PROUD OF LEAVING ISLAM

[iffo]

Swami your problem is you are grumpy, never in good mood. There are people who are trying to build bridges between India and Pak.



You on the other hand still living in 1947, narrow minded & full of hate. Pandit Its time to move on.

[yeezevee]

Mr. Ram, the above video is from that link iffo gave in his post., I have to admit here that this video is an interesting video and iffo makes a point there. But I am curious what is Bombay population and How many Muslims are living in it? And what kind of Plot she is talking??

[Ram]

Mr. Ram, the above video is from that link iffo gave in his post., I have to admit here that this video is an interesting video and iffo makes a point there. But I am curious what is Bombay population and How many Muslims are living in it? And what kind of Plot she is talking??

Of course there is lot of discrimination in India. There is discrimination in every country, even in Muslim countries. Indians discriminate on many basis. Gujaratis discriminating against Maharashtrians, Bengalis against Marwaris, Gujarati Lohars against Gujarati Sonars and so on. India has thousands of communities based on language, caste, religion, sect etc. Each community is divided based on many factors. Panjabi Brahmins against Bihari Brahmins or Bengali Brahmins, etc. Indians are divided on thousands of basis. Even Khoja Muslims hate Kerala Muslims. Shias against Sunnis. Ismailis disliking Bihari Muslims. Even Muslims of South Asia are divided on thousands of basis. Even Christians. That is India.

Each language group divided in may castes and each caste is divided in many language groups. So the divisions run in many different directions. Which makes a very complicated situation. Beacuse of that there is no single group in India which has overall majority.

Since 2000, there has not been a Hindu Muslim riot. But since 2000 Muslims are slaughtering Muslims in Pakistan on daily basis. The lady can make this kind of video in India and live to tell her story. What would happen to a lady in Pakistan who were to make similar video? Her throat would be slit.

This Muslim lady cannot find an apartment in Mumbai and make a video and complain, but a Hindu lady who is looking for an apartment in Karachi would be raped by a Muslim.

[Ram]

:*) Swami your problem is you are grumpy, never in good mood. There are people who are trying to build bridges between India and Pak.

You on the other hand still living in 1947, narrow minded & full of hate. Pandit Its time to move on.

I am narrow minded because I am describing a fact? I am full of hate when I cannot live in my homeland of Sindh because I am a Hindu? My mother tongue is Sindhi. My ancestors have lived in Shikarpur (Sindh) Quetta (Balochistan) and Chaman (NWFP) for hundreds of years but I am forced out because I am a Hindu. Who is full of hate? Muslims who drove me out of my home or me? My problem is Muslims who hate and Muslims like you who refuse to see the truth. My problem is dhimmi minded politically correct leftist politicians who are too afraid to speak the truth and always afraid of "hurting feelings of Muslims".

[yeezevee]

Mr. Ram, the above video is from that link iffo gave in his post., I have to admit here that this video is an interesting video and iffo makes a point there. But I am curious what is Bombay population and How many Muslims are living in it? And what kind of Plot she is talking??

Mr. Ram, the above video is from that link iffo gave in his post., I have to admit here that this video is an interesting video and iffo makes a point there. But I am curious what is Bombay population and How many Muslims are living in it? And what kind of Plot she is talking??

Of course there is lot of discrimination in India. There is discrimination in every country, even in Muslim countries. Indians discriminate on many basis. Gujaratis discriminating against Maharashtrians, Bengalis against Marwaris, Gujarati Lohars against Gujarati Sonars and so on. India has thousands of communities based on language, caste, religion, sect etc. Each community is divided based on many factors. Panjabi Brahmins against Bihari Brahmins or Bengali Brahmins, etc. Indians are divided on thousands of basis. Even Khoja Muslims hate Kerala Muslims. Shias against Sunnis. Ismailis disliking Bihari Muslims. Even Muslims of South Asia are divided on thousands of basis. Even Christians. That is India.

Each language group divided in may castes and each caste is divided in many language groups. So the divisions run in many different directions. Which makes a very complicated situation. Beacuse of that there is no single group in India which has overall majority.

Since 2000, there has not been a Hindu Muslim riot. But since 2000 Muslims are slaughtering Muslims in Pakistan on daily basis. The lady can make this kind of video in India and live to tell her story. What would happen to a lady in Pakistan who were to make similar video? Her throat would be slit.

