I'm living in hell.Please help me.

[Vesta]

Hi everyone.
I am a 19 year old girl living in Middle east.I used to be a faithful Shiite Muslim. I defended Islam with all my strength.I wanted others to see the truth of Islam but suddenly it was me who started to see things differently.as soon as i finished school i started to doubt in many things.when i started university everything worsened.With every new word that i read i lose a part of my faith.I wasn't trying to find some excuse not to wear Hijab or go to parties.My belief was shaken by more fundamental things.I began to feel that many excuses that are offered for some things in Islam are shallow and i would not have accepted them if they were from another group.So suddenly i woke up and with a panicked.Until then i have considered myself an opened minded Muslim.But then i looked at myself and saw that i am losing my faith completely.I was frantic and tried to regain my faith with extreme forms of prayer but that didn't answer.Even speaking of Islam was sickening for me.I felt very guilty.I felt that what ever i am feeling are because of my sins.
since then i am feeling worse and worse.Some times i feel depressed other times aggressive and angry.I feel that i should gave up on my faith but i feel so lost and terrified.Some times i am sure that some thing will happen to me for the way i am feeling.Some times i think what if all the conclusions i have made are all wrong and i am going to the wrong way?
My parents though educated fiercely believe in political Islam. I can't leave them and live some where else.I can't tell them how i feel.If i tell them that i can't be a Muslim anymore there would be no university no Internet no e books any more.Probably they will force me to marry some GOOD MAN.It's not that they are cruel.They just want me to go to heaven instead of hell and they think that God's love is above any love.I don't want to hurt them and if i turn my back to Islam it will

[Wootah]

Hi Vesta. Thanks for sharing. What sort of things shook your beliefs in Islam?

[Vesta]

Well.Evolution.Homosexuality.Pedophilia.Women and human rights.Hodud or Islamic punishments.When i looked at the whole Islamic belief from out side i was confused and angry.and i doubted things that i firmly believed in past.

[RichardTheLionheart]

Welcome to FFI, Vesta.
These feelings you are experiencing have been felt by many people on this website who have left Islam and other religions. It does take time to come to terms with the lies you have been told but you will work it out.

Looking forward to your contributions here.

[expozIslam]

Welcome to FFI Vesta.

Feeling lost, angry or at times gloomy is quite natural and human more so when you have just discovered that something you believed to be wonderful and great is not really so.

You don't need to tell you parents anything as yet. Make yourself financially strong and move out if you can.

The reason why muslims thrust islam on others is not because they love them and want them to see in heaven but due to their irrational fear of being sent to hell if they did not do so and the potential reward of heaven if they get new converts.

Time is not far off when muslims will leave Islam in droves and people like you can live a free life.

[Sten]

Poor Vesta. You seem to be one of many, many ex-muslims experiencing this problem. Take comfort in the knowledge that you're not alone in the world, and that you're not the only one this is happening to.

[yeezevee]

Hi everyone.
I am a 19 year old girl living in Middle east.I used to be a faithful Shiite Muslim. I defended Islam with all my strength.I wanted others to see the truth of Islam but suddenly it was me who started to see things differently.as soon as i finished school i started to doubt in many things.when i started university everything worsened.With every new word that i read i lose a part of my faith.I wasn't trying to find some excuse not to wear Hijab or go to parties.My belief was shaken by more fundamental things.I began to feel that many excuses that are offered for some things in Islam are shallow and i would not have accepted them if they were from another group.So suddenly i woke up and with a panicked.Until then i have considered myself an opened minded Muslim.But then i looked at myself and saw that i am losing my faith completely.I was frantic and tried to regain my faith with extreme forms of prayer but that didn't answer.Even speaking of Islam was sickening for me.I felt very guilty.I felt that what ever i am feeling are because of my sins.

