of God, as Moses and Muhammad were and as Muslim belief Jesus was).
Mohammad died a natural death??? :roflmao:

Not really... at least not according to Muslim sources: there is little doubt that he was poisoned. It's a case of having picked one sex-slave too many... Ironic that it was a Jewish woman,one of the people he abused, enslaved and murdered, that finally got the better of him. An enslaved and abused woman was the instrument of Mohammed's demise; perhaps it will be the enslaved and abused Muslim women who will finally bring about the end of Islam, too...
From Bukhari's Hadith 3.786:
Narrated Anas bin Malik: A Jewess brought a poisoned (cooked) sheep for the Prophet who ate from it. She was brought to the Prophet and he was asked, "Shall we kill her?" He said, "No." I continued to see the effect of the poison on the palate of the mouth of Allah's Apostle.

From Bukhari's Hadith 5.713:
Narrated 'Aisha: The Prophet in his ailment in which he died, used to say, "O
'Aisha! I still feel the pain caused by the food I ate at Khaibar, and at this
time, I feel as if my aorta is being cut from that poison."

From Sahih Muslim volume 3, # 5440

Aisha reported that when Allah’s Messenger fell ill, he recited over his body Mu’awwidhatan and blew over him and when his sickness was aggravated I used to recite over him and rub him with his hand with the hope that it was more blessed.

Ibn Sa'd page 322:
When the last moment of the prophet was near, he used to draw a sheet over his face; but when he felt uneasy, he removed it from his face and said: "Allah's damnation be on the Jews and the Christians who made the graves of their prophets objects of worship."

From Ibn Hisham page 682:

....that he heard Aisha [one of Muhammad's wives] say: "The apostle died in my bosom during my turn: [the night Muhammad was to spend sleeping with her] I had wronged none in regard to him. It was due to my ignorance and extreme youth that the apostle died in my arms."
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

Post by SAM »

manfred wrote: From Bukhari's Hadith 3.786:
Narrated Anas bin Malik: A Jewess brought a poisoned (cooked) sheep for the Prophet who ate from it. She was brought to the Prophet and he was asked, "Shall we kill her?" He said, "No." I continued to see the effect of the poison on the palate of the mouth of Allah's Apostle.

From Bukhari's Hadith 5.713:
Narrated 'Aisha: The Prophet in his ailment in which he died, used to say, "O
'Aisha! I still feel the pain caused by the food I ate at Khaibar, and at this
time, I feel as if my aorta is being cut from that poison."

From Sahih Muslim volume 3, # 5440

Aisha reported that when Allah’s Messenger fell ill, he recited over his body Mu’awwidhatan and blew over him and when his sickness was aggravated I used to recite over him and rub him with his hand with the hope that it was more blessed.

Ibn Sa'd page 322:
When the last moment of the prophet was near, he used to draw a sheet over his face; but when he felt uneasy, he removed it from his face and said: "Allah's damnation be on the Jews and the Christians who made the graves of their prophets objects of worship."

From Ibn Hisham page 682:

....that he heard Aisha [one of Muhammad's wives] say: "The apostle died in my bosom during my turn: [the night Muhammad was to spend sleeping with her] I had wronged none in regard to him. It was due to my ignorance and extreme youth that the apostle died in my arms."
Look at yourself “how bloody stupid you really are and tongue-twister twists tongues when you're not quite sure what does Hadith literally means? You don't know the facts and could not comprehend and explicit the meaning of the Hadith from its context? Or you have no valid point to make, isn’t it?”
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

Post by manfred »

SAM wrote:Look at yourself “how bloody stupid you really are and tongue-twister twists tongues when you're not quite sure what does Hadith literally means? You don't know the facts and could not comprehend and explicit the meaning of the Hadith from its context? Or you have no valid point to make, isn’t it?”
Are you talking to me or are you looking at yourself in the mirror?

Do you want to tell us the "facts"?

Why are you saying I have no point to make? Clearly you understood my point and you know it's true, it's just you don't like to hear it...

What exactly was the point of the personal rudeness and the general rant? Is it you don't like to be reminded of the ignominious end of your hero? Poisoned by a sex-slave, slobbering on the bare breasts of the child he abused. That is how Mohammed died. Pray you have a better death than that.
Last edited by manfred on Thu Jul 16, 2009 9:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

Post by Nosubmission »

Jesus was an Israelite whereas Muhammad was an Arab.