This Muslim lady cannot find an apartment in Mumbai and make a video and complain, but a Hindu lady who is looking for an apartment in Karachi would be raped by a Muslim.

I don't think you have answered the specific questions dear Mr. Ram. Let me put them again..


1). What is Bombay population and How many Muslims are living in it?
2). And what kind of Plot she is talking??
3). Where does she live??

[iffo]

Ram
I am narrow minded because I am describing a fact? I am full of hate when I cannot live in my homeland of Sindh because I am a Hindu? My mother tongue is Sindhi. My ancestors have lived in Shikarpur (Sindh) Quetta (Balochistan) and Chaman (NWFP) for hundreds of years but I am forced out because I am a Hindu. Who is full of hate? Muslims who drove me out of my home or me? My problem is Muslims who hate and Muslims like you who refuse to see the truth. My problem is dhimmi minded politically correct leftist politicians who are too afraid to speak the truth and always afraid of "hurting feelings of Muslims".

I am sorry you had to leave Pakistan and your house, never thought you loved Pak so much . But that happen to lot of people on other side of the border as well. My family migrated from India, we had a big mansion there, when we were in Pak we did not get a jack, lost everything. 3 hours after my family left
in car for Pak, the mansion was attacked people came to kill us all with knives and swords but luckily we left only 3 hours earlier. We were stopped again at a check post we were asked to come out, order was to kill us all. But one member of my family was at very high post who was with us. He knew the head of check post so they spared us all because of his old connection with him. We drove again after few hours of slow drive and all of a sudden some one knock at the car window saying "no need to be sacred"
you have entered Pakistan, Paksitan has started", way at the distance there was Pak flag waving on a building, we came out from the car and bowed and kiss the land with tears that our lives got saved
There are all sort of these kinds of stories. You not alone. If Japanese forgot US dropped the bomb there, you should forget too and move on.

[Ram]

1). What is Bombay population and How many Muslims are living in it?
2). And what kind of Plot she is talking??
3). Where does she live??

1). Mumbai has almost 20 million population. I am not sure but I think Muslims make up about 2 million (10%) of the total population.

2). I don't know what kind of plot she is talking about. She suffered a garden variety discrimination. She forgot to mention that it is very difficult for a Hindu to live in Muslim neighbourhood in Mumbai. But you can be sure that she got lot of support from many Hindus.

Her criticism is valid but she experienced discrimiantion which is also the experience of many Hindus - for example a Maharashtrian Hindu not renting an apartment to a Hindu from Bihar or Tamil Nadu or vice versa.

Rest assured she has found a nice apartment across the street or few block away. This type of discrimination is very common in India and is practiced by every community against every community. No body getes killed, only the feelings are hurt. Now let us send a Hindu lady in Karachi to look for apartment on her own and see what heppens.

3). I don't know.

[manfred]

It sounds to me that BOTH of your families had problems because of the creation of Pakistan...

what do you think, if we could do it all over again, would it be better to have one large India, instead?

Also, I am surprised to learn that there are Hindu "no go" areas is Mumbay! The Indian police is happy about that?

On a much smaller scale, there is a similar mix of Hindus and Muslims in Indonesia, on one island only, Bali.The Balinese version of Hinduism is not quite the same as any found in India, but on that island there are few conflicts between Muslims and Hindus, and the y all live together in the same streets. Ok, they rarely intermarry or have close neighbourly ties, but generally they get along, talk to each other, help each other when needed. This cannot be said to the same extent for islands in Indonesia where there is a Christian/Muslim mix, where conflicts are much more common, and,as always,violence generates more violence.

So, Ram, why is it that Muslims and Hindus can be good neighbours in one place, but not in Mumbay? Has the memory of the creation of Pakistan not faded yet? Or are there other reasons?

[Ram]

So, Ram, why is it that Muslims and Hindus can be good neighbours in one place, but not in Mumbay? Has the memory of the creation of Pakistan not faded yet? Or are there other reasons?

It is not correct to say that Hindus and Muslims in Bali live peacefully. Bali is a very small island. Hindus on the island of Bali are in majority but they are very small minority in Indonesia. If Hindus of Bali were to assert themselves they would be slaughtered, nobody in the world would care or even know about it. Hindus know that and have accepted their inferior status in order to survive.