Hi Vesta., what a name .. did you get that from Avesta?? You see what have written is a classic state of inquiry in to ones self. For that you should be proud of your self, Not depressed

since then i am feeling worse and worse.Some times i feel depressed other times aggressive and angry.I feel that i should gave up on my faith but i feel so lost and terrified. Some times i am sure that some thing will happen to me for the way i am feeling.Some times i think what if all the conclusions i have made are all wrong and i am going to the wrong way?

No.. No you don't need to give up anything at present. Wat all you are doing is inquiring int o your faith. Questioning the existing norms in religion and in life is not bad thing. That is how you progress. So you are in 1st year college? There is so much to learn and read you should have very little to thing like religion.

My parents though educated fiercely believe in political Islam. I can't leave them and live some where else.I can't tell them how i feel.If i tell them that i can't be a Muslim anymore there would be no university no Internet no e books any more.Probably they will force me to marry some GOOD MAN.It's not that they are cruel.They just want me to go to heaven instead of hell and they think that God's love is above any love.I don't want to hurt them and if i turn my back to Islam it will

I just don't get you, why do you need to tell your parents that you left Islam? And what is so special in leaving Islam or not leaving Islam to a 19 year old?? You should be busy in School/ college and what not. Off course parents wants best to their children in heaven as well as on earth. Your parents are no exception to that rule. So use their money, their help.. go to collage get out of it in flying colors, get a good Job.. then think about the religion..faith and all that rubbish..

Until then you have NO right to get depressed or get upset/angry about religion. A long as your religion doesn't interfere with your education you should not worry about it now..

with best wishes
yeezevee

[Vesta]

Thanks everyone.It's comforting to find so many people in the same situation as myself.The problem with living in an Islamic country is that it's almost impossible for a woman to have an independent life,A woman can't get a room in hotels alone.can't travel abroad without her father or husband's consent and people think that a young woman living alone is no better than a whore.Financial independence is like a joke for many women.

[Ibn Rushd]

Hope all works out for you.

You can read my testimony for now: http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Ibn_Rushd_(former_Muslim)

[Trouper]

Hi everyone.
I used to be a faithful Shiite Muslim.

A shiite? Muslim? Sorry you never were a Muslim. So, you never left Islam. You left the cult, shiasm. Congratulations on that.

[Ram]

Hi everyone.
I used to be a faithful Shiite Muslim.

A shiite? Muslim? Sorry you never were a Muslim. So, you never left Islam. You left the cult, shiasm. Congratulations on that.

Please answer few questions:
Why there is no freedom of religion in Muslim countries?
Why women are forced to cover their faces in many Muslim countries?
Why is the testimony of a Muslim woman is worth half as much as that of a Muslim man?
Why is the testimony a non-Muslim worth half as much as that of a Muslim man?

[Trouper]

Why there is no freedom of religion in Muslim countries?

Islam brooks preaching of other religions. It advocates freedom of religion. You asked "Muslim countries?" According to me, there are no Muslim countries.

Why women are forced to cover their faces in many Muslim countries?

Islam does not compel women to cover their faces. Islam suggests modesty. Covering faces is optional, not mandatory.

Why is the testimony of a Muslim woman is worth half as much as that of a Muslim man?
Why is the testimony a non-Muslim worth half as much as that of a Muslim man?

I am not sufficiently versed on this matter and hence cannot answer you at this moment.

Thank you for the questions.

[Muhammad bin Lyin]

Why there is no freedom of religion in Muslim countries?

Islam brooks preaching of other religions. It advocates freedom of religion.

Let's take a look at that claim from an historical perspective

9:29. Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the latter day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Apostle have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection.

