Page 1 of 1

Mohammad's official Biography

PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2019 1:26 am
by Hombre
It seems there is plenty of literature about the life of Prophet Muhammad after the first revelation - but little information about his childhood to adulthood.

Can any Muslim here post the link to authentic Islamic sources describing Muhammad's bio from his birth to age 40 when he started his prophecy?

- Places he grew up.
- Places he visited.
- People with whom he interacted.

This is your chance to educate non-Muslims on the life of prophet Mohammad & shed light on some of those myth & conjectures associated wit him.

Re: Mohammad's official Biography

PostPosted: Wed Aug 07, 2019 5:22 pm
by Hombre
SAM , mughal or any Muslim.

I am waiting for your reply.

Re: Mohammad's official Biography

PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2019 5:09 pm
by manfred
Hi hombre,
I am not surprised there are no takers....


While the official narrative of Mohammed's life is well known, the main problem with it is that the earliest sources about this are some 200 years later. (Ibn Hisham died 833, and he is the earliest biographer, though he may have had earlier sources now lost. Those would be Ibn Ishaq, who died in 765 or near to that, still leaving a very large gap, too much to be sure about anything, and we do not even have his text.)

Imagine you want to write the biography of a Jewish man, not even your relative, who lived 200 years ago in a country far away. You have no written sources about him from the time, but a lot of tall tales from all kinds of people, many contradictory. Also there are some fanciful tales about riding a donkey with a cow's tail and peacock feathers to heaven and back, and maybe splitting the moon or something....

So what could you write? Most would be a construct. You would need to edit. So what to include? How can you be sure what makes more sense than other stuff you heard? Or just write the whole lot and risk looking silly?

I believe that there possibly was a real Mohammed, simply because of the effect he had. But most if not all of what is said about him is unreliable. We cannot even be sure if anything in the Qur'an are words he ever spoke, never mind all of it....

Re: Mohammad's official Biography

PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2019 8:12 pm
by Hombre
I have seen many Islamic sites depicting Mohammad's detailed family tree - going back to Adam & Eve. This is more then just a fantastic tale. How far people will do to grandiose their leader's history in a desperate effort to legitimize him & their religion..

My point is- referring to Muslim's own official biography (if there is one), demonstrate the fact that through tangible contacts with Jews & Christians earlier in his life - Muhammad was heavily influenced by Judea & Christianity. A fact which explain the Quran containing those Biblical stories written in both holy book HB & NT.

Re: Mohammad's official Biography

PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2019 11:56 pm
by Fernando
manfred wrote:You have no written sources about him from the time, but a lot of tall tales from all kinds of people, many contradictory. Also there are some fanciful tales about riding a donkey with a cow's tail and peacock feathers to heaven and back, and maybe splitting the moon or something....

So what could you write? Most would be a construct. You would need to edit. So what to include? How can you be sure what makes more sense than other stuff you heard? Or just write the whole lot and risk looking silly?
It's been pointed out that often biographies of people from that era become more detailed the further they written after the person's lifetime. It's also been pointed out (perhaps by Manfred?) that people in that era didn't have the same idea of hard, verifiable, historical facts that we have now (or at least used to have, prior to the development of "fake news").

Re: Mohammad's official Biography

PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2019 12:16 am
by manfred
Well,hombre, we do not have direct evidence to what you say,but the "official" version Mohammed's life certainly supports what you say. He was kind of his wife's business manager which means he travelled a lot, and met many people. Some meetings with Jews and Christians are explicitly mentioned.

And there there is the Qur'an. This is very obviously and plainly based on many stories from the bible and also the some Christian texts, but interestingly not the New Testament we have today, he drew mostly on later apocryphal texts.


The only rationaly explanation, if we assume that this Mohammed has even produced the Qur'an, is that he knew these texts. The many muddles and the bad retelling suggests that he did not have actual copies, but relied on what he heard. This would be whatever the Jews and Christians told him.


So even without a biography there is pretty strong evidence that the author of the Qur'an had some rudimentary but muddled knowledge of Jewish traditions and of the beliefs of some early medieval Christian sects.

Re: Mohammad's official Biography

PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2019 5:24 pm
by Hombre
manfred wrote:Well,hombre, we do not have direct evidence to what you say,but the "official" version Mohammed's life certainly supports what you say. He was kind of his wife's business manager which means he travelled a lot, and met many people. Some meetings with Jews and Christians are explicitly mentioned.

And there there is the Qur'an. This is very obviously and plainly based on many stories from the bible and also the some Christian texts, but interestingly not the New Testament we have today, he drew mostly on later apocryphal texts.


The only rationaly explanation, if we assume that this Mohammed has even produced the Qur'an, is that he knew these texts. The many muddles and the bad retelling suggests that he did not have actual copies, but relied on what he heard. This would be whatever the Jews and Christians told him.


So even without a biography there is pretty strong evidence that the author of the Qur'an had some rudimentary but muddled knowledge of Jewish traditions and of the beliefs of some early medieval Christian sects.
Since there are plenty sources depicting the exact tree of his leneage to Adam & Eve (God will help us), I was hoping similar thing on his life also would be available. Sources like Al Azhar University in Cairo which is viewed as the most authoritative on Islamic studies, or from Saudi Sources.
I guess I will have to look for it myself - hopefully in English.

Re: Mohammad's official Biography

PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2019 6:54 am
by manfred
Please share what you have found...

Re: Mohammad's official Biography

PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2019 11:17 pm
by Fernando
I'm really surprised by this. I'd have thought such a biography could be found, at least, on every Mosque's bookcase - immediately below the Koran.
Hadiths are obviously not the thing, and I'm evidently astray by wondering why the Sirah (which perhaps I can't even spell correctly) doesn't fit the bill.

Re: Mohammad's official Biography

PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2019 11:30 pm
by Hombre
The only answer could be made here is.

A) It could reveal Muhammad's extensive interaction with Jews & Christians while growing up, which explains the heavy influence they have had with formation of Islam.
B) Muslim scholars from different factions (i.e. Sunni & Shi'ite) could not agree on unified story, and elements which may have influenced his life.

Re: Mohammad's official Biography

PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2019 10:27 am
by Takeiteasynow
Nomads from the Petra region have some traditions, not part of the main canon, on the young Muhammad. For instance how he visited, as a pilgrim, Jabal Haroun or Mount Aaron next to Petra. This was a common practice in Jewish Galilee (from first century BC) with it's capital Tiberias, especially among Samaritan Jews. Later it became a Christian and Muslim tradition.

Edit: this would explain why Mo aka Benjamin would retreat to Petra after the first failed attempt to capture Jerusalem (614-616). Mo/Benjamin was probably familiar with its terrain and local leaders. Nice! Thanks Hombre, good question.

Re: Mohammad's official Biography

PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2019 11:03 pm
by Hombre
Mughal
I am waiting for your input. Please save Islam and guide me to the shining paradise.

Re: Mohammad's official Biography

PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2019 11:40 pm
by Fernando
Hombre wrote:Mughal
I am waiting for your input. Please save Islam and guide me to the shining paradise.
Be careful what you wish for: don't you know where Muslims think the sun shines from?