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Marriage by proxy now means no benefits of Divorce

PostPosted: Sat Jun 01, 2013 9:43 pm
by lioness
My daughter finally woke up after ten years of being a good Muslim convert wife. They have three kids. They go to court soon for divorce, but now he and his lawyer say as they were married by proxy, they are not legally married, so she gets nothing. And he is claiming she is a bad mother (ha) and wants custody. She has been a full time mother. He has the money..will the court award him custody?? And leave her out in the cold, with nothing? He even took another wife and moved out for awhile because he wanted more sex and claimed he didnt like the way she was raising the children, which is beyond crazy because my daughter is sweet, gentle, loving and those kids are her life. He says I cannot see the children because I tried to have him deported ten years ago. He will tell the court that I hate all Muslims, which I do NOT. He met my daughter one time and then asked her to marry him, after his two sisters converted her to Islam and then introduced her to him. He was here illegally and Palestinian...has no country...so he sat in jail many months to be deported but no countries would take him. He got out and began life with my daughter. Should I write the court that I DONT hate Muslims and it would be horrible for me and the kids not to be in each others lives? I live far away from them, but expect to see them when I go there to visit the rest of my kids and their families. This is crazy. Anyone have any advice??

Re: Marriage by proxy now means no benefits of Divorce

PostPosted: Sat Jun 01, 2013 10:34 pm
by manfred
Oh dear,
this is one almighty mess.

There are not many countries where a marriage by proxy is recognised as valid. I assume you have checked this out for your daughter's place of residence? However, most places recognise what in the UK is called a "common law" marriage. Your daughter lived with him in all intents and purposes exactly like any wife. They have children together. They lived in the same house. In fact the issue with "second wife" and him leaving for a time alone would obviously be solid grounds for a divorce. Are second marriages legal in your location? If not, then he has effectively abandoned her. This has an important bearing on assessing his suitability for custody.

About custody, unless he can provide with any solid reason (and I mean solid, such as your daughter is provably a drug addict or child abuser, complete with convictions or medical documentation) then it will invariably be the mother who gets custody. After all, who will look after the children when he is at work? He left to be with another woman once. So he could do that again. Then what happens to the children? In some places, if the children are over a certain age, (mostly 12) they can be asked, but that is relatively uncommon. However, if he has custody, then he will very likely get visitation rights. That will be a difficult thing to live with, but it gets better as time goes on. He will also be required to pay maintenance for the children, but not for your daughter. She will need a lot of help to keep her head above water, and she may not be able psychologically to deal with the stresses of being a working single mom, at least not at first. She really needs you very much.

Now, as to how the family property will be divided in a case of common law marriage is also dependent on location. Generally she will have to provide more evidence than she would have to otherwise. There is no "formula" as such, but she is entitled to take what belongs to her, including any gifts (he cannot demand them back). She is also entitled to claim for certain equity: For example, if they bought the house together, and she is moving out, she is entitled to a "buy out": either she can insist the house is sold and the proceeds split, or she agrees a figure to reflect her input through the court. Generally courts will only look at the larger items of property, such as a house or a car in that way. She cannot claim for utility bills even if she paid them all out of her own money, as the court will tell her that whatever she offered to give, she cannot claim back. She is also unlikely to get any maintenance payments for herself. As to smaller items, the chances are the courts will get impatient if they argue about who paid for the whisk in the kitchen or the lampshade in the bedroom. It is best to try to agree these kind of things in advance. I suggest to bring it up early on, before things get too bitter and petty to have a rational conversion.


It was a mistake not to go and register the marriage, even later. These excuses are commonly heard in cases like that. But what is done is done. We can't wind the clock back. The main thing is to get through this extremely stressful and difficult period and come out the other end in one piece. She can rebuild her life. The most important thing is to firmly draw all this to a close.

Have some faith. Judges are no fools. They will understand what is going on.

Re: Marriage by proxy now means no benefits of Divorce

PostPosted: Sat Jun 01, 2013 11:05 pm
by lioness
Thank you SO much. That you took the time to write such a thoughtful reply means a lot to me.
No, neither Marriage by Proxy nor Common law Marriages are observed in North Carolina. I am just hoping the judge has compassion for my daughter..she thought this would be a normal divorce, did not know the marriage wasn't legal- she believed every word he said...and needs to raise her children,... with a little help from him financially, too. She's a wonderful mother and person- that will be obvious to the judge- and when HE has to speak in court, he will hang himself, most likely, as he is so cocky, confident about coming out smelling like a rose.
I thought of having everyone we could think of write a letter to the court about what a wonderful person and mom she is. But first I need to find out if that will even be allowed in court.
I also want to write a letter to the judge about him trying to keep me from my grand-children. If it is admissable. THEN I could respond to his allegations by explaining WHY I tried to have him deported- because he preyed on my daughter for citizenship and to spread Islam in America,which he does for Allah..and he treated her like a second class citizen- he doesn't want me to see the kids because he hates ME. And not to get to see my grand-children would be so horrible and so unbelievable...Well, I just can't see a judge allowing him to do that.
I will talk to my daughter tonight or tomorrow,about what you said. She is afraid to use the computer at home, she asked me to Google about this issue...Thank you so much.
OH, and I first found FFI over ten years ago, when she met HIM. It helped me learn all about ISlam, but my daughter did not want to hear it..Anyway, thank you again for your post1

Re: Marriage by proxy now means no benefits of Divorce

PostPosted: Wed Jun 05, 2013 3:19 am
by Marie
Lioness let me get back to you. I have a friend down in North Carolina was who married to a Muslim. Let me if she has any information that could help.

Re: Marriage by proxy now means no benefits of Divorce

PostPosted: Thu Jun 06, 2013 4:51 am
by Marie
My friend didn't have much advice to offer. Although she did stay at home with their child while her ex was away. He did try to accuse her of not being a good mother. Her lawyer responded to that accusation questioning him as to why he left the child alone with someone he thought was unfit.

Re: Marriage by proxy now means no benefits of Divorce

PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 11:47 pm
by lioness
Thanks for writing. Did he win in court? What happened with the custody?
My daughter filed a restraining order on him but HIS lawyer got it dismissed, cos she showed up for the hearing without a lawyer. Our family has 1000 dollars for an attorney retainer, no more. I am so scared. She believes in her heart he will get the kids, she will have to move out, with nothing, not even a car...all is his...I am trying to find a lawyer for her who will take the 1000 and start helping her, but am not real hopeful. She is the most gentle, sweet, devoted mom and he is just a cruel, heartless man who got just what he wanted: came to america to spread Islam, asked her to marry him right away, got her pregnant right away then twice more asap, and now after controlling her for ten years, is in total control of the kids too.
:cry:

Marriage by proxy now means no benefits of Divorce

PostPosted: Sun Nov 13, 2016 8:27 am
by AlexmenCorn
I dont really care about marriage. like what even is marriage? Thats like some sh!t right there.

I do think though that if Im with someone and Im happy with them for an extended period of time like.. years I dont see why I wouldnt get married. You know, for the benefits and sh!t.