Tafsir for 9:29

IBN Kathir

The Order to fight People of the Scriptures until They give the Jizyah

Allah said,

[قَـتِلُواْ الَّذِينَ لاَ يُؤْمِنُونَ بِاللَّهِ وَلاَ بِالْيَوْمِ الاٌّخِرِ وَلاَ يُحَرِّمُونَ مَا حَرَّمَ اللَّهُ وَرَسُولُهُ وَلاَ يَدِينُونَ دِينَ الْحَقِّ مِنَ الَّذِينَ أُوتُواْ الْكِتَـبَ حَتَّى يُعْطُواْ الْجِزْيَةَ عَن يَدٍ وَهُمْ صَـغِرُونَ ]

(Fight against those who believe not in Allah, nor in the Last Day, nor forbid that which has been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, and those who acknowledge not the religion of truth among the People of the Scripture, until they pay the Jizyah with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.) Therefore, when People of the Scriptures disbelieved in Muhammad , they had no beneficial faith in any Messenger or what the Messengers brought. Rather, they followed their religions because this conformed with their ideas, lusts and the ways of their forefathers, not because they are Allah's Law and religion. Had they been true believers in their religions, that faith would have directed them to believe in Muhammad , because all Prophets gave the good news of Muhammad's advent and commanded them to obey and follow him. Yet when he was sent, they disbelieved in him, even though he is the mightiest of all Messengers. Therefore, they do not follow the religion of earlier Prophets because these religions came from Allah, but because these suit their desires and lusts. Therefore, their claimed faith in an earlier Prophet will not benefit them because they disbelieved in the master, the mightiest, the last and most perfect of all Prophets . Hence Allah's statement,

[قَـتِلُواْ الَّذِينَ لاَ يُؤْمِنُونَ بِاللَّهِ وَلاَ بِالْيَوْمِ الاٌّخِرِ وَلاَ يُحَرِّمُونَ مَا حَرَّمَ اللَّهُ وَرَسُولُهُ وَلاَ يَدِينُونَ دِينَ الْحَقِّ مِنَ الَّذِينَ أُوتُواْ الْكِتَـبَ]

(Fight against those who believe not in Allah, nor in the Last Day, nor forbid that which has been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, and those who acknowledge not the religion of truth among the People of the Scripture,) This honorable Ayah was revealed with the order to fight the People of the Book, after the pagans were defeated, the people entered Allah's religion in large numbers, and the Arabian Peninsula was secured under the Muslims' control. Allah commanded His Messenger to fight the People of the Scriptures, Jews and Christians, on the ninth year of Hijrah, and he prepared his army to fight the Romans and called the people to Jihad announcing his intent and destination. The Messenger sent his intent to various Arab areas around Al-Madinah to gather forces, and he collected an army of thirty thousand. Some people from Al-Madinah and some hypocrites, in and around it, lagged behind, for that year was a year of drought and intense heat. The Messenger of Allah marched, heading towards Ash-Sham to fight the Romans until he reached Tabuk, where he set camp for about twenty days next to its water resources. He then prayed to Allah for a decision and went back to Al-Madinah because it was a hard year and the people were weak, as we will mention, Allah willing.

Paying Jizyah is a Sign of Kufr and Disgrace

Allah said,

[حَتَّى يُعْطُواْ الْجِزْيَةَ]

(until they pay the Jizyah), if they do not choose to embrace Islam,

[عَن يَدٍ]

(with willing submission), in defeat and subservience,

[وَهُمْ صَـغِرُونَ]

(and feel themselves subdued.), disgraced, humiliated and belittled. Therefore, Muslims are not allowed to honor the people of Dhimmah or elevate them above Muslims, for they are miserable, disgraced and humiliated. Muslim recorded from Abu Hurayrah that the Prophet said,

«لَا تَبْدَءُوا الْيَهُودَ وَالنَّصَارَى بِالسَّلَامِ، وَإِذَا لَقِيتُمْ أَحَدَهُمْ فِي طَرِيقٍ فَاضْطَرُّوهُ إِلَى أَضْيَقِه»