Jesus was a Jew (bound by the precepts of the Mosaic Law) whereas Muhammad was a pagan until his fabrication of a new law.

Conclusion: Jesus is more like Moses than Muhammad. The Qur'an never claims that Muhammad was more similar to Moses than Jesus. Actually, the Qur'an is unaware of the prophecy in Deuteronomy 18. Another instance of Islamic lies and absurdities. ;)
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

Post by ygalg »

SAM wrote: Look at yourself “how bloody stupid you really are and tongue-twister twists tongues when you're not quite sure what does Hadith literally means? You don't know the facts and could not comprehend and explicit the meaning of the Hadith from its context? Or you have no valid point to make, isn’t it?”
it means muhammad died from poison.
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

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Nosubmission wrote:Jesus was an Israelite whereas Muhammad was an Arab.

Jesus was a Jew (bound by the precepts of the Mosaic Law) whereas Muhammad was a pagan until his fabrication of a new law.

Conclusion: Jesus is more like Moses than Muhammad. The Qur'an never claims that Muhammad was more similar to Moses than Jesus. Actually, the Qur'an is unaware of the prophecy in Deuteronomy 18. Another instance of Islamic lies and absurdities. ;)
Precisely, nowhere in the Quran does Muhammad claim to be the "prophet like Moses" mentioned in Deuteronomy 18, let's look at what vs. 15 actually says from this very literal translation of the Hebrew:

{Deuteronomy 18:15} A prophet from your midst, from your brothers, like myself will YHWH your God raise up for you, to him you are to hearken, (The Five Books of Moses, Dr. Everett Fox)

Here are two criteria in the verse itself:

1) from your midst
2) from your brothers

The fact that Muhammad doesn't meet these 2 criteria as he was an Arab not a Hebrew, and arose in pagan Mecca, not in a Jewish community automatically disqualifies him as a possible fulfillment of this prophecy. Moses said "like myself", i.e. like Moses this prophet would be a Hebrew & like Moses he would arise among the Hebrews. Deedirt's reasoning that the Arabs qualify as brothers of the Hebrews via Ishmael attempts to make a mountain out of a molehill.

Actually Moses himself confirmed that Yeshua is this prophet by appearing with Elijah at Yeshua's transfiguration!
Last edited by Nazarene on Fri Jul 17, 2009 6:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

Post by manfred »

  • A prophet
  • from your midst,
  • from your brothers,
  • like myself
Mohammed does not fit on ALL 4 counts.
  • Mohammed was not a prophet, he was a profiteer, which is different.
  • Mohammed was not born or raised as a Jew, nor lived in Israel.
  • Mohammed was not a brother to the Jews, he was a butcher of the Jews. Ishmael as the ancestor of Arabs is a myth, at best Ishmael might have been in immigrant to Arab land, where Mohammed's ancestors already lived before Ishmael arrived.
  • To say that Mohammed was like Moses is deeply insulting to Moses. Mohammed invented a god to do his bidding, so that he could become rich. Moses did the bidding of the real God at great cost to himself, so that the Israelites were set free and guided by God.
Deuteronomy 18 does, however, have something to say that may very well relate to Mohammed, a bit further down the page:
Deuteronomy wrote:20 But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded him to say, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, must be put to death."

21 You may say to yourselves, "How can we know when a message has not been spoken by the LORD ?"

22 If what a prophet proclaims in the name of the LORD does not take place or come true, that is a message the LORD has not spoken. That prophet has spoken presumptuously. Do not be afraid of him.
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

Post by Muhammad bin Lyin »

The liars claim that "from among your brethren" means descendants of Ishmael since Ishmael was the brother of Isaac. This is no surprise as Muslims have consistently shown themselves to be habitual liars willing to twist anything if it will legitimize their illegitimate prophet. Most desperate people on the planet. So, does "brethren" refer to Ishmaelites? Well, i guess the best thing to do to find out is to find another verse which references the same word to see if it's meaning is clearer in that verse. We would need to look in the same book, by the same author, and preferably as close in proximity to 18:18 that we can find. And sure enough, we don't have to look very far at all and we find it a mere 20 or so verses before 18:18 in 17:15

15Thou shalt in any wise set him king over thee, whom the LORD thy God shall choose: one from among thy brethren shalt thou set king over thee: thou mayest not set a stranger over thee, which is not thy brother.