Arab Muslim Muhammad bin Qasim conquered Sindh in the 8th Century and brutalized the population and converted Hindus by force - the Islamic Doctrine of convert or die. Arabs defeated the Hindu King Dahir and beheaded him. They beheaded every captured soldier. (It is lie when Muslims claim that Islam does not permit killing of captives)

Bin Qasim enslaved 2 Hindu princesses and brought them to Arabia as gifts to the Caliph. Princesses knew that they would be raped. Both conspired and told the Caliph they had been deflowered by bin Qasim. The caliph hanged bin Qasim as well the princesses.

Muslims have killed more than 80 million Hindus and destroyed thousands of Hindu temples. In the cities of Ajmer, Mathura, Vrindavan and many holy cities of India every temple was demolished without exception. The problem is Islamic mindset that they are the true believers and Hindus are kaffirs.

[Ram]

what do you think, if we could do it all over again, would it be better to have one large India, instead?

Good question. I don't know. Sooner or later Pakistan will disintegrate if Pakistanis are left to their own devices. Only things which are keeping Pakistan together are the billions of dollars of charity poured by the foolish Americans and hatred of Hindus. Islam did not prevent the break-up pf Pakistan in 1971. Poor Jinnah is turning in his grave but he must wait for the Qayamat - for how long, no body knows.

[Ram]

I am sorry you had to leave Pakistan and your house, never thought you loved Pak so much

I love Pakistan? No I don't. I love Sindh and Balochistan, not Pakistan. I love the Sindhi culture and Sindhi Sufi poets like Shah Abdul Latif and Sami. Now Sindhi Muslims do not read Sami because he was a Hindu - such bigotry. Shah Abdul Latif and Sami were the greatest Sindhi poets.

[manfred]

Bali is a very small island. Hindus on the island of Bali are in majority but they are very small minority in Indonesia. If Hindus of Bali were to assert themselves they would be slaughtered, nobody in the world would care or even know about it.

I am not sure about that... true Bali is only small, 2 million or near to that, and Hindus are the majority. Many trace their ancestors to the larger island of Jawa; they fled after the arrival Islam, to practice their beliefs freely.

You may have heard of Nyepi. That is a big Hindu festival in Bali, a day of silence; even the airport is closed and holiday makers are confined to their hotels. To my knowledge, there never have been objections to this day in Bali by local Muslims, in fact they take part. It is also common for Hindu families to visit Muslim neighbours on Muslim holidays, like Idul Fitri.

Hindu festivals and celebrations are extremely common things to see everyday. Also, you cannot miss the small offering trays outside most front doors and most shops.

Hindus are in fact asserting themselves in Bali, and good for them. For example, there is a legally binding rule in Bali that nobody may build a house hight than the local temple. That is why there are no high rise hotels in Bali, except for one small area designated for tourism alone.

Hindus also successfully blocked the building of a bridge to the neighbouring island of Jawa; they wanted the ferry operations to continue so allow some better control over motor cycle theft. (There are loads of Jawanese young men who regularly go to Bali to steal bikes and take them across to Jawa)

Other signs of Hindus asserting themselves are: hundreds of temples, many of breath-taking beauty, shrines at every street corner, offerings everywhere, big celebrations every few weeks, Hindu gates to many public buildings, statues of Hindu deities on roundabouts and in many public places.

Bali is an entirely Hindu island, semi-independent from the rest of Indonesia, much wealthier than any other part of the country, and, at least from what I can tell, a place where Hindus and Muslims can co-exist.

The Bali bombing brought out round condemnation and anger from BOTH Balinese Hindus and Muslims. The perpetrators turns out be all foreign to the island.

[iffo]

Yeezee
2). And what kind of Plot she is talking??

Not Plot - Flat (apartment)

[yeezevee]

1). What is Bombay population and How many Muslims are living in it?
2). And what kind of Plot she is talking??
3). Where does she live??

1). Mumbai has almost 20 million population. I am not sure but I think Muslims make up about 2 million (10%) of the total population.

2). I don't know what kind of plot she is talking about. She suffered a garden variety discrimination. She forgot to mention that it is very difficult for a Hindu to live in Muslim neighbourhood in Mumbai. But you can be sure that she got lot of support from many Hindus.

Her criticism is valid but she experienced discrimiantion which is also the experience of many Hindus - for example a Maharashtrian Hindu not renting an apartment to a Hindu from Bihar or Tamil Nadu or vice versa.

Rest assured she has found a nice apartment across the street or few block away. This type of discrimination is very common in India and is practiced by every community against every community. No body getes killed, only the feelings are hurt. Now let us send a Hindu lady in Karachi to look for apartment on her own and see what heppens.

3). I don't know.

O.K., thank you for that response., here is what wiki says on those questions..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mumbai

It is the most populous city in India, and the second most populous city in the world, with a population of approximately 14 million.

The religions represented in Mumbai include
Hindus (67.39%),
Muslims (18.56%),
Buddhists (5.22%),
Jains (3.99%),
Christians (3.72%),
Sikhs (0.58%),
with Parsis and Jews making up the rest of the population.

The linguistic/ethnic demographics are: Maharashtrians (60%), Gujaratis (19%), with the rest hailing from other parts of India. The oldest Muslim communities in Mumbai include the Dawoodi Bohras, Khojas, and Konkani Muslims. Native Christians include East Indians (ethnic group) Catholics who were converted by the Portuguese, during the 16th century. The city also has a small native Bene Israeli Jewish community, who migrated from the Persian Gulf or Yemen, probably 1600 years ago. Parsis migrated to India from Persia. Today, there are about 80,000 Parsis in Mumbai.

So ~ 18% are Muslims., that is a pretty good% of Muslims living in Bombay., I don't understand why that famous Movie actress actress of India with well known father and husband whose father was communist says "she can not get a plot/flat in Bombay?" Something is not right there.. Does she have enough money to buy a house over there?? I am sure it is most expensive place on this earth.. More over there are plenty of Movie actors of India who happened to be Muslims living in that city.

[yeezevee]

Yeezee
2). And what kind of Plot she is talking??

Not Plot - Flat (apartment)

Oh I see., well I was thinking she was trying by a plot of land to built a house in Bombay.. ., well it doesn't matter Plot or Flat., She sounds like a very SPECIAL MUSLIM who can not get a flat because she is Muslim, where as 20% of folks in that city are Muslims.. She sounds stupid to me dear Iffo.. may be she doesn't have enough money..

[iffo]

YeeZee
She sounds stupid to me dear Iffo.. may be she doesn't have enough money..

Shabana Azmi is very educated/modern and rich Bollywood star.

[Ram]

Yeezee
2). And what kind of Plot she is talking??

Not Plot - Flat (apartment)

Oh I see., well I was thinking she was trying by a plot of land to built a house in Bombay.. ., well it doesn't matter Plot or Flat., She sounds like a very SPECIAL MUSLIM who can not get a flat because she is Muslim, where as 20% of folks in that city are Muslims.. She sounds stupid to me dear Iffo.. may be she doesn't have enough money..

yeezevee, I am sure that she suffered discrimination while trying to buy the flat. But she also got lot of support from her Hindu friends. Her feelings were hurt. She is able to talk about it in India. But if a Hindu (or a Christian, or Ahmadiya Muslim or Shia) complained about discrimination in Pakistan or Bangladesh he or she would be killed. So for iffo to criticize Indians about discrimination is nothing but hypocrisy.

[yeezevee]

"iffo" says

YeeZee
She sounds stupid to me dear Iffo.. may be she doesn't have enough money..

Shabana Azmi is very educated/modern and rich Bollywood star.

"Ram responds

: yeezevee, I am sure that she suffered discrimination while trying to buy the flat. But she also got lot of support from her Hindu friends. Her feelings were hurt. She is able to talk about it in India. But if a Hindu (or a Christian, or Ahmadiya Muslim or Shia) complained about discrimination in Pakistan or Bangladesh he or she would be killed. So for iffo to criticize Indians about discrimination is nothing but hypocrisy.

Now with the input from iffo where he says "she is rich and classy lady" and on top of it that city's over 18% of its population is Muslim and living in city with houses + there are tons of filmy actors who are Muslims and living in that city., "So I WOULD NOT SAY SHE NOT GETTING A FLAT AS DISCRIMINATION" ., It must be something else., may be it is POLITICALLY motivated. Her blog says.. she often speaks against Islamic Mullahs of India and social evils in India. So she is clearly politically active. Hence I would consider she NOT getting flat in Bombay is more of political and is NOT discrimination based on her religion Mr. Ram.


That city with these right wing local political characters http://www.outlookindia.com/printarticle.aspx?264137 seem to have other problems such as fierce language not just religion., Is she from that state??

[Ibn Rushd]

I thought this was in the testimony section? Maybe we should split it.

[Aaliyah]

I am proud of you, welcome to the forum my friend