(Do not initiate the Salam to the Jews and Christians, and if you meet any of them in a road, force them to its narrowest alley.) This is why the Leader of the faithful `Umar bin Al-Khattab, may Allah be pleased with him, demanded his well-known conditions be met by the Christians, these conditions that ensured their continued humiliation, degradation and disgrace. The scholars of Hadith narrated from `Abdur-Rahman bin Ghanm Al-Ash`ari that he said, "I recorded for `Umar bin Al-Khattab, may Allah be pleased with him, the terms of the treaty of peace he conducted with the Christians of Ash-Sham: `In the Name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful. This is a document to the servant of Allah `Umar, the Leader of the faithful, from the Christians of such and such city. When you (Muslims) came to us we requested safety for ourselves, children, property and followers of our religion. We made a condition on ourselves that we will neither erect in our areas a monastery, church, or a sanctuary for a monk, nor restore any place of worship that needs restoration nor use any of them for the purpose of enmity against Muslims. We will not prevent any Muslim from resting in our churches whether they come by day or night, and we will open the doors [of our houses of worship] for the wayfarer and passerby. Those Muslims who come as guests, will enjoy boarding and food for three days. We will not allow a spy against Muslims into our churches and homes or hide deceit [or betrayal] against Muslims. We will not teach our children the Qur'an, publicize practices of Shirk, invite anyone to Shirk or prevent any of our fellows from embracing Islam, if they choose to do so. We will respect Muslims, move from the places we sit in if they choose to sit in them. We will not imitate their clothing, caps, turbans, sandals, hairstyles, speech, nicknames and title names, or ride on saddles, hang swords on the shoulders, collect weapons of any kind or carry these weapons. We will not encrypt our stamps in Arabic, or sell liquor. We will have the front of our hair cut, wear our customary clothes wherever we are, wear belts around our waist, refrain from erecting crosses on the outside of our churches and demonstrating them and our books in public in Muslim fairways and markets. We will not sound the bells in our churches, except discretely, or raise our voices while reciting our holy books inside our churches in the presence of Muslims, nor raise our voices [with prayer] at our funerals, or light torches in funeral processions in the fairways of Muslims, or their markets. We will not bury our dead next to Muslim dead, or buy servants who were captured by Muslims. We will be guides for Muslims and refrain from breaching their privacy in their homes.' When I gave this document to `Umar, he added to it, `We will not beat any Muslim. These are the conditions that we set against ourselves and followers of our religion in return for safety and protection. If we break any of these promises that we set for your benefit against ourselves, then our Dhimmah (promise of protection) is broken and you are allowed to do with us what you are allowed of people of defiance and rebellion.'''

You asked "Muslim countries?" According to me, there are no Muslim countries.

Why women are forced to cover their faces in many Muslim countries?

Islam does not compel women to cover their faces. Islam suggests modesty. Covering faces is optional, not mandatory.

Why is the testimony of a Muslim woman is worth half as much as that of a Muslim man?
Why is the testimony a non-Muslim worth half as much as that of a Muslim man?

I am not sufficiently versed on this matter and hence cannot answer you at this moment.

Thank you for the questions.

By being not sufficiently verses at the moment, do you mean going to back to find someone who can give you a whole bunch of false excuses so that you can feel good and maintain your belief? You can find an endless supply of excuses (that don't actually add up) at any local Mosque. Creating excuses that don't actually work for problems in the Quran is actually a part time job for many Muslims, or so it would seem.

[Eagle]

Let's take a look at that claim from an historical perspective

9:29. Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the latter day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Apostle have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection.

Hey Resigned, are you going to be a man and answer my post on the U-I forum now? How about your buddy Hawkeye?