Now, it's obvious that God wasn't telling them to appoint their Kings from the descendants of Ishmael, especially considering that they were pagans at that time and would remain so for few thousand years. So that's undeniable. So the question is, why would the author clearly mean one group of people, Israelites, in 17:15 and then mean an entirely different group of people with the same exact phrase of "from among their brethren" only a mere 20 or so verses away without any explanation or qualification by the author telling us that he means someone totally different in 18:18 than he does in 17:15? Of course, the answer is that he didn't qualify because he didn't need to because he meant the same exact group of people in both instances. Therefore, it is conclusive that 18:18 is talking about fellow Israelites.

So where did this typical Muslim lie come from? One of their most famous modern liars, Ahmed Deedat. Now the worst part is that this man knew the Bible quite well and therefore he knew of 17:15, but he knowingly omits any mention of that because it ruins his lie. Therefore, this wasn't just an idea that Deedat had, it was a willful and purposeful attempt at lying, and he knew this. That's the most damning part. The amazing part is that not only are Muslims the biggest liars about their own religion, it's even worsse as they are also the biggest liars about other people's religion. Truly the most disgraceful, dishonorable people on the planet, but they don't care. Lie, cheat, whatever it takes, just as long as Islam is seen as prevailing. And then, they actually have the nerve to be upset about or confused about why everybody thinks they are patent liars. They always do it to themselves, all the others do is react.
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

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Well that's to be expected. After all it's the only religion that sanctifies lying in the form of the doctrine of Taqiya. Any god that allows and encourges this is not the true God but Satan who is the "deceiver" and the "father of lies".

{1 John 1:5} ...God is light and there is no darkness in Him at all.
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

Post by SAM »

THE AWAITED PROPHET WAS TO COME FROM ARABIA

Deuteronomy 33:1-2 combines references to Moses, Jesus and Muhammad. It speaks of God (i.e. God's revelation) coming from Sinai, rising from Seir and shining forth from Paran. According to Genesis 21:21, the wilderness of Paran was the place where Ishmael settled (i.e. Arabia, specifically Mecca).

Indeed the King James version of the Bible mentions the pilgrims passing through the valley of Ba'ca (another name of Mecca) in Psalms 84:4-6.

Isaiah 42:1-13 speaks of the beloved of God. His elect and messenger who will bring down a law to be awaited in the isles and who "shall not fail nor be discouraged till he have set judgement on earth."

Verse 11, connects that awaited one with the descendants of Ke'dar. Who is Ke'dar? According to Genesis 25:13, Ke'dar was the second son of Ishmael, the ancestor of prophet Muhammad.

MUHAMMAD'S MIGRATION FROM MECCA TO MEDINA:
PROPHECIED IN THE BIBLE?

Habakkuk 3:3 speaks of God (God's help) coming from Te'man (an Oasis North of Medina according to J. Hasting's Dictionary of the Bible), and the holy one (coming) from Paran. That holy one who under persecution migrated from Paran (Mecca) to be received enthusiastically in Medina was none but prophet Muhammad.

Indeed the incident of the migration of the prophet and his persecuted followers is vividly described in Isaiah 21:13-17. That section foretold as well about the battle of Badr in which the few ill-armed faithful miraculously defeated the "mighty" men of Ke'dar, who sought to destroy Islam and intimidate their own folks who turned -to Islam.

THE QUR'AN FORETOLD IN THE BIBLE?

For twenty-three years, God's words (the Qur'an) were truely put into Muhammad's mouth. He was not the "author" of the Qur'an. The Qur'an was dictated to him by Angel Gabriel who asked Muhammad to simply repeat the words of the Qur'an as he heard them. These words were then committed to memory and to writing by those who hear them during Muhammad's life time and under his supervision.