Let's take a look at it again from a Quranic perspective:

The first verse announces a clearing of guilt or dissociation of Allah and His messenger from those idolators who had previously made a treaty with the Muslims but violated it (see v4). The Muslims had time and time again renewed their agreements after the opposing party had violated it 8:56,61. It was this frequent violation that ultimately led to the declaration of immunity against those who 9:10"do not pay regard to ties of relationship nor those of covenant in the case of a believer; and these are they who go beyond the limits", those who 9:13"broke their oaths and aimed at the expulsion of the Messenger, and they attacked you first" because it was impossible that the Muslims should be bound forever by the terms of those agreements, while their enemies could repudiate them with impunity 9:7"How can there be an agreement for the idolaters with Allah and with His Messenger; except those with whom you made an agreement at the Sacred Mosque?"
The declaration of immunity is therefore not directed at the idolators because of their religion, it does not cover those that honor their treaties "So as long as they are true to you, be true to them; surely Allah loves those who are careful (of their duty)" and neither the one among those besieged or at the battlefield who gives up fighting among the idolators, leaves his people and seeks protection from the Muslims 9:6. He must be protected and explained what is Islam in order to clear his preconceived notions "this is because they are a people who do not know", he is then left to "attain his place of safety" ie his homeland which means he is free to accept or not the message of the Quran always in accordance with the divine principle that there cannot be coercion in religion 2:256.

It then annouces that those treaty violators are given respite during the 4 sacred months of pilgrimage during which they can walk freely in the land of Mecca now ruled by the Muslims and reconsider their belligerent attitude towards the Muslims and turn to God in repentence which would be the wisest decision to make since a perseverence in their desire for war will make them losers in this world -Allah will punish them through the believers as He did in the times of Moses- as well as the next, they 9:2"cannot weaken Allah and that Allah will bring disgrace to the unbelievers".

Concerning those idolaters who had honored their initial agreements with the Muslims and had not backed up anyone against them, then the Muslims are told to 9:4"fulfill their agreement to the end of their term; surely Allah loves those who are careful (of their duty)".

After the 4 sacred months of pilgrimage during which the idolaters were given time to perform their rites and reconsider their position, if they still remained in their belligerent mode then the Muslims are told to stand up for those who initiate fighting 9:5"slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captives and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush". As the surrounding verses make it clear, this is speaking of those who repeatedly broke to contracts, despite the Muslims keeping their engagements, attacked the Muslims first. These people, the Muslims shouldnt believe them if they come to them with an alleged offer of peace as they did in the past before braking it, and they should only stop fighting them under 2 conditions:
- if they clearly become Muslims by praying regularly and pay the poor rate because this is the only guarantee they have that they wont go back to attacking the Muslims 4:91"You will find others who desire that they should be safe from you and secure from their own people; as often as they are sent back to the mischief they get thrown into it headlong; therefore if they do not withdraw from you, and (do not) offer you peace and restrain their hands, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them; and against these We have given you a clear authority"
- And if they do not become Muslims but they stop their persecution then 2:193"there should be no hostility except against the oppressors" and that is because 8:38"if they desist, that which is past shall be forgiven to them; and if they return, then what happened to the ancients has already passed"

The idolators were then completely forbidden custody and entry to the precincts of the Sacred Mosque 9:17-18,28 due to their sacraligious practices such as how the Quran desribes them performing the tawaf naked, claping and whisteling, carrying their idols and placing them inside the House of the One True God. They were unclean spiritually because of their sins, just like the hypocrites are said to be unclean 9:95. The spiritual uncleanness of the sinners was pointed by prophets of the past, like Jesus who likened them to dogs and swine Matt7:6. The Sacred House dedicated to the worship of the One God since its raising by Ibrahim and his son Ismail, could not remain in their custody, it had to be cleansed from all traces of polytheism and return to its original purpose by being the universal center of Monotheism as an answer to Ibrahim's prayers, until the Day of Resurrection.
This ordinance had naturally caused the Muslims to fear for their livelyhood 9:28 because by banning all idolators of Arabia and beyond from entering Mecca in the months of pilgrimage, the town would automatically loose its position as a comercial center and all trade would cease. However these worldly considerations could not interfer with the carrying out of higher objectives.

9:29 is then a command to keep fighting those aggressors among the idolators and the people of the book who have been defeated, who remained in Muslim lands and refused to pay taxes, refusing to submit to Governement laws. The verse mentions the people of the book to stress that their spiritual status will not exempt them from being fought and submitted if they engage the Muslims in battle, in accordance with the principles of Jihad that Muslims are commanded to stand up for aggression when it threatens their existence, and neither will they be left to defy Governement laws that apply to them if they choose to remain in Muslim land and keep their religion, without following "the religion of truth".

In the Bible and as corroborated by Jesus when he said to abide by the laws of the Torah to the minute details, the law still applicable to this day and from which Rabbis derive the rules of war state that in case the Israelites are set to conquer foreign land -not a war of self-defense- "When you march up to attack a city, make its people an offer of peace. If they accept and open their gates, all the people in it shall be subject to forced labor and shall work for you. If they refuse to make peace and they engage you in battle, lay siege to that city. When the LORD your God delivers it into your hand, put to the sword all the men in it. As for the women, the children, the livestock and everything else in the city, you may take these as plunder for yourselves. And you may use the plunder the LORD your God gives you from your enemies. This is how you are to treat all the cities that are at a distance from you and do not belong to the nations nearby". Note that this is not even a vital war as is the case in Sura Tawba, this law from Deut20 is to be applied in cases of wars that fall under the category of wars for "national glory".

[Cassie]

I know you won't get it, Eagle, but true peace does not involve slaying, fighting, killing, oppressing anyone. Islam is a demonic religion because it alone among all the major religions actually encourage its adherents to slay, fight, kill and oppress.

9:29 kill or fight all those who do not believe in Allah or the last day, until they pay the jizya with humiliation.

This is not a good commandment. It does not say that it applies only to those who fight you. It applies to ALL THOSE WHO DO NOT BELIEVE IN ALLAH OR THE LAST DAY.

Your religion is evil. We all know it. Deep in your heart of hearts you know it, despite your desperate apologetics.

[Eagle]

I know you won't get it, Eagle, but true peace does not involve slaying, fighting, killing, oppressing anyone. Islam is a demonic religion because it alone among all the major religions actually encourage its adherents to slay, fight, kill and oppress.

9:29 kill or fight all those who do not believe in Allah or the last day, until they pay the jizya with humiliation.

This is not a good commandment. It does not say that it applies only to those who fight you. It applies to ALL THOSE WHO DO NOT BELIEVE IN ALLAH OR THE LAST DAY.

Your religion is evil. We all know it. Deep in your heart of hearts you know it, despite your desperate apologetics.

That was your refutation?

[Cassie]

I know it's an excellent refutation of your apologetics. What sort of religion would encourage its adherents to commit violence and oppression? Have you ever thought why the Muslim world is so violent and hateful? Compare that to peaceful religions where people aspire to higher levels of humanity - such as world peace, goodwill, friendship, equality to all.

[Ram]

Eagle, why do you write long posts? Not only your style is boring, you don't say anything meaningful. Are these your original thoughts? Or, it is all copy and paste? Do you do that purposely to look scholarly? Plus the way your organize your writing is very tiring to read. Take your fat head out of the sands of Saudi Arabia, and write simply so we can understand what you are saying.

[Eagle]

I know it's an excellent refutation of your apologetics. What sort of religion would encourage its adherents to commit violence and oppression? Have you ever thought why the Muslim world is so violent and hateful? Compare that to peaceful religions where people aspire to higher levels of humanity - such as world peace, goodwill, friendship, equality to all.

So how does any of your bitter rant constitute a refutation of my post?

[Ram]

Islam brooks preaching of other religions. It advocates freedom of religion. You asked "Muslim countries?" According to me, there are no Muslim countries.

There are no Muslim countries? Are you joking or being a moron? Why do you say such non-sense? Saudi Arabia is not a Muslim country? What about Pakistan? Will you go to any Muslim country, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia, for example, and say to them that they are not Muslim countries?