Was it a coincidence that the prophet "like unto Moses" from the "brethren" of the Israelites (i.e. from the lshmaelites) was also described as one in whose mouth God will put his words and that he will speak in the name of God, (Deuteronomy 18:18-20). Was it also a coincidence the "Paraclete" that Jesus foretold to come after Him was described as one who "shall not speak of himself, but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak (John 16:13)

Was it another coincidence that Isaiah ties between the messenger connected with Ke'dar and a new song (a scripture in a new language) to be sang unto the Lord (Isaiah 42:10-11). More explicitly, prophesies Isaiah "For with stammering lips, and another tongue, will he speak to this people" (Isaiah 28:11). This latter verse correctly describes the "stammering lips" of Prophet Muhammad reflecting the state of tension and concentration he went through at the time of revelation. Another related point is that the Qur'an was revealed in piece-meals over a span of twenty three years. It is interesting to compare this with Isaiah 28:10 whichspeaks of the same thing.

THAT PROPHET- PARACLETE- MUHAMMAD

Up to the time of Jesus (peace be upon him), the Israelites were still awaiting for that prophet like unto Moses prophecied in Deuteronomy 18:18. When John the Baptist came, they asked him if he was Christ and he said "no". They asked him if he was Elias and he said "no". Then, in apparent reference to Deuteronomy 18:18, they asked him "Art thou that Prophet" and he answered, "no". (John 1: 1 9-2 1).

In the Gospel according to John (Chapters 14, 15, 16) Jesus spoke of the "Paraclete" or comforter who will come after him, who will be sent by Father as another Paraclete, who will teach new things which the contemporaries of Jesus could not bear. While the Paraclete is described as the spirit of truth, (whose meaning resemble Muhammad's famous title Al-Amin, the trustworthy), he is identified in one verse as the Holy Ghost (John 14:26). Such a designation is however inconsistent with the profile of that Paraclete. In the words of the Dictionary of the Bible, (Ed. J. Mackenzie) "These items, it must be admitted do not give an entirely coherent picture."

Indeed history tells us that many early Christians understood the Paraclete to be a man and not a spirit. This might explain the followings who responded to some who claimed, without meeting the criteria stipulated by Jesus, to be the awaited "Paraclete".

It was Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) who was the Paraclete, Comforter, helper, admonisher sent by God after Jesus. He testified of Jesus, taught new things which could not be borne at Jesus' time, he spoke what he heard (revelation), he dwells with the believers (through his well-preserved teachings). Such teachings will remain forever because he was the last messenger of God, the only Universal Messenger to unite the whole of humanity under God and on the path of PRESERVED truth. He told of many things to come which "came to pass" in the minutest detail meeting, the criterion given by Moses to distinguish between the true prophet and the false prophets (Deuteronomy 18:22). He did reprove the world of sin, of righteousness and of judgment (John 16:8-11)

WAS THE SHIFT OF RELIGIOUS LEADERSHIP PROPHECIED?

Following the rejection of the last Israelite prophet, Jesus, it was about time that God's promise to make Ishmael a great nation be fulfilled (Genesis 21:13, 18)

In Matthew 21:19-21, Jesus spoke of the fruitless fig tree (A Biblical symbol of prophetic heritage) to be cleared after being given a last chance of three years (the duration of Jesus' ministry) to give fruit. In a later verse in the same chapter, Jesus said: "Therefore, say I unto you, The Kingdom of God shall be taken away from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruit thereof" (Matthew 21:43). That nation of Ishmael's descendants (the rejected stone in Matthew 21:42) which was victorious against all super-powers of its time as prophesied by Jesus: "And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken, but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder" (Matthew 21:44).

OUT OF CONTEXT COINCIDENCE?

Is it possible that the numerous prophecies cited here are all individually and combined out of context misinterpretations? Is the opposite true, that such infrequently studied verses fit together consistently and clearly point to the advent of the man who changed the course of human history, Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). Is it reasonable to conclude that all these prophecies, appearing in different books of the Bible and spoken by various prophets at different times were all coincidence? If this is so here is another strange "coincidence"!

One of the signs of the prophet to come from Paran (Mecca) is that he will come with "ten thousands of saints" (Deuteronomy 33:2 KJV). That was the number of faithful who accompanied Prophet Muhammad to Paran (Mecca) in his victorious, bloodless return to his birthplace to destroy the remaining symbols of idolatry in the Ka'bah.

Says God as quoted by Moses:
And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him. (Deuteronomy 18:19)

Source: Islamic Information Foundation
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

Post by Nosubmission »

SAM wrote:THE AWAITED PROPHET WAS TO COME FROM ARABIA

Deuteronomy 33:1-2 combines references to Moses, Jesus and Muhammad. It speaks of God (i.e. God's revelation) coming from Sinai, rising from Seir and shining forth from Paran. According to Genesis 21:21, the wilderness of Paran was the place where Ishmael settled (i.e. Arabia, specifically Mecca).

Indeed the King James version of the Bible mentions the pilgrims passing through the valley of Ba'ca (another name of Mecca) in Psalms 84:4-6.

Isaiah 42:1-13 speaks of the beloved of God. His elect and messenger who will bring down a law to be awaited in the isles and who "shall not fail nor be discouraged till he have set judgement on earth."

Verse 11, connects that awaited one with the descendants of Ke'dar. Who is Ke'dar? According to Genesis 25:13, Ke'dar was the second son of Ishmael, the ancestor of prophet Muhammad.
You are such a pathetic liar and idiotic Muslim believer indeed! LOL Someone must tell you that your peculiar interpretation of the Old Testament verses below is dependent on the ignorance of the context. When read in full, those verses clearly prove you a cheap liar and a shameless manipulator of the Bible.

However, there is an easier way of exposing your stupidity without trying to explain the context of the verses you quoted above. There is one single question you have to answer:

WHERE in the QUR'AN is there a reference to all these prophecies?

Please cite the Qur'an verse where the names Sinai, Seir, and Paran appear. Please let me know where your scripture identifies your Muhammad as a messenger coming from Paran? Where in the Qur'an is it written that ISRAELITE pilgrims passed by the valley of mecca?
SAM wrote: MUHAMMAD'S MIGRATION FROM MECCA TO MEDINA:
PROPHECIED IN THE BIBLE?

Habakkuk 3:3 speaks of God (God's help) coming from Te'man (an Oasis North of Medina according to J. Hasting's Dictionary of the Bible), and the holy one (coming) from Paran. That holy one who under persecution migrated from Paran (Mecca) to be received enthusiastically in Medina was none but prophet Muhammad.

Indeed the incident of the migration of the prophet and his persecuted followers is vividly described in Isaiah 21:13-17. That section foretold as well about the battle of Badr in which the few ill-armed faithful miraculously defeated the "mighty" men of Ke'dar, who sought to destroy Islam and intimidate their own folks who turned -to Islam.
Thanks for the laugh! Thanks also for letting us see that your idiotic Muslim fellows apparently perverted the text in Habakkuk by altering the word GOD to God's help! Habakkuk refers to the Theophany occurring inn Moses' time during the Israelites' wandering, you fools. LOL Your interpretation makes God equal to Muhammad! I love it when you stupid Muslims play with fire and burn your hands. :roflmao:
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

Post by Nosubmission »

SAM wrote: THE QUR'AN FORETOLD IN THE BIBLE?

For twenty-three years, God's words (the Qur'an) were truely put into Muhammad's mouth. He was not the "author" of the Qur'an. The Qur'an was dictated to him by Angel Gabriel who asked Muhammad to simply repeat the words of the Qur'an as he heard them. These words were then committed to memory and to writing by those who hear them during Muhammad's life time and under his supervision.
Pure speculations and legends with no hard evidence. Muhammad never had today's Qur'an in his hand as an entire book to authorize it. Let's skip this part that reveals Islam's weak points with regard to its scripture. LOL
SAM wrote: Was it a coincidence that the prophet "like unto Moses" from the "brethren" of the Israelites (i.e. from the lshmaelites) was also described as one in whose mouth God will put his words and that he will speak in the name of God, (Deuteronomy 18:18-20). Was it also a coincidence the "Paraclete" that Jesus foretold to come after Him was described as one who "shall not speak of himself, but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak (John 16:13)
First, the prophecy in Deuteronomy is NOT about Muhammad. This is because the verse clearly says that the prophet like Moses will come out of Israel, not from a pagan tribe in the desert:

The Lord your God will raise up for you a prophet like me from among you – from your brethren; you must listen to him (Deuteronomy 18:15)

The Qur'an says that Muhammad came for Mecca and its surrounding (Surah 42:7) Muhammad was born in Arabia and buried there. He did not preach in Israel in his life time. He CANNOT be the promised prophet.

SAM wrote: Was it another coincidence that Isaiah ties between the messenger connected with Ke'dar and a new song (a scripture in a new language) to be sang unto the Lord (Isaiah 42:10-11). More explicitly, prophesies Isaiah "For with stammering lips, and another tongue, will he speak to this people" (Isaiah 28:11). This latter verse correctly describes the "stammering lips" of Prophet Muhammad reflecting the state of tension and concentration he went through at the time of revelation. Another related point is that the Qur'an was revealed in piece-meals over a span of twenty three years. It is interesting to compare this with Isaiah 28:10 whichspeaks of the same thing.
Is it another coincidence that Muslims are so dishonest and stupid because they think they can fool people by distorting the Tanakh?

WHO or WHAT tells your idiotic Muslim fellows that Kedar means a scripture in a new language??? What a silly and baseless definition is this?

The personal pronoun in Isaiah 28:11 refers to GOD, not to a human messenger:

Who is the Lord trying to teach? To whom is he explaining a message? Those just weaned from milk! Those just taken from their mother’s breast! Indeed, they will hear meaningless gibberish, senseless babbling, a syllable here, a syllable there. For with mocking lips and a foreign tongue he will speak to these people. In the past he said to them, “This is where security can be found. Provide security for the one who is exhausted! This is where rest can be found.” But they refused to listen. So the Lord’s word to them will sound like meaningless gibberish, senseless babbling, a syllable here, a syllable there. As a result, they will fall on their backsides when they try to walk, and be injured, ensnared, and captured. (Isaiah 28:9-13)

Is it a coincidence that Muslims attribute to Muhammad whatever is ascribed to GOD in the Jewish Bible? Do they really believe and promote the doctrine that Muhammad is their ILAH? :D
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Nazarene
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

Post by Nazarene »

On a side note: what was so comforting about Muhammad? I couldn't think of a more inappropriate attribute for a person. Well I suppose he did put a lot of people "to rest". :roflmao:
Push b'shlama.
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

Post by Nosubmission »

SAM wrote: THAT PROPHET- PARACLETE- MUHAMMAD

Up to the time of Jesus (peace be upon him), the Israelites were still awaiting for that prophet like unto Moses prophecied in Deuteronomy 18:18. When John the Baptist came, they asked him if he was Christ and he said "no". They asked him if he was Elias and he said "no". Then, in apparent reference to Deuteronomy 18:18, they asked him "Art thou that Prophet" and he answered, "no". (John 1: 1 9-2 1).

In the Gospel according to John (Chapters 14, 15, 16) Jesus spoke of the "Paraclete" or comforter who will come after him, who will be sent by Father as another Paraclete, who will teach new things which the contemporaries of Jesus could not bear. While the Paraclete is described as the spirit of truth, (whose meaning resemble Muhammad's famous title Al-Amin, the trustworthy), he is identified in one verse as the Holy Ghost (John 14:26). Such a designation is however inconsistent with the profile of that Paraclete. In the words of the Dictionary of the Bible, (Ed. J. Mackenzie) "These items, it must be admitted do not give an entirely coherent picture."
Absurdity of absurdities! I have no time to waste by getting into a detailed explanation of the context of the verses talking about the Comforter in John's Gospel. I shall say three things:

1) Jesus promised the Comforter because His disciples became upset when they heard that Jesus had to go back to the Father and thus leave them. The Comforter would be sent to make up for Jesus' physical departure from His followers. Muhammad was born 570 years after Jesus and did not claim to be a messenger until he was 40! What kind of a comforting is this??? We have a Paraclete that comes FOR Jesus' disciples centuries after they leave this world like Jesus and be with Him on the other side! Muhammad, you are too late to play the Paraclete. By the time you were born, there were no apostles and disciples to be comforted because of Jesus' bodily departure. LOL

2) In John's Gospel Jesus NEVER promises the Paraclete to ALL the Jews. Actually, the promise of the Paraclete is confined to those who believe in Jesus (His apostles and disciples, not to all Jews or members of other nations/faiths). Islam, however, contends that Muhammad was sent for all people in the world, primarily for the pagans of Arabia (Mecca).

3) The Qur'an never designates Muhammad as the Paraclete or Comforter. The authors of the Qur'an were busy plagiarizing from the apocryphal Gospels of Infancy. This is why they were ignorant of Jesus' speech in the Gospel. (That Gospel itself was alien to those idiotic scribes)
SAM wrote: Indeed history tells us that many early Christians understood the Paraclete to be a man and not a spirit. This might explain the followings who responded to some who claimed, without meeting the criteria stipulated by Jesus, to be the awaited "Paraclete".
Evidence please? How can you prove that "MANY early Christians" defined the Paraclete as a man rather than a Spirit? Those alleged and unidentified Christians were most likely jerks that read the Gospel of John with their ass-oteric knowledge. One must be an Islamic dummy to claim that the Comforter is a man despite Jesus' clear designation of the Comforter as the HOLY SPIRIT:

But the Comforter, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you everything, and will cause you to remember everything I said to you. (John 14:26)

Conclusion: Muslims lie. It's in their genes.
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Re: Muhammad is like Moses, but Jesus is unlike Moses.

Post by Nosubmission »

SAM wrote:
WAS THE SHIFT OF RELIGIOUS LEADERSHIP PROPHECIED?

Following the rejection of the last Israelite prophet, Jesus, it was about time that God's promise to make Ishmael a great nation be fulfilled (Genesis 21:13, 18)
The Muslim jerks writing this article probably did not realize that the parable they abuse in supporting their racial claims about Arabs' supposed superiority defines Jesus as the ONLY SON OF GOD:

“Listen to another parable: There was a landowner who planted a vineyard. He put a fence around it, dug a pit for its winepress, and built a watchtower. Then he leased it to tenant farmers and went on a journey. When the harvest time was near, he sent his slaves to the tenants to collect his portion of the crop. But the tenants seized his slaves, beat one, killed another, and stoned another. Again he sent other slaves, more than the first, and they treated them the same way. Finally he sent his son to them, saying, ‘They will respect my son.’ But when the tenants saw the son, they said to themselves, ‘This is the heir. Come, let’s kill him and get his inheritance!’ So they seized him, threw him out of the vineyard, and killed him. Now when the owner of the vineyard comes, what will he do to those tenants?” They said to him, “He will utterly destroy those evil men! Then he will lease the vineyard to other tenants who will give him his portion at the harvest.” Jesus said to them, “Have you never read in the scriptures: "The stone the builders rejected has become the cornerstone. This is from the Lord, and it is marvelous in our eyes’? For this reason I tell you that the kingdom of God will be taken from you and given to a people who will produce its fruit. The one who falls on this stone will be broken to pieces, and the one on whom it falls will be crushed.” When the chief priests and the Pharisees heard his parables, they realized that he was speaking about them. (Matthew 21:33-43)

This parable says Jesus was the Son of God and He was killed by the Jews. Both of these doctrines are denied in the Qur'an! LOL Those stupid Muslims choose a perfect text to commit suicide. :D


SAM wrote: In Matthew 21:19-21, Jesus spoke of the fruitless fig tree (A Biblical symbol of prophetic heritage) to be cleared after being given a last chance of three years (the duration of Jesus' ministry) to give fruit.
Wait a second! Matthew 21:19-21 does not contain these statements! Let's read those verses to witness another Islamic campaign of lies and faulty distortion:

After noticing a fig tree by the road he went to it, but found nothing on it except leaves. He said to it, “Never again will there be fruit from you!” And the fig tree withered at once. When the disciples saw it they were amazed, saying, “How did the fig tree wither so quickly?” Jesus answered them, “I tell you the truth, if you have faith and do not doubt, not only will you do what was done to the fig tree, but even if you say to this mountain, ‘Be lifted up and thrown into the sea,’ it will happen. (Matthew 21:19-21)
SAM wrote: In a later verse in the same chapter, Jesus said: "Therefore, say I unto you, The Kingdom of God shall be taken away from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruit thereof" (Matthew 21:43). That nation of Ishmael's descendants (the rejected stone in Matthew 21:42) which was victorious against all super-powers of its time as prophesied by Jesus: "And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken, but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder" (Matthew 21:44).
I wonder where the name Ishmael is hidden in the text? Matthew's Gospel does not have the name Ishmael in any of its chapters. The cornerstone is no one else than Jesus, whom the chief priests got killed, and God glorified through His resurrection. Finally, Jesus refers to the revelation of the Gospel to the Gentiles when He predicts that the Kingdom of God will change hands. After Jesus' death the Temple in Jerusalem was destroyed and Christianity became the official faith in Rome, a nation that believes in Jesus